it occurred to me this evening that it would be more helpful for us to be able to stick to what is relevant to helping others cope and things we can all agree on at that, rather than thrusting a new world view on the confused person.
i'll be the first to admit that i've gotten too excited about my own perspective on this board at times, and although it might make for an interesting read to some people those extra things just doesn't help, atleast not necessarily.. in any case, it seems to me we can all agree that there are some basic "first things first" kind of things that are more important to address rather than even going into minute details.
now i don't know about everyone, but my guess is i'm not alone in that i'm not all that clear on what those might be because i am coming very much from my own perspective rather than one of helping others in the predicament of struggling with being a witness and such, as i am not focused on this anymore.
and things we can all agree on at thatsure. name one. hehe. ahehehehehehe.
That it's good to be alive, which to me is the same as being free. Hey, even if you say it's not good to be alive, you like the fact that you can say that right? You couldn't say that if you weren't alive!
this is a for real question, not just hypothetical.
some of you are aware that i am going through a very rough time.
i have been diagnosed with chronic major depression, probably from childhood.
You are the reason to live.
I don't mean this in a hypothetical sense either.
it occurred to me this evening that it would be more helpful for us to be able to stick to what is relevant to helping others cope and things we can all agree on at that, rather than thrusting a new world view on the confused person.
i'll be the first to admit that i've gotten too excited about my own perspective on this board at times, and although it might make for an interesting read to some people those extra things just doesn't help, atleast not necessarily.. in any case, it seems to me we can all agree that there are some basic "first things first" kind of things that are more important to address rather than even going into minute details.
now i don't know about everyone, but my guess is i'm not alone in that i'm not all that clear on what those might be because i am coming very much from my own perspective rather than one of helping others in the predicament of struggling with being a witness and such, as i am not focused on this anymore.
Well, of course I don't mean it in such a broad way, as I said what I had in mind was the intention to try to bring them some peace, and talking about just any old thing isn't 'relevant' or the most helpful thing to do toward this end, but there is a place for everything. It does depend on the individual of course, some people are way curious and that works to their advantage, because they'll start to really work at it and they're pretty much set then, but I was mainly concerned about others who haven't come to that point of open curiosity.
last week we enjoyed a thread where many discussed the pros and cons of dubdom and comments have been made that exjws can be overtaken with negativity, and that this board displays far too much malice towards the r&f.
a view is held that the r&f are really nice people and they are innocent of sins committed by the borg.
the argument goes that individuals, whether on the gb or publishers in a local congregation, are all victims of some organisational spirit.
I'm sure many are able to put the Borg in the distant past. If only we could! Unfortunately, there are many here who are closely connected still with the Borg, if involuntarily, because of family connection. The bizarre aspect is that you can put the borg behind you, only to find tit re-appearing because of factors beyond your control.In this respect, I can feel some affinity with those who've been victims or been abused within the Witness community.
Well Ozzie, I certainly don't suggest that you push away the experience - if you're connected you are connected, and in a broader sense we are all connected. Some people might cut off ties so they can move on, I think you can cope just as easily if you simply connect with others without limiting yourself. Even here there are so many who are willing to connect that I think it's a shame to dwell on the family that's in simply because you are blood relatives, to me there is the potential for a lot of close friendships here which can be as close if not closer than a family member. As far as I'm concerned, that openness is more important than what you have in common, because even someone who was never a witness can care about you deeply.
i am a very sweet 22 year old male living in texas.
for some reason, i can't seem to find a decent woman.
i don't know what i'm doing to turn them off.
Wo-Mart. (sorry, feeling goofy) Actually, I think what I can say about this is just try to focus on looking rather than the fact that you haven't found yet.
"Shop smart, shop S-Mart!" -Ash in Army of Darkness
i was thinking it must seem kind of strange for someone to hear me say belief is useless and to think less, that will likely mark me as nuts by both stereotypical camps so i thought i explain a bit.. first of all, let me say that as far as i'm concerned there is no reason to think that generally, belief, religious or otherwise can't be an honest attempt at describing reality.
however, that's the whole crux of the matter - i think it's important to distinguish between reality and one's description and model of it.
as accurate as some models may be it can never replace the real thing, certainly not when it's merely concepts in your head.. if you believe the bible, you would agree that creation reveals the glory of god.
Hi everyone. I was thinking it must seem kind of strange for someone to hear me say belief is useless and to think less, that will likely mark me as nuts by both stereotypical camps so I thought I explain a bit.
First of all, let me say that as far as I'm concerned there is no reason to think that generally, belief, religious or otherwise can't be an honest attempt at describing reality. However, that's the whole crux of the matter - I think it's important to distinguish between reality and one's description and model of it. As accurate as some models may be it can never replace the real thing, certainly not when it's merely concepts in your head.
If you believe the bible, you would agree that creation reveals the glory of God. Well, in Judeo-Christian language that's all about appreciating God's work isn't it? However, I think there is a serious danger of looking at the descriptions, even worshipping them, rather than the real thing. Look at it this way: You have this line of God creating.. well everything, and then humans being part of that creates beliefs. Even if you believe it's a revelation you have to acknowledge that the information gets passed through the filter that is the human mind, and in that process it would certainly get filtered a bit wouldn't it? And what are you doing worshipping a thought in your head anyways? What makes any of us better than the rest of God's creation? So I say enjoy the gift of life, that is what is actually closer to the source in this sequence of things. Don't even think too much about what I'm saying here, but just enjoy the abundant life that's around you and IS you. What objections can there be to that, and what better way can there be to get in touch with the sacred?
what is the most romantic thing.
got any womantic storwees?.
i'll tell you mine if u tell me yours!
i'm not sure what i think about your thoughts on caring more for the person than they care for you being romantic. i find that more tragic. perhaps it begs the question...what is romance. i guess romance could run the gauntlet of emotion.
Spaz, actually what I said was caring more for the other person than my own desire for them, but I can imagine that being in the face of their desire for me to be a romantic person. I guess where that comes from is my desire for them to know that ultimately they are not dependent on me, to want them to know they can stand on their own two feet.
I should note that this goes for everyone of course, if you care for everyone in this way it wouldn't be so tragic since you wouldn't be in relationship with all of them anyway. Despite what I've said here, though, there is always the question of whether it is a good match. It isn't that the romance (in the sense where everyone else view the word) isn't there, it's that it's secondary to you caring about the person. I guess where I'm coming from with this is that both thoughts and feelings can become an addiction, but that doesn't mean those aren't things we can enjoy without getting too caught up in them.
last week we enjoyed a thread where many discussed the pros and cons of dubdom and comments have been made that exjws can be overtaken with negativity, and that this board displays far too much malice towards the r&f.
a view is held that the r&f are really nice people and they are innocent of sins committed by the borg.
the argument goes that individuals, whether on the gb or publishers in a local congregation, are all victims of some organisational spirit.
Hi Ozzie, I almost didn't see your message in the other thread because it scrolled down.
I think you have a point. I wouldn't approach it quite that way or even use the word guilt myself, as that undoubtedly would trigger some knee jerk responses. But the fact of the matter is in any situation that we're involved in we are participants, even if we don't know any better.
One of the things I suggest to people is about fully accepting whatever arises, and certainly that starts with yourself, whether it's feelings, thoughts or whatever. I guess the key thing is you don't want to be in denial about anything negative, even if it reflects badly on you as a person. I think that to accept the "dark side" of yourself allows you to have more compassion for others. When you reject that part of yourself there is a tendancy to externalize it in some way, project it I suppose in psychological terms where you make some other your enemy. Obviously, this doesn't mean you act on those destructive tendancies, and I think that potential is also externalized in some way when you are in denial about what arises internally. This is what I was getting at with Mo in the other thread, it's a matter of shutting down - though I have to admit "dead heart" is rather harsh language and less than tactful.
Incidentally, I think I should explain again and probably make a note of this whenever I speak in terms of "over it" that it isn't that I'm claiming my past has no effect on the present or the future, but for one thing in my case there has been enough other factors that the present no longer resembles anything like what could have been affected by a JW past. And in more recent posts I tried to make the point that despite our past, we can choose not to believe those thoughts or act on those feelings even if they are still arising, the first step being to accept that they are there, and also what they in fact are so that we are aware of them. So even if the conditioning is there, you might say it can kind of burn itself out without us adding fuel to the fire. Even (and if) before that happens completely, I feel that it's important to point out that you already have freedom. Even if you are experiencing some dreaded feeling, often you will hear people acknowledge that they are aware that it's just the patterns from the past. In that recognition is where you can find your freedom, even if the feeling exists at the same time. That awareness that allows you to recognize that it's just conditioning from the past is what I want to speak to when I talk about this, because that is the intelligent being that we are, the rest is just stuff that happend. I think that's the best way I can put it.
it occurred to me this evening that it would be more helpful for us to be able to stick to what is relevant to helping others cope and things we can all agree on at that, rather than thrusting a new world view on the confused person.
i'll be the first to admit that i've gotten too excited about my own perspective on this board at times, and although it might make for an interesting read to some people those extra things just doesn't help, atleast not necessarily.. in any case, it seems to me we can all agree that there are some basic "first things first" kind of things that are more important to address rather than even going into minute details.
now i don't know about everyone, but my guess is i'm not alone in that i'm not all that clear on what those might be because i am coming very much from my own perspective rather than one of helping others in the predicament of struggling with being a witness and such, as i am not focused on this anymore.
..ng. It occurred to me this evening that it would be more helpful for us to be able to stick to what is relevant to helping others cope and things we can all agree on at that, rather than thrusting a new world view on the confused person. I'll be the first to admit that I've gotten too excited about my own perspective on this board at times, and although it might make for an interesting read to some people those extra things just doesn't help, atleast not necessarily.
In any case, it seems to me we can all agree that there are some basic "first things first" kind of things that are more important to address rather than even going into minute details. Now I don't know about everyone, but my guess is I'm not alone in that I'm not all that clear on what those might be because I am coming very much from my own perspective rather than one of helping others in the predicament of struggling with being a Witness and such, as I am not focused on this anymore. But I think if nothing else it would be good to atleast keep this intent and recognize when the person needs clarity rather than volumes of information. While some might cope with having their belief system demolished and just get upset and then continue the job on their own, others might be more timid and have a breakdown or something. My thing on this is in neither of those cases is the person brought to peace, whereas whether you're angry or afraid those are both states of being disturbed. While there is a place for that I guess basically what this comes down to might be a question of how you do it rather than what you do. I for one think I can do a little less thinking about what I want to post and maybe open up and try to get a sense of where the other person is at and simply meet them there first.
what is the most romantic thing.
got any womantic storwees?.
i'll tell you mine if u tell me yours!
Well, I'm a pretty weird guy so this will be completely different. I think the most romantic thing anyone can do is to care more for the other person than your own desire for them, or your desire for a relationship with them. Sometimes that takes the form of not doing something rather than doing it.
