Posts by dgp

I spent some time trying to remember whether I had met someone who would meet all these criteria. I'm not sure I have found anyone, though I can think of a few people who could probably be of this kind. So one point to consider would be whether the "church" abides by these principles, as a body, as opposed to whether the person preaching to you does the same.

Some time ago I met a person I now consider a manipulator. The organization this person works for attracts youth with sports and trades, and then "provides training for life" on issues that have nothing at all to do with sports and trades. The organization is supposed to be religious, but religion does not go beyond a token prayer sometimes; religion serves the purpose of giving credibility. The "principles" they are being taught are not religious at all. Perhaps they are even correct, but they are not religious.

This group would not be thought to be evangelizing anyone, but it is my impression that they would not meet several of the criteria above. Perhaps this is not just for religions, but for groups that "preach" an idea to others.

I could mention the example of Salesian priests and their shops. They attract (or used to) attract a high number of youth and children, who can learn trades with them. In my experience at that particular place - which may be different from anybody else's anywhere- cases of abuse were rare, though abuse did happen. On occasion, anyone studying there had to listen to a chat on something religious, but it was infrequent and no one was pushed to join anything. There were specific groups you could join if you were religious, but you could perfectly well study at several of their shops without joining any of the religious groups.

Maybe it was a matter of the people directly involved with that center at that time. But, overall, my impression is that they would meet these criteria. The other group wouldn't. I wonder if there should be a criterion about enticing -not coercing- people to participate.

34

I think people want to believe in an Armageddon

by dgp in

the end of the world (aka "this system of things") has been predicted to happen "soon" many times.

in my own lifetime, and not being a jw, i have been warned that the world would end like six times already.

harold camping predicted one end of the world twice only last year.

dgp

Perhaps different people have different reasons to believe in an Armageddon, such as child indoctrination, a feeling of not being appreciated, et cetera-. The idea is essentially one, but the reasons why we believe in it are different. And they are all powerful enough for us to prefer to deny the basic fact that all prophecies regarding the end of the world have been proven false.

34

Is Wikipedia turning pro-Watchtower?

by cedars in

i was doing some research and stumbled upon the following two wikipedia articles, both of which (at first glance) appear to be mostly pro-watchtower.. take a look for yourself.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/persecution_of_jehovah%27s_witnesses.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/jehovah%27s_witnesses%27_handling_of_child_sex_abuse.

the persecution article seemingly attempts to portray jws as unfairly persecuted.

dgp

JWFacts

34

I think people want to believe in an Armageddon

by dgp in

the end of the world (aka "this system of things") has been predicted to happen "soon" many times.

in my own lifetime, and not being a jw, i have been warned that the world would end like six times already.

harold camping predicted one end of the world twice only last year.

dgp

What I find "interesting" is the fact that even people who have not grown in cults stick to a belief in Armageddon. One would expect someone to stop and think something like "Hey, this is being announced since... ever!". But the many false prophecies do not seem to matter.

Take Harold Camping. He lied twice in the same year, and I bet there are still people who believe in what he said.

34

I think people want to believe in an Armageddon

by dgp in

the end of the world (aka "this system of things") has been predicted to happen "soon" many times.

in my own lifetime, and not being a jw, i have been warned that the world would end like six times already.

harold camping predicted one end of the world twice only last year.

dgp

The end of the world (aka "this system of things") has been predicted to happen "soon" many times. In my own lifetime, and not being a JW, I have been warned that the world would end like six times already. Harold Camping predicted one end of the world twice only last year. So you'd have to be very young not to have seen this prophecies come and go. Why, then, does the idea of Armageddon still has power?

I think that is because people fear a tragic and painful death in a catastrophe, and don't want to dismiss the possibility of it happening worldwide, at the same time.

Only a few can dismiss the coming of Armageddon on the basis of just how many doomsday prophecies have failed. And I do not mean just Jehovah's witnesses.

I think anyone preaching salvation and protection from the end of the world will always find willing ears.

What do you guys think?

35

Why you love America

by jamesmahon in

jw
friends

it struck me, as i guess it has a lot of people, that there are so many threads from both americans and the rest of us that seem to descend into america bashing.

i thought it might be quite nice to have a thread solely (and i mean solely - if this just turns negative i will call foul) on what we think is great about america.

as a brit who has lived and been over a number of times there are many parts about america that i think are great and thought is would be healthy to have a positive thread for a change.. so a starter for ten (with a few gross generalisations thrown in):.

dgp

It is always difficult for a Latin American not in the left to praise America. He who does it is seen as an Uncle Tom cabineer, as if there were nothing deserving praise. May my being a Latin American, sometimes very vocal in critizicing the United States, add to what I will say.

From among those who have posted so far, I would like to copy and paste the following:

King Solomon

Without doubt, the BEST thing about America, bar none, is our Constitution/Bill of Rights/Declaration of Independence, documents upon which all of our citizen's freedoms are based: freedom of speech, religion, assembly, right to peaceable protest, right to bear arms, separation of church and state, etc. While they're not necessarily unique documents, they were revolutionary at the time they were written by offering an alternative to other forms of government that inextricably combined religion with government.

Band on the Run

The most important part to me is the American character.

And I'm putting this together not just because they were posted, but because together they make sense.

Many countries in Latin America were modeled after the United States. The (wrong) idea was that it was just a matter of copying the federal system and laws for countries of very dissimilar origin to succeed just like the United States was succeeding. We all know that the results were always disappointing, to say the least. But, why?

People keep going to the United States because it's a country where you can get ahead if you have ideas and you are willing to work hard. I can't resist mentioning the astronaut, whose name escapes me now, who said he'd still be picking tomatoes if his family had chosen to stay in Mexico, as opposed to moving and working as agricultural workers in the United States, where their child became a self-made man. That was because they moved to live in a country where the right environment exists for people to improve their own lot.

People of similar descent moved to Argentina and made it the most succesful country in Latin America ever. But a different environment led to a very different result. It was not a matter of laws only, or a matter of people only, but a combination of the two.

I bet some of you have crossed "the line" that separates the US and Mexico. The difference is just overwhelming. Some of us see it with envy, some with anger, some blame exclusively the United States for our lot, but the contrast forces some of us to think about just why we don't live like that. And we come to the conclusion that it's the people and the system those people live in that explains it all. We can't be just the same, but we do have a model to follow and to criticize.

The spirit and the environment are what is greatest about America.

375

The Governing Body intends to announce significant changes in academic literature (DOCTRINES) - Brazil

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

dear randall.

good morning!.

here is the daniel of brazil (former bethel).. this week at the forum of former jehovah's witnesses had an interesting news!

dgp

My question would be whether doctrinal changes would be announced in Brazil first, not the US. Some posters on the Portuguese forum also said that, in any case, changes would take place gradually.

375

The Governing Body intends to announce significant changes in academic literature (DOCTRINES) - Brazil

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

dear randall.

good morning!.

here is the daniel of brazil (former bethel).. this week at the forum of former jehovah's witnesses had an interesting news!

dgp

My translation. I am adding the original Portuguese at the end, for anyone to check if necessary.

As some people said, "no campo doutrinal" does not mean "academic literature" but "in the realm or field of doctrine".

The Governing Body intends to announce significant doctrinal changes. In preparation for this, [the GC] organized a special Kingdom Ministry School, for the purpose of preparing elders to accept those changes themselves and helping others accept them, too. Such school will begin operations in February 2013, as per a letter to be sent to all elder bodies. This special Kingdom Ministry School will take a mere eight hours. Ministerial servants will not be allowed to participate. The last [such special school] took place in 2011. The importance of these changes is evident from the fact that the School was scheduled for as soon as 2013. I'll be posting more information on this shortly.

Portuguese

O Corpo Governante pretende anunciar mudanças significativas no campo doutrinal. Em preparação para isso, providenciou uma Escola do Ministério do Reino especial que preparará os anciãos para aceitarem e ajudarem outros a aceitar as mudanças. Em fevereiro do ano de 2013, conforme carta que será enviada a todos os corpos de anciãos, a tal escola começará a funcionar. Terá a duração de apenas oito horas. Dessa vez, os Servos Ministeriais não poderão participar. A EMR costuma ser realizada em intervalos de quatro anos. A última foi em 2011. A importância das mudanças é evidente pelo estabelecimento apressado dessa escola para o ano de 2013. Em breve postarei mais informações a respeito.