peacedog

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Posts by peacedog

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  24

  Major flaw in the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine

  by peacedog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  one of the major flaws (i say one because there are many) in the society's '1914-gentile times' doctrine is an oft-overlooked one.

  very simply, the watchtower society predicted the end of the "gentile times" for autumn of 1914; yet the first world war began in the summer of 1914 (july 28) and really was triggered in june of 1914 with the assassination of archduke ferdinand.

  as such, the first world war actually lends no support whatsoever to the watchtower society's 1914-gentile times doctrine despite the fact that the society has continuously offered it as support.. rutherford was very aware of this major discrepancy in the doctrine.

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  peacedog

  Essan, I believe the Society claims the Gentile Times ended at or very close to October 1, 1914.
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  24

  Major flaw in the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine

  by peacedog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  one of the major flaws (i say one because there are many) in the society's '1914-gentile times' doctrine is an oft-overlooked one.

  very simply, the watchtower society predicted the end of the "gentile times" for autumn of 1914; yet the first world war began in the summer of 1914 (july 28) and really was triggered in june of 1914 with the assassination of archduke ferdinand.

  as such, the first world war actually lends no support whatsoever to the watchtower society's 1914-gentile times doctrine despite the fact that the society has continuously offered it as support.. rutherford was very aware of this major discrepancy in the doctrine.

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  peacedog

  blondie:

  Well, then, peacedog, you should be able to find statements by Russell that do not line up with Rutherford's showing that was not the thinking before 1914 or even up to 1916 when Russell died.

  Yes, for sure, you are right. But since the Society changed the end date back to Russell's original end date anyway, I'm not sure the point is germane.

  Thanks for the links.
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  24

  Major flaw in the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine

  by peacedog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  one of the major flaws (i say one because there are many) in the society's '1914-gentile times' doctrine is an oft-overlooked one.

  very simply, the watchtower society predicted the end of the "gentile times" for autumn of 1914; yet the first world war began in the summer of 1914 (july 28) and really was triggered in june of 1914 with the assassination of archduke ferdinand.

  as such, the first world war actually lends no support whatsoever to the watchtower society's 1914-gentile times doctrine despite the fact that the society has continuously offered it as support.. rutherford was very aware of this major discrepancy in the doctrine.

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  peacedog

  Blondie:

  Russell died during the First World War, which he (and the Society) expected to escalate into Armageddon. So this wasn't a problem for Russell and didn't become a problem for the WTS until after the end of WWI. Hence Rutherford, in 1922, deceitfully changing the end of the Gentile Times to line up with the start of the war.

  possible-san:

  Of course it does not matter for die-hard JWs. Sadly, nothing does. Also, thanks for posting the QFR.

  The QFR is nonsense, of course. The Society is faced with a huge problem, and the '72 QFR is an attempt to circumvent it. Rutherford attempted to circumvent the problem by changing the end date for the Gentile Times.

  There are two important points in all of this, imo, and neither is changed by the '72 QFR.

  First, the start of WWI has NOTHING to do with the ride of the "fiery-colored" horse. The Society establishes this fact in the '86 WT when they say that the horsemen could not have started their "ride" until AFTER October, 1914.

  So here's the question for JWs: How did the fiery-colored horse 'take peace away from the earth' (which Revelation said he would) when the earth was already embroiled in a WORLD war?

  Second (and perhaps most important), the WTS has outright lied to keep up the pretense that the outbreak of WWI was a result of the end of the Gentile Times in autumn, 1914:

  Well, after the end of the Gentile Times in 1914 man’s rule brought on two world wars and an era of violence surpassing even that of Noah’s days before the flood. --WT 10/15/1968 p.627

  I've said before and will no doubt say again: All doctrine aside, the Watchtower Society is a LIAR ORGANIZATION. This fact alone conclusively proves they do NOT have "the truth", they are NOT the "true religion", and they CANNOT possibly be "God's organization".
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  24

  Major flaw in the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine

  by peacedog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  one of the major flaws (i say one because there are many) in the society's '1914-gentile times' doctrine is an oft-overlooked one.

  very simply, the watchtower society predicted the end of the "gentile times" for autumn of 1914; yet the first world war began in the summer of 1914 (july 28) and really was triggered in june of 1914 with the assassination of archduke ferdinand.

  as such, the first world war actually lends no support whatsoever to the watchtower society's 1914-gentile times doctrine despite the fact that the society has continuously offered it as support.. rutherford was very aware of this major discrepancy in the doctrine.

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• 

  peacedog

  One of the major flaws (I say one because there are many) in the Society's '1914-Gentile Times' doctrine is an oft-overlooked one. Very simply, the Watchtower Society predicted the end of the "Gentile Times" for autumn of 1914; yet the First World War began in the summer of 1914 (July 28) and really was triggered in June of 1914 with the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand. As such, the First World War actually lends no support whatsoever to the Watchtower Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine despite the fact that the Society has continuously offered it as support.

  Rutherford was very aware of this major discrepancy in the doctrine. In fact, he went so far as to change the end date of the Gentile Times to match up with the start of World War I. Russell had predicted the end of the Gentile Times for the autumn (October) of 1914; Rutherford simply changed the date to August 1, 1914 (the date he considered the First World War to have begun):

  ...the "times of the gentiles" expired just 2,520 years later, 1913 years and seven months after the Christian era had begun, or, in other words, August 1, 1914. All know that that day marks the outbreak of the World War, the time when our Lord served notice on Satan that his lease had expired. --WT 4/15/1922 p.126

  August 1, 1914, marked the end of the gentile times. It also marked the legal ending of the old world. There the ouster proceedings began, when he whose right it is took unto himself his power. --WT 1/1/1923 p.3

  The Society continued to claim August 1, 1914 as the end of the Gentile Times for several years before deftly switching back to the original (and current) claim of autumn, 1914.

  Despite switching back to autumn 1914 for the ending of the Gentile Times, the Society still couches their words (or they flat out lie) in an effort to lead the reader to the conclusion that the First World War began after (and resultant of) the ending of the Gentile Times. Consider:

  The history books are there in the libraries to give us the details about World Wars I and II! Indeed, war of world proportions erupted at the end of the Gentile Times in 1914. --WT 5/15/1983 p.23

  "At the end of the Gentile Times"? Sorry, Watchtower Society, but World War I erupted *BEFORE* the end of the Gentile Times, not *AT* the end of the Gentile Times.

  Since the order of events that he set out back there shortly before his death lines up with the order of events that he depicts at Revelation chapter 6, it indicates that what that 6th chapter envisions shows that the end of the Gentile Times in 1914 and the outbreak of war on a world scale marked the start of his “presence” in his heavenly Kingdom and the beginning of “the conclusion of the system of things.” --WT 5/15/1983 p.23

  The Society says "the Gentile Times in 1914 and the outbreak of war on a world scale marked the start of his 'presence'". How is that possible when the "outbreak of war on a world scale" began *BEFORE* his "presence"?

  The Kingdom ambassadors were proclaiming that the Gentile Times had ended in 1914 and that the outbreak of World War I with all the horrible things accompanying it was the foretold proof that those “appointed times of the nations” had ended then. --WT 11/1/1964 p.652

  "The outbreak of World War I...was the foretold proof" that the Gentile Times HAD (past tense) ended? How could that be, when the outbreak of World War I occurred *BEFORE* the end of the Gentile Times?

  Well, after the end of the Gentile Times in 1914 man’s rule brought on two world wars and an era of violence surpassing even that of Noah’s days before the flood. --WT 10/15/1968 p.627

  The Society says that "after the end of the Gentile Times...man's rule brought on two world wars". After?? How so?? World War I started *BEFORE* the end of the Gentile Times, not "after".

  So it was not accidental that World War I erupted upon a peaceful world, to mark the end of those “seven times” in the lunar month of Tishri in 1914 C.E. --WT 3/1/1980 p.16

  The society says "World War I erupted...to mark the end of those [Gentile Times]". Except that it didn't. Because World War I erupted *BEFORE* the end of those Gentile Times.

  Actually, the Society unwittingly exposed the gaping hole in their own doctrine in just a few short paragraphs in the January 1, 1986 Watchtower magazine (page 6):

  So the ride on the white horse was to begin at some future time when Jesus Christ would be enthroned as the heavenly King of God’s Kingdom. At that time God would send him forth with the command: “Go subduing in the midst of your enemies.” (Psalm 110:2) But when does this take place?

  The crowning of Jesus Christ as heavenly King is described at Psalm 45:3-7. Then in Hebrews 1:8, 9 the apostle Paul quotes from this psalm and applies verses 6 and 7 to the Son of God, Jesus Christ. Detailed information and Scriptural proofs published by Jehovah’s Witnesses show that the coronation of Jesus Christ in heaven took place at the close of the Gentile Times, “the appointed times of the nations,” in the year 1914.—Luke 21:24.

  Hence, any interpretation that puts the horsemen’s ride earlier than the year 1914 could not be correct. Also, since the rider of the white horse was in the lead, the other horses and riders following would represent events that would take place along with, or some time after, his ride begins. The ride of these four horsemen, therefore, must occur from and after the beginning of “the time of the end” in 1914. It has been since then that “the last days” have been seen to be in evidence.—Daniel 12:4; 2 Timothy 3:1-5, 13.

  The Other Horses and Riders

  The second horse is “bright red,” or “fiery-colored.” (Revelation 6:3, 4, An American Translation) Its rider “was granted to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another.” He was given “a great sword.” This proved true when 1914 saw the beginning of the worst war in all human history, the first global war. Back then it was called the Great War.

  These paragraphs clearly demonstrate the problem with the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine. To summarize these paragraphs:

  1) The ride of the "white horse" would begin "when Jesus Christ would be enthroned as the heavenly King...at the close of the Gentile Times", which the Society says was autumn of 1914.

  2) Any interpretation that puts the white horse's ride earlier than autumn 1914 could not be correct.

  3) Since the white horse was in the lead, the ride of the other horsemen would follow and therefore could not take place before autumn, 1914.

  4) The "fiery-colored" horse (who could not ride prior to autumn, 1914) is blamed for World War I (which began in summer, 1914).

  Despite clearly stating that the "fiery-colored" horse could not ride prior to the end of the Gentile Times in autumn, 1914, the Society attributes World War I (an event which began in summer, 1914) to the ride of the "fiery-colored" horse. And therein lies the problem.
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  113

  One Reason Why I Speak About Racism

  by snowbird in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  http://www.eric.ed.gov/ericwebportal/search/detailmini.jsp?_nfpb=true&_&ericextsearch_searchvalue_0=ed018874&ericextsearch_searchtype_0=no&accno=ed018874.

  if anyone cares or dares to read this, this is how it was when i was 13 years of age.. the gap in funding for black and white kids' education is still stunning to me 46 years later, but it's there in black and white.. it's a testament to our determination and fortitude that we acquired an education at all.. this, in the richest country on the planet!.

  for your edification and, hopefully, understanding.. syl.

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  peacedog

  here's the news article:

  Federal affirmative action policy faces review

  The federal government has ordered a review of its affirmative action policy one day after a woman complained that she couldn't apply for a public service position because she's Caucasian.

  Sara Landriault of Kemptville, Ont., told the media Wednesday that she applied online for an administrative assistant job with Citizenship and Immigration Canada, and was asked by the online application if she was white, aboriginal or a visible minority. When she answered white, she said a message informed her she did not meet the criteria and could no longer proceed.

  Treasury Board President Stockwell Day said no Canadian should be barred from a federal job because of race or ethnicity.

  "While we support diversity in the public service, we want to ensure that no Canadian is barred from opportunities in the public service based on race or ethnicity," Day said in a statement.

  Immigration Minister Jason Kenney, who was also involved in the decision to review the government's hiring practices, which give priority to qualified applicants from minority groups, said everyone should be considered for federal jobs.

  "We are in favour of appropriate diversity in the public service and reasonable efforts to achieve it, but we don't think any Canadians should be excluded from applying within their government," he told CBC News. "It's OK to encourage people from different backgrounds to apply but in our judgment it goes too far to tell people that if they are not of a particular race or ethnicity they cannot apply [for a job] that is actually funded by their tax dollars."

  But he said the review wouldn't affect any particular cases, including Landriault's.

  Landriault, who is the founder of the International Family Childcare Association and has a picture of herself with Prime Minister Stephen Harper on the association's website, said that no one from the government has contacted her since she went public with her story.

  The government's latest figures show more women, aboriginal people and visible minorities worked in the public service in 2009 than the year before. The number of people with disabilities stayed the same in the same periods.

  As of March 2009, women made up 54.7 per cent of the federal workforce, aboriginal people made up 4.5 per cent, people with disabilities made up 5.9 per cent and visible minorities made up 9.8 per cent.
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  113

  One Reason Why I Speak About Racism

  by snowbird in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  http://www.eric.ed.gov/ericwebportal/search/detailmini.jsp?_nfpb=true&_&ericextsearch_searchvalue_0=ed018874&ericextsearch_searchtype_0=no&accno=ed018874.

  if anyone cares or dares to read this, this is how it was when i was 13 years of age.. the gap in funding for black and white kids' education is still stunning to me 46 years later, but it's there in black and white.. it's a testament to our determination and fortitude that we acquired an education at all.. this, in the richest country on the planet!.

  for your edification and, hopefully, understanding.. syl.

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  peacedog

  Wing Commander, I couldn't agree more with your comments about affirmative action.

  Affirmative action is something of a hot topic in Canada right now, as last month a woman here was told she couldn't apply for a job because her skin is white.

  The federal government claims that Canada's affirmative action policy is now under review, but I'm not holding my breath for change.

  Here's a link to the news story:

  http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/07/22/affirmative-action-review.html
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  16

  Have you ever heard JWs say, "our ministry isn't about making converts", or similar? Would you consider that line of thought accurate?

  by miseryloveselders in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this past tuesday night, there was a part on the service meeting entitled, "highlight the practicle value of the good news.

  " the brother initiated the part by asking, "what do people mistakenly think our reason is for knocking at their door?

  " there were several comments given.

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  peacedog

  I agree cult classic.

  The dubs think they are looking for converts (for lack of a better word), and so they're being dishonest when they say they're not..

  But I don't believe that making converts is the Society's purpose in requiring the rank and file to go knocking on doors. It's about keeping them busy, making them feel "special", and alienating them from the rest of society...
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  17

  I find it curious that these two look so much alike.... hehe

  by AK - Jeff in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

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  peacedog

  Impossible-san:

  You merely placed two photos without explanation.

  read the subject line.
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  17

  I find it curious that these two look so much alike.... hehe

  by AK - Jeff in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

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  peacedog

  I always thought Freddie Franz could have played Grand Moff Tarkin.

  
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  14

  What would it take for you to stop being a Jehovah's Witness?

  by new light in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i would like to present this question to my believing family, one by one.

  it seems to me to be a powerful thought.

  provoker.

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  peacedog

  Good question. Thinking of my jw family, I honestly don't think there's a single thing.

  False prophecy? Nope. Attributing their false prophecy to God? Nope. Reissuing publications with their failed predictions removed? Nope. Doctrinal changes? Nope. New light™ that is actually Old Light? Nope. Outright lies printed in the publications? Nope. Requiring death rather than accepting a blood transfusion despite the fact that the bible only mentions *eating* blood? Nope.

  The wts is a CULT and jws are BRAINWASHED. Really, the Society can do and require anything, and the dubbies are gonna eat it up and ask for more.