Diogenesister

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Posts by Diogenesister

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  16

  Did Jesus say the God of the OT is not the same God as mine??

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  bart erhman states, in this you tube short presumably taken from the video series he has been doing with megan lewis*, that jesus said the god of the ot, the god of jeremiah, is not the (same)god as jesus.

  bart continues "jeremiah's god killed (the children) - jesus said let the children come to me.

  jesus' god said turn the other cheek" - the ot god was war-like etc (paraphrasing bart here a bit).. it's always been the thing that stopped my fully embracing the bible after leaving watchtower.

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  Diogenesister

  • Bart's views could not be further from orthodoxy. Always have been. Unless you go way back to his youth.

    Yes my little dig didn't make it clear he finds evidence sufficient for a 'historical Jesus' in the sense of one - or many - historical apocalyptic first century prophets with a very common first name.. Hardly enough for any believing Christian*.

    *But then how is that, in any real sense, being a historicist?? I'm sure that many historians who wouldn't claim to believe in a "historical Jesus' similarly wouldn't deny for a minute that there were loads of first century apocalyptic prophet's with the (very common) first name Joshua? I'm confused.....I don't understand why this gulf between academics of the two camps. There doesn't seem (to me) to be any real difference.

    Link Dislike Like
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  12

  Wimbledon's attitude to Russian/Belorussian players ...

  by LoveUniHateExams in

  1. social
  2. current

  ... is absolutely ridiculous.. last year, 2022, russian and belorussian tennis players were banned from wimbledon.

  let that just sink in.

  if you were a pro tennis player, and happened to be a russian or belorussian citizen, the all england club decided that you could not compete at their annual grass tournament.. let's explore that particular brand of discrimination and lunacy further.

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  Diogenesister

  The west's treatment of private citizens from regimes they don't like is hypocritical and childish.

  Wimbledon crowd boo (Byleuruss player) Victoria Azarenka off court after defeat to Ukraine’s Elina Svitolina

  Azarenka blamed ‘drunk’ fans who had ‘a lot of Pimms’ after she was booed off court at Wimbledon

  🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️
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  42

  How do you feel about Brexit?

  by SydBarrett in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the "independent scotland" thread got me thinking on this.

  there are a lot of brits on this board.

  what are your thoughts on brexit?

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  Diogenesister

  Just as a FYi, I was taught by my law professor that European HR legislation is largely based on British case law and that our Courts may not compromise British law in any way if it conflicts with ECHR (following taken from Supreme Court):-

  "If it is not possible to interpret legislation compatibly with the Convention, the courts can issue a "declaration of incompatibility" – which sends a clear steer to legislators that they should change the law to make it Convention-compliant. No UK court, including the Supreme Court, has the power to "strike down" legislation if it is incompatible with the European Convention on Human Rights.

  The Human Rights Act also requires UK courts, including the Supreme Court, to "take account" of decisions of the European Court of Human Rights (which sits in Strasbourg). UK courts are not required, however, always to follow the decisions of that Court. Indeed, they can decline to do so, particularly if they consider that the Strasbourg Court has not sufficiently appreciated or accommodated particular aspects of our domestic constitutional position.

  The European Convention on Human Rights and the European Court of Human Rights exist separately from the European Union. The Supreme Court's relationship with the Strasbourg Court is not, therefore, changed by the UK's exit from the European Union."
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  16

  Did Jesus say the God of the OT is not the same God as mine??

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  bart erhman states, in this you tube short presumably taken from the video series he has been doing with megan lewis*, that jesus said the god of the ot, the god of jeremiah, is not the (same)god as jesus.

  bart continues "jeremiah's god killed (the children) - jesus said let the children come to me.

  jesus' god said turn the other cheek" - the ot god was war-like etc (paraphrasing bart here a bit).. it's always been the thing that stopped my fully embracing the bible after leaving watchtower.

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  Diogenesister

  Diogenesister, Bart now says that Jesus never considered himself to be God (nor even the Son of Man of heaven). Bart says that the original disciples of Jesus never considered Jesus to be God either.

  Disillusioned JW I think Bart will become more and more divorced from orthodox Christian beliefs.... the closer he gets to retirement!!!
  
  
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  36

  Treatment of Those Trying For Reinstatement

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  what happens when a jehovah’s witness who has been disfellowshipped returns to attending the meetings again?.

  mark jones writes:.

  if it's the same congregation that they previously attended then, yes, the congregation will remember who they are and so continue to treat them as dead or invisible.. one of the identifying marks a cult is that it uses shame and humiliation to control members, to keep them from leaving and manipulating those who escaped into coming back.. a disfellowshipped person is never allowed to quietly leave with dignity.

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  Diogenesister

  Stan-y a df really wants to get back in..move to a new area..wait for a door knocker..show interest..have bible study for a few weeks then attend meetings as an interested person.

  Well....in theory you could do that and just give a slightly different name (change middle name and year of birth, say)

  After all they don't ask for iD :)
  
  
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  12

  Wimbledon's attitude to Russian/Belorussian players ...

  by LoveUniHateExams in

  1. social
  2. current

  ... is absolutely ridiculous.. last year, 2022, russian and belorussian tennis players were banned from wimbledon.

  let that just sink in.

  if you were a pro tennis player, and happened to be a russian or belorussian citizen, the all england club decided that you could not compete at their annual grass tournament.. let's explore that particular brand of discrimination and lunacy further.

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  Diogenesister

  I agree LUHE I was disgusted that the AEC made that appalling decision last year.🤦🏻‍♀️ Actually I was vaguely ashamed 😝Particularly as players enter on their own behalf...we don't say "America won Wimbledon" we say "Serena Williams won Wimbledon" for heaven's sakes.

  On the one hand they demonise Putin as this evil dictator, yet penalize ordinary Russians for what he supposedly is solely responsible for (with his oligarchs).
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  16

  Did Jesus say the God of the OT is not the same God as mine??

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  bart erhman states, in this you tube short presumably taken from the video series he has been doing with megan lewis*, that jesus said the god of the ot, the god of jeremiah, is not the (same)god as jesus.

  bart continues "jeremiah's god killed (the children) - jesus said let the children come to me.

  jesus' god said turn the other cheek" - the ot god was war-like etc (paraphrasing bart here a bit).. it's always been the thing that stopped my fully embracing the bible after leaving watchtower.

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  Diogenesister

  Thank you all for your replies.

  What do you think of Bart stating this, though? I just can't think why he said it (although clearly the two are very different).
• 
  16

  Did Jesus say the God of the OT is not the same God as mine??

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  bart erhman states, in this you tube short presumably taken from the video series he has been doing with megan lewis*, that jesus said the god of the ot, the god of jeremiah, is not the (same)god as jesus.

  bart continues "jeremiah's god killed (the children) - jesus said let the children come to me.

  jesus' god said turn the other cheek" - the ot god was war-like etc (paraphrasing bart here a bit).. it's always been the thing that stopped my fully embracing the bible after leaving watchtower.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Diogenesister

  Bart Erhman states, in this You Tube short presumably taken from the video series he has been doing with Megan Lewis*, that Jesus said the God of the OT, the God of Jeremiah, is not the (same)God as Jesus. Bart continues "Jeremiah's God killed (the children) - Jesus said let the children come to me. Jesus' God said turn the other cheek" - the OT God was war-like etc (paraphrasing Bart here a bit).

  It's always been the thing that stopped my fully embracing the Bible after leaving Watchtower. I think it's true of many...who can help but love Jesus? But the OG of the OT?? Without the concept of "who can know his ways" etc etc, there's no defence of so much cruelty he dishes out. Erhman is correct, he couldn't be more different than Jesus. Unless I'm going nuts I don't remember Jesus saying this?! Did he say it somewhere else??

  https://youtube.com/shorts/x0mvLO6pDgo?feature=share
  

  *(B.Phil, M.A. Assyriology & Near Eastern Studies) Megan runs the channel Digital Hammurabi with Dr. Josh Bowen.
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  103

  I'm now turned off by this site

  by purrpurr in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in one form or another i've been a member of this site for almost 10 years.

  in the past this was a great place for debate, news and support for ex jws.

  i logged on several times a day and posted several times a week.

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  Diogenesister

  So thats where ExBethelitePIMA ran off too.....

  😂😂🤣Oh Syd you are awful....but I like you!(heaves bosom)
  
  
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  11530

  It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

  by Newly Enlightened in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  original reddit post (removed).

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  Diogenesister

  JM His reaction to events in the JW world lately has been very lacklustre, and that's in part because he's lost the contacts he used to have and also, as others have noted, he's clearly lost interest and is just going through the motions now despite his claims that this is his livelihood and he is committed to his "work".

  Loss of contacts is a major problem for him for sure.

  However there have been some pretty major breakthrough's recently for activists in various countries - such as Norway - and JW interest stories like the Vardy documentary. There's also a big protest planned for WBTS of Pennsylvania for the first time. Tied in with the huge story there regarding the Grand Jury investigation & Martin Haughs subpoena to testify, together with other witness elders.

  But your'll hear none of this from Cedars because for years he's refused to cover stories if they are in any way connected with an EXJW he has an issue with.

  Or in fact even if he doesn't have beef with anyone, but is just butt hurt that HE hasn't been invited to play the starring role in whatever is happening. Especially if there's any press coverage.

  He really is that petty and perfectly willing to damage his channel - and career - than give a moment's air time to his own personal "book bag of deplorables"!