Posts by cofty

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

You asked what impact scientific discoveries on the origin of life would have on believers and how they would respond. The question assumes that scientific discoveries impact philosophical or theological questions. - SBF

Science has impacted on theological questions again and again and will continue to do so.

It is just incredible that anybody would doubt it. How many examples can you think of? Stop being so obtuse.

on this small blue dot there is a fella who has the origin of life all figured out - EQV

Once again theists resort to lying about the position of those who don't share their superstitions rather than address the actual question.

I have said repeatedly that origin-of-life science is about hypotheses. Evolution is a fact. No explanation of abiogenesis has yet reached that status.

My question is about what effect - if any - it will have on theism when science proves that life emerges from geochemistry without any intelligent agency.

It is an interesting question. It's fascinating to see how many ways there are to avoid it.

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

How evolution explains the search of meaning in the human mind? - John Mann

It's a good question but this thread is about origin of life.

Edited to add - Thank you Viv for having the patience to explain that to SBF. I lacked the energy and motivation so I resorted to fuck off instead.

27

Directed panspermia - a plausible theory of intelligent design?

by EdenOne in

i have just read an interesting article by astrobiologist jacob haq-misra.. in this article he describes a process called "directed panspermia" as a plausible way that one form of intelligent design - one not related with religious driven agendas involving theism - could be involved in the process by which life developed on earth and possibly in other planets as well.. sounds like a speculation that's worth entertaining.

your thoughts?.

cofty

Directed Panspermia is a non-answer.

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

This isn't a "different level of interpretation," (a different focus, or scale), like saying the river is cold and the river is blue. It's like saying the river is blue and the river is red - A Ha

To all intelligent rational people this is a knock-down argument.

To purveyors of postmodernism it isn't.

SBF has argued that in regards to the shape of planet earth that the perspective of a worm - that the earth is flat (not seems flat, is flat) is just as valid as that of an astronaut.

I foolishly made the assertion that the planet earth is not flat only to be told "it depends what you mean by "the", it depends what you mean by "earth", it depends what you mean by "is", it depends what you mean by "not", it depends what you mean by "flat".

Remember too that god does not exist therefore he exists is also a valid argument in SBF's world.

You are dealing with a level of obscurantism and dishonesty that it hard to comprehend. If there were two people destroying threads in the way SBF does I would leave the forum tomorrow.

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

I get the feeling that you got beat black and blue as a Christian in your online discussions after you left - Ruby

I never participated in any online discussions as a Christian.

I worked out for myself that theism was in error and left just as I did as a JW.

You could not be more wrong.

I think its a real shame that you didn't meet nice people lke slimbyfat

I have utter unmitigated contempt for SBF's postmodern pseudo-intellectual bullshit and dishonesty. How would meeting him have helped me exactly? I didn't need his help and still don't.

You make a lot of assumptions.

I think there is a nice guy who collects ancient coins in his spare time trying to come out

That is arrogant and condescending.

Apart from my contempt for SBF my interactions with believers in this thread has been nothing but respectful.

34

Do you have / admire Charisma?

by The Rebel in

jw
friends

"charisma is a certain quality of an individual personality by virtue of which the person is set apart from ordinary people and treated as exceptional".

as a kid i was afraid of such charisma, as it was usually the quality i noticed elders, head masters, and parents had to exercise with unloving authority over me.. but now i think about it "charisma" doesn't need be only for people with authority.

" charisma" is something even we can have?

cofty

You haven't read the thread. - FHN

Yes I have. I nearly choked on my tea when I read the following..

I have been told that I have charisma. I don't tend to see it until I see video of myself. - FHN

Rebel is inventing his own unique self-serving definition of charisma.

"what makes this person exceptional? Well this person never takes the bait, never gets into the religious and political arguments..."

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

SBF - My position throughout this thread has been entirely consistent.

Some scientific discoveries have theological implications. Darwin's hypothesis about the origin of species was of great significance to theists 150 years ago. In time the majority were able to reconcile evolution with faith. A minority continue to resist despite the overwhelming evidence that has accumulated over the past century and a half.

Recent progress in origin-of-life science also has serious theological implications. I have opened a perfectly reasonable and respectful conversation about that.

If/when science can demonstrate that life begins without any intervention through entirely naturalistic means it will not prove anything about whether or not god exists. I have never said otherwise. However it will require a significant adjustment to christian doctrine.

You continue to misrepresent the conversation and derail it with your usual pseudo intellectual postmodern bullshit. Your first intervention on page 1 was outrageously stupid. You are now trying to pretend that you said something different and dishonestly twist my words.

If in future I appear to be ignoring you that will be because I am.

Vidqun - I am surprised by your answer. Regarding the possibility of scientists showing how life began naturally you said "nothing is impossible ... I am not sure man is going to be allowed to go all the way ... So yes, it's not impossible".

As a former christian that seems to contradict christian belief. Genesis describes the creation of Adam from the dust of the earth and then god breathed life into him. Life is generally viewed as an animating force that originates uniquely with god.

This view would make it impossible for life to arise in a lab. The challenge is not just technical but metaphysical. But you seem to see it only as a technical challenge.

I'm puzzled by that. Do you care to explain further?

24

To all former Elders – what are your thoughts

by Tallon in

if you were part of a judicial committee, and knowing what you know now, what was it like for you to sit on jc’s?

how did you feel if someone was reproved or df’d?

were you ever on a jc and you disagreed with someone being reproved or df’d and were overruled – how did you feel?

cofty

Only one. He was a piece of shit sexual predator. No regrets.

On another occasion a middle-age sister was caught shoplifting. She had so many emotional and family issues. The elders wanted to form a JC. After a contentious elder's meeting I finally persuaded them to allow myself and another elder to meet with her to offer support instead. I was very proud of that moment.

405

Origin of Life

by cofty in

in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

cofty

The original posts discusses the idea that future scientific discoveries about the origin of life may eliminate the need for God

No it doesn't.

It poses the question of how theism would deal with a purely naturalistic answer to the origin of life. Most theists have already learned to accommodate the fact of evolution. Would they adjust to abiogenesis so readily?

Now please shut up with your po-mo bullshit.

34

Do you have / admire Charisma?

by The Rebel in

jw
friends

"charisma is a certain quality of an individual personality by virtue of which the person is set apart from ordinary people and treated as exceptional".

as a kid i was afraid of such charisma, as it was usually the quality i noticed elders, head masters, and parents had to exercise with unloving authority over me.. but now i think about it "charisma" doesn't need be only for people with authority.

" charisma" is something even we can have?

cofty

This whole thread sounds very self-indulgent.