the basic 5 points of calvinism.
1. total depravity- all men are sinners.
we are totally corrupt and wicked.
LOL @ czar.
Yes, swedish chef, I DID SAY THAT! I also said
I don't mind you knocking others beliefs per se, just your smug self centered spoutng that you are the one that is right, while others that don't toe your party line are automatically wrong. Whether your a jw or not, go count your time where it is appreciatedTrying not to be hypocritical. It's not the bashing I mind so much, Just your superior, smug posts that you are right.
jesus dying for our sins... um, why.. because adam made a mistake?
based upon what?
jehovah's rules?
Donkey, I did'nt respond cuz I agree wholeheartedly. As a matter of fact I want to thank you for putting it so well, I called my mom & read it to her this A.M. She loved it. Thanks
the basic 5 points of calvinism.
1. total depravity- all men are sinners.
we are totally corrupt and wicked.
Swedish chef, you really make me sick by your blind recommendation of your personal beliefs & bashing of others. I don't mind you knocking others beliefs per se, just your smug self centered spoutng that you are the one that is right, while others that don't toe your party line are automatically wrong. Whether your a jw or not, go count your time where it is appreciated
Edited by - avishai on 8 December 2002 21:9:34
the thoughts in this post are generated from work done by by carl sagan.
although i am not quoting him the core ideas and logic were his and i am recalling them from memory.. let's start with murder.
we cannot be convicted for murdering a chimpanzee even though the chimpanzee has a dna matching 99.6% of ours.
There is a story called "Jerry was a man" by Robert Heinlein that addresses exactly this question.
my mother still believes.
she's made me mad enough that i want to disprove her religion, remorselessly and without fear.
i want to write a pamphlet, a long long letter, starting from every crack and cranny of russell's pyramidology to... well, basically i want to say jehovah's witnesses are wrong and here is why!.
Czar, I did succeed over a very long period of time. Like U.R said, it's a slow process, one small point at a time. Also I find the Socratic method very helpful, quesioning them calmly about ther beliefs until they trip themselves up.
As per Guest77s remark, try this one. You can lead a horticulture but you can't make her think!
jesus dying for our sins... um, why.. because adam made a mistake?
based upon what?
jehovah's rules?
But I sense a great deal of contempt in this forum, so I will shut up now, having said my piece..
I have no problem w/ your post as it was'nt more of the same so-called "christian" I am better than you because I have the truth & I am right & you are going to hell & suffer horribly forever because you diagree b.s.. Your speculation is'nt held in contempt by me in the least.
jesus dying for our sins... um, why.. because adam made a mistake?
based upon what?
jehovah's rules?
God... blood thirsty? I don't think so! As said before, we all deserve Hell. God is sovereign He can do whatever He pleases. (Ps. 115:3) They deserve Hell anyways, right?
Well, just letting you know and I hope you believe it, because if you don't- you are denying your creator. The Mighty God. The eternal Father. And if you haven't truly repented of your sins, turned to follow Christ with your whole heart, then His wrath sure will be satisfied with you...
2. Unconditional Election- Because men are such sinners, we cannot choose God. Therefore, God must choose us, not on anything good we have done. (Because we do NO good) God did not look ahead and choose us based on any good works. He did it based on His will. He predestined His elect to salvation before the foundation of the world.
5. Perseverence of the Saints- True Believers cannot lose their salvation. If God did choose you, then He cannot "un-choose" you. If you did "fall away from the faith" then you were never really in it.
Re: your http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=41829&site=3 thread. Does she have a choice?
Are you threatening her? I am so sick of religious fanatic bullshit. This kinda crap is'nt much better than the fundamentalist islam crap that is causing all the trouble now. Yes, calvinist, you have proven by your own statements that he picks & chooses who he wants to kill, innocent children included, like some crazy cosmic chess game w/ satan. Duh. If he exists he is a blood thirst monster. Easily as bad as satan because he created the whole scenario according to your twisted "logic"
Edited by - avishai on 8 December 2002 19:30:18
Love is blind, Ray Charles is blind, therefore.....
the basic 5 points of calvinism.
1. total depravity- all men are sinners.
we are totally corrupt and wicked.
1. Total Depravity- All men are sinners. We are totally corrupt and wicked. Our hearts are deceitful above all else. We are dead in our sins. We cannot seek or choose God in our sins.
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Why the hell would God make people like this? Is this a joke? Oh, wait, religion is the big joke. Including calvinism. Wow. No, I'm not a calvinist. God, how irretrievably stupid do people have to be to believe this crap?
second kings, we learn that menahem, leader of the israelites, smote all the people who refused to follow him and all the women therein that were with child he ripped up (2 kings 15:16).
later, in hosea, we learn that because the land of samaria rejected god, samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her god: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up (hosea 13:16).
hosea decided to carry out gods vengeance on the people by killing the unborn babies carried by the heathen women.
Yeah, Moe, I agree, If all thats true about god, then he's kind of a di_k. Also, if that's true, I want to die giving him the finger, or at least be propped in my coffin w/ the "digitus impudicus" flying heaven ward.
