Posts by tec

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

Alaso Tammy, if there is no difference then why is murder prohibited in the 10 commandments? Why was cain killing abel 'bad'? why was Jesus dying of any significance whatsoever?

I did not say there was no difference. I asked what WAS the difference... and I took out death by murder, so as not to confuse the issue.

Murder is someone else CAUSING the death of another, causing the death of a brother. Deliberately, from anger or jealousy (as the case of Cain), or perhaps greed, whatever the reason.

The rest of the comments seem to be focusing on that. I took it out of the equation.

Peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

Won't answer the question will you?

It was not an analogy. It was a simple question.

You haven't answered many questions that I have asked. You have also not responded to the answer you wanted me to elaborate upon either... that this world is not the Kingdom of God.

God has no promise with anyone in this world to protect them from natural diasters. It is not even an issue. And no, he does not owe it to us to do ANYTHING. He owes us nothing. He gave us life, He gives us guidance, He has made promises that He keeps, covenants that he upholds (even when mand does not)... and the covenant that we have with Him is through His Son... for eternal life; for the Kingdom of God.

Life on this world is going to go on as it always has. With joy and wonder and life; and also with death and suffering.

1. Tsunamis are a natural part of this world, and a result of processes that enable life ON this world.

2. Why are you adding into your summaries that 5 million people were displaced? That is a hardship... but big deal, in relation to THIS topic. Hardship and suffering are... again... part of this world. Why can you not wrap your mind around that?

3. You do not know what consequences might have occurred if God stopped the tsunami. Which is not to say that He could or could not have. But again... it is part of this world. Most people get that. Most people believe the Son of God when He said these things would happen, when He said we would have suffering, and we would die. The promise is that we will also LIVE, in the Kingdom. Not live forever or be free from pain and suffering in this world. Just the opposite. Why can you not wrap your mind around that?

4. God did not stop the tsunami, yes... that is obvious.

5. Everything that God does IS of love, yes. That doesn't mean everyone is capable of recognizing that because their goal (life forever free of disease and suffering and death right NOW) is not the same as His. They are limited in their sight. God is not. Love for His children, and according to His plan and timeline... which ensures that none of His children are lost. Lost from life, eternal. Once again, as was warned, everyone in this world/life dies. Including the sons/children of God... until Christ returns. People whose faith is in Christ and God know this. Including those who died in and/or survived the tsunami and other natural diasters.

6. There is no therefore. It is not even an issue, unless this world is all you can see, and so you demand what is given in the Kingdom to be given for this world... and most often without even upholding what is required of you from the covenant to be in that Kingdom.

It is simply part of this world. Which, again, is not HIS Kingdom.

Peace to you,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

God did not murder anyone. They died in a natural disaster, consequence from natural movements of the earth, something that Christ himself said would be happening, something that is intricately tied to what enables life on this planet to begin with.

In any case... I asked a simple question. But lets take murder out of the equation so no one gets hung up on it. What is the difference between death from natural diaster, death from old age, death from disease, death from accident/injury, etc, etc?

peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

What is the difference between death from natural disaster, death from old age, death from disease, death from accident/injury, death from murder/ etc, etc?

Peace,

tammy

340

Fallacies about Faith

by tec in

jw
friends

peace to you!.

this thread is about false things (some) atheists think theists believe.

this is not a thread about false things that atheists think about theists.

tec

Etude, what is your point please?

I read the last page on that thread and your post a year ago. I had nothing further to add to what I had already said in that thread. I did not think we were getting anywhere with many misunderstandings between us. I am sorry, I should have just said that so that you did not think I simply had not seen the post.

Would you like to continue that conversation?

Peace,

tammy

340

Fallacies about Faith

by tec in

jw
friends

peace to you!.

this thread is about false things (some) atheists think theists believe.

this is not a thread about false things that atheists think about theists.

tec

Tammy, sorry for the incorrect assumption (and thank you cofty).

No problem. Cofty misrepresents me, but that has been par for the course for some time.

Nevertheless, you said you "studied" for a while with the witlesses. So, at least you're familiar with their m.o.

I studied with the witnesses, yes, and learned their 'mo' somewhat. I have learend more from this site and jwfacts then I learned in the two year study, about them.

After some time reading your posts, I have found that what you now have is not so different than theirs. The perfect example is your circularity in saying "Truth is truth".

I must disagree with both sentiments. But I can only address the one example that you gave... and I had to go looking for it myself because I really don't know what point you are trying to make.

What I was responding to:

TEC, you sure use a loose definition of "truth"? But regardless, can you give ONE example of a "truth" spoken of by Jesus? I don't mean a WISDOM saying, or a reference to the promise of the Kingdom of God, etc, but a useful CONCRETE truth that was a proven fact, a breakthrough for the knowledge of mankind.

And my response:

Truth is truth... regardless of if you and others want to label some as a 'wisdom saying'... or some about His coming Kingdom.

Can you please tell me what parallel you are seeing? Someone wanted to limit my response to a "type" of truth being spoken about... and that makes no sense to me. I don't categorize different 'kinds' of truth.

But, who gets to make that determination?

Well apparently the person who was trying to limit what I could give as an example of truth.

It was not me doing that.

Nor have I ever told or even asked someone else to believe something just because I heard it from Christ and shared it on the board. I have never asked anyone to ever take my word for anything... and I have not threatened anyone with Armageddon or death or hellfire or any other misfortune unless they agree with me, and come into 'my truth'. ( a phrase i would NEVER use, hence the quotation marks) Nor have I ever not expected that others will not challenge. Indeed. Challenge. Test. Ask for yourself. Look up the scriptures. Think and reason for yoursel. I have not stated otherwise.

So I have to say that I am still failing to see the parallel or point that you are making.

Peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

Tammy manipulated you to cause trouble as usual.

Give it a rest Cofty. I didn't manipulate anyone into anything; that is an insult to Outlaw and to me; and Outlaw didn't cause any trouble... the trouble was already here from certain accusations.

As for the 'god should have done it' argument... we're just going in circles. You say 'god should have done it'... I ask 'how'... you say he should have if he is omnipotent... and that makes no sense because you are NOT omnipotent... so again, I ask how do YOU know what should have been done over Him?

So we will have to disagree on that point. Because going in circles is contributing nothing.

Peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

Cofty do you ever even listen to yourself? You have insulted how many people now, just because they have not come to the conclusions that you do. Now you are also insulting Outlaw... just because he mods on our forum, and does not back down when you speak falsely about it. He never did a thing to you except speak honestly about what he knows.

Peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

He doesn't need to know those things, Tammy. If God really is omniscient and omnipotent and love, then he should know how, be able to do it and do it out of love.

If he doesn't know how, can't or just doesn't want too, you're left with a two legged stool that falls over.

Or He does know, and it is as it must be for this planet to support life.

How would you know the difference?

Peace,

tammy

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

tec

I will look up all that you have said.

You are still suggesting that God 'should have done' something; without knowing how that something could be done, yourself. Or even what that something is... or the ramifications.

Earthquakes have been happening for millions of years before humans existed so it is facile to blame human activity. Earthquakes are an example of bad design. The god of christian theism booby-trapped the planet knowing it would result in millions of preventable violent deaths.

How could it be a booby trap... when God did not make MAN to be subject to death to begin with?

Peace,

tammy