Posts by alice.in.wonderland

65

Jesus warned us about JWs!

by 3Mozzies in

luke 21:8. .

american standard version (asv).

he said, watch out that you dont get led astray, for many will come in my name, saying, i am he , and, the time is at hand.

The Time Is At Hand by Charles Taze Russell was released in 1889 and the Bible translations you claim match Jesus' words verbatim were assembled afterward; out of sync with the original Greek renderings:

The American Standard Version (ASV), is a version of the Bible that was released in 1901.

The first edition of the Amplified Bible n was published in 1965.

The English Standard Version (ESV) is an English translation of the Bible. It is a revision of the 1971 edition of the Revised Standard Version.

The World English Bible (also known as WEB) is a public domain translation of the Bible that is currently in draft form. Work on the World English Bible began in 1997 and was known as the American Standard Version 1997.

The point in Luke 21:8 that should be conveyed is obvious, but matching data objects with "code language" is not the admonishment.

As for Jesus' statements rendered from the original Greek words in the New Testament, they reveal a finite time frame: Luke 21:8

http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek-texts/new-testament/luke/21.asp

So, you're not agreeable that the 20th and 21st century have vindicated Jesus' words as gospel truth. If Jesus words are reflective of truth period, you should enlighten before denying the observations of others.

120

Evidence! How did you come to know reality?

by zannahdoll in

is it possible that when we (as a people) make an advancement in science and learn new facts that they sometimes disprove what was once considered fact?

unless you test something for yourself you are taking the word of someone else.

or do you trust that things are certain?

alice.in.wonderland

It is now accepted by some that as time, the universe has always existed and will continue to exist for eternity. Therefore the Big Bang or any other theory of cosmology which suggest the universe has a finite existence if a false and mythical concept. Others believe, the universe at one time did not exist and that by some means it came into existence.

Objectivism regards reason as an absolute. It holds that all knowledge is based on the evidence of the senses. It holds that all beliefs, conclusions, and convictions must be established by logical methods of inquiry and tested by logical methods of verification. In short, it holds that the scientific approach applies to all areas of knowledge. Blind faith, by contrast, consists in belief not based on evidence, or based on such spurious forms of "evidence" as revelation and authority.

Objectivism rests on a premise that supernatural dimensions do not exist when the facts stipulate otherwise. Matter is simply one form of energy. This relationship between matter and energy was expressed by Einstein’s famous formula E=mc2 (energy equals mass times the speed of light squared). This equation reveals that a little mass, or matter, harbors enormous energy and that energy can also be turned into matter. Neither constant can emerge from empty space.

String theory alone may one day find some evidence for the "infinite universe," but the pre-Big Bang models based on string theory are fundamentally un-empirical. Furthermore, as it currently stands, those models appear to be fundamentally incompatible with current cosmological observations as well as the enormous number of non-empirically based ideas that go along with them.

The Ekpyrotic/Cyclic models that they are working on end up positing extraordinarily complicated mathematical "entities" or "bulks" (fancy word for bigger universes) that require a tremendous number of non-trivial assumptions that are based on nothing other than "to make it work out." So sure, you can hold out for one of these theories. But you don't get to pretend that you're sticking with empirical or scientific ideas. You're at least as religious as any hyper fundamentalist in any religion. If one insists on holding out for a scientific answer, then you will never find the answer. Any proposed explanation for the origin of the universe will be metaphysical and outside the reach of empirical science, whether it is theism or a string derived model.

The forming of the material universe may thus have involved the transformation of matter and energy from an infinite source. The Bible shows God to be the source of the energy locked up in the material universe. (Isaiah 40:26) The idea of exalting the spirit over the material existence of the body has long been tightly connected to religious thought in Christendom's churches to the idea that there exists some reality beyond the material world we know through our senses, a world our spirits long for as an escape from the needs of the body and the constraints of physical reality. Evidence for God in its most genuine sense is God's active force.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

I'm not sure what I'm apologizing for. Like it hasn't escaped my notice that people here try and directly relate Jehovah's Witnesses and abuse like there's an inherit connection? Based on what? Something the Bible says? If you try and pass this generalization off to any one Jehovah's Witnesses that wouldn't do this sort of thing they will never accept it. Limiting this generalization to my family, how could I blame everyone in my family that's a witness as being abusers or callous to abuse when they have demonstrated otherwise?

What's particularly bothersome here, is it's OK for St Anne to be an active Catholic and defend Pope Ratzinger and at the same time condemn JWs. Nobody seems to notice, much less care. That's bull. If you want to be taken seriously start with some consistency.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

I blamed what to took place on the person who committed the wrong. My Dad became an elder before he met my mother and she unfortunately never told anyone. When the elders responded to my sister, they said that, “if this is what she says it is, this no longer just a congregational matter, we also have to notify the authorities.” My Dad got a good start as one of Jehovah's Witnesses but after lying to the elders I doubted he even was one anymore. None of my other relatives that are witnesses are like that, but then again they weren't physically abused as a youth. There are cause and effect relationships for just about anything. Isolate the circumstances; you'll get a better understanding of others instead of blaming unrelated people.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/193986/7/Christendom-vs-Jehovahs-Organization

"Many other cases of sexual abuse that I know of personally happened in bedrooms and bathrooms after the "book study", which used to be held in private homes.

StAnn"

I do remember this comment. It brought back memories of the book study at our house. Save the other stuff; the book study conductor did not, nor did anyone allow the extra curricular bedroom activities. Ok StAnn, statement has been entered into the database for processing. I'm shocked it was the friendly Catholic StAnn that said this. I had deja vu of some kid hung over from last night's party making such a statement.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

I'll look for the comments. You can take the story for what it is worth considering the circumstances (anonymity in cyberspace). There's real people that can back much of what I said, but in my immediate social environment, anything condemnatory is confined to me and my Dad.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

"Alice Rachel, I'm sorry but you don't get a pass from me. You have accused everyone on here who stated they were sexually abused of lying to make the WTS look bad. I've yet to receive an apology from you for the things you wrote about my experiences.
So, your father beat up on other people and convinced you to lie to cover for him. Wah. Then when your dad refused to meet with the elders, you began shunning him. You didn't shun him for beating up your mother, brothers, or stepmother but you had no problem shunning him for refusing to bend his knee to the Almighty Elders.
Oh, my heart just bleeds for you, feeling you had to lie for your daddy! Poor baby. But when I was raped at 10 years old, you said it was my fault for not reporting it. Hmmm, apples to apples, your situation isn't so bad, is it, Chick?"

There's quite a bit of information disseminated on this forum. Sorry if I don't recall, but I would not expect a 10 year old to know what to do in such a situation. I expected the unsympathetic responses. So far, I haven't blamed anyone except myself or my dad.

209

My Family

by alice.in.wonderland in

to those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:.

my father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s.

he owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area.

alice.in.wonderland

To those that have accused me of insensitivity about abuse:

My father and his brother and sisters were raised by a man who became rich in the 1950s. He owned a construction company during a housing boom in a metropolitan area. For whatever reason he became a cruel man and started beating up on his wife and teenage sons, for how long I don't know.

My Dad became one of Jehovah's Witnesses in the 1960s and married my Mom shortly after. He was genuinely a good man but his experiences as a teenager evidently had some long term effects as he beat up on my mother for a few years while he was an elder (they were divorced before I was 5 and he had to step down). When he married his second wife there were some problems, but he got his temper under some control. One night however, he lost his temper and cut loose on my sister. She immediately left the home, called her/my (real) mother and she picked her up.

She told the elders about the indecent at a congregation in that area. The elders there, contacted the elders at my father's Kingdom Hall. The elders at our congregation immediately showed up at our front door and questioned my Dad. After they left, my father explained to me why what is physical abuse, “isn't” physical abuse. In other words, I was taught to lie. So, when the elders returned and questioned me about the alleged abuse, that's what I did. Upon becoming older, I understood I was manipulated into lying so I confronted my Dad. He refused to meet with the elders, so I have had nothing to do with him ever since (active JW). He floats around freely in the family as 75% of my family are JWs.

77

Sex before marriage. feeling guilty

by frigginconfused in

jw
friends

heres the situation.... met a girl i am tottally infatuated with.

i could just hang out with her and not have sex but she has not been in a relationship in a year and shes pretty horny.

im a normal dude so i dont want to refuse her.. i cant decide if im rationalizing my feelings.

alice.in.wonderland

Go get laid. What's the worst thing that can happen?

243

Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

by Quillsky in

jw
friends

my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

it is a belief in no belief..

alice.in.wonderland

While many of the world's smartest people are atheists, there is no wisdom to be found in atheism itself so it is not a belief. Atheism is just the condition you find yourself in when you recognize that many of the known arguments for gods are specious. However, many atheists have plenty of wisdom, and wherever wisdom can be found, atheists are there, including in churches.