Witnesses have never claimed to do inspired prophecy. This is a requirement if you want to qualify them as a false prophets who cliam divine inspiration/direct words from God falsely.
debator
JoinedPosts by debator
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144
The False Prophet Nathan?
by brotherdan inmy mom is addicted to the wts.
i've recently brought up the many false prophecies and she calls almost every week to show me new things that the society has said about false prophets and how they are not one.. the latest was the account where king david wanted to build god a temple.
he told nathan the prophet about his idea and nathan basically said, well god is with you, you should do it.
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116
Biggest Harm Caused by Watchtower in AllTimeJeff Eyes.
by Scott77 in"jw's are an entirely different animal from manson's followers.
they bleed you slowly to death (literally and figuratively), but the biggest harm jw's perpetuate is the lives that are put on hold for "theocratic" activities.
a rich life is denied its members because of their doomsday scenarios' said alltimejeff, a former jehovah's witnesses missionary in west africa.. in view of the recent generation change and interpretation, please, what do you think about that?
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debator
Hi Just n from Bethel
I must admit your position is confusing? You say you are a practising elder who comes on this site then condemn yourself for being on here?
My position is not as forceful as yours I have never gone on ex-Jw sites but this isn't one. It is a Jehovah's witness site by it's title and blog and witnesses do come on here. They may get a surprise by the amount of ex-Jws and non-Jws on here as I was but then we defend the faith as well as debate with non-Jws that wish to debate on certain topics and want to know the witness bible understanding on it.
From our literature I get the point that we are warned against these things and this is a self-regulating thing. But I accept you disagree.
Hi Gayle
If you do not wish to read my posts I fully accept your choice. But this is a Jehovah's witness forum why would you be surprised to find witnesses on it? rather than an ex-Jw forum that probably doesn't allow current witnesses on them?
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54
Appears to be another case of "shifting the burden."
by garyneal inmy wife and i was talking about one of the talks that they had concerning marriage and how each spouse is suppose to put the other spouse first and that as long as both spouses did this, it would work out for the greater good of the marriage.. i agreed but added a point in that sometimes, either because of human frailties on the part of your spouse or some other reason, you spouse may not be fulfilling all your needs and sometimes you will just need to take care of your own needs.
i tried to emphasize that this did not mean placing your needs ahead of the marriage or family or even your spouses, but simply sometimes we need to take care of our own needs and not always expect the spouse to do it for us.. she did not like the 'tone' and 'attitude' of my remark and when i brought up an example, it really set her off.. the example had to do with birthdays.
since my wife is a witness, obviously she will not be throwing me a party, at least don't expect her too.
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debator
Hi psacra
Paul was talking about specific Jewish celebrations that Jehovah himself had allowed mentioning sabbath this is not the same as taking on pagan practicies which has always been condemned biblically.
1 Peter 4:3-4 (New International Version)
3 For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry. 4 They think it strange that you do not plunge with them into the same flood of dissipation, and they heap abuse on you.
Paul makes it clear there is no allowance for taking on or to keep doing pagan ways and that part of being a Christian is giving them up. That includes pagan celebrations now that would include drunkeness etc.
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Appears to be another case of "shifting the burden."
by garyneal inmy wife and i was talking about one of the talks that they had concerning marriage and how each spouse is suppose to put the other spouse first and that as long as both spouses did this, it would work out for the greater good of the marriage.. i agreed but added a point in that sometimes, either because of human frailties on the part of your spouse or some other reason, you spouse may not be fulfilling all your needs and sometimes you will just need to take care of your own needs.
i tried to emphasize that this did not mean placing your needs ahead of the marriage or family or even your spouses, but simply sometimes we need to take care of our own needs and not always expect the spouse to do it for us.. she did not like the 'tone' and 'attitude' of my remark and when i brought up an example, it really set her off.. the example had to do with birthdays.
since my wife is a witness, obviously she will not be throwing me a party, at least don't expect her too.
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debator
The bible does establish Birthdays as a well known celebration that pagans did.
Jews like Herod that were heavily influenced by Pagan practisies happily celebrated birthdays. (The Jewish calender is a very complicated one and actually has many more days like febuary 29th in our calender so doesn't lend itself to celebrating birthdays easily.
So did both Jews and christians including Jesus (who became aware that His cousin was murdered as a birthday event for Herod) suddenly turn around and start celebrating birthdays?
No! neither Jews (unless pagan influenced ones like Herod) or Early Christians although knowing about birthdays celebrated them.
Why would I as a christian celebrate something that Jesus and the other christians didn't when they easily could have? and thats the point. Birthdays were known but Christians simply didn't do them including Jesus himself.
Hi Garyneal
Do you have any strong religious convictions you would like your wife to respect if nothing else? Wouldn't it be better for you both to come to a mutual agreement, maybe have special dinners out as a couple without it needing to be on a particular date like birthdays or Christimas etc that will spoil the evening making it a battlefield? I know if had a wife with different religious convictions I would respect her beliefs and allow for them as part of my love for her while not compromising my own.
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Biggest Harm Caused by Watchtower in AllTimeJeff Eyes.
by Scott77 in"jw's are an entirely different animal from manson's followers.
they bleed you slowly to death (literally and figuratively), but the biggest harm jw's perpetuate is the lives that are put on hold for "theocratic" activities.
a rich life is denied its members because of their doomsday scenarios' said alltimejeff, a former jehovah's witnesses missionary in west africa.. in view of the recent generation change and interpretation, please, what do you think about that?
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debator
Hi just in from bethel
Is this an offical apostate site then? My understanding is that it is a site for witnesses to debate. As witnessese are warned about internet usage as we are warned on Television and other easily abused entertainment and social outlets but it is more of a self-regulating issue, personal conscience in fact.
I post on here mainly for people who are witnesses rather than ones who have left the witnesses and have a lot of bitterness for what they once formerly loved.
I give out no personal details and seek no personal details or contact. I just answer with clear points on any given topic in support of the witnesses which I find the most biblically sound religion at this time.
Hi Billy
I do not accept your judgement that my question was a fallacy. Your read it as just an appeal to consequences but it covers a lot more.
Do you accept that in rejecting God you are limiting your situation to one where God cannot be seen as a option for belief or answers?
Without God we are limited to a lifetime of existence within the limitation of a current society and limited knowledge that that culture can find.
Limited lifespan and ultimately death without answers for more than this, is something all atheists have to accept.
Believing in God offers not just hope for more but hope for answers that reach beyond this finality. Good and bad is a concept only humans deal with. Animals living instinctively, living for survival do what they are programmed to do.
You are the one using fallacies now. Santa's evident lack of existence proves nothing beyond it's own researcheable fictional context. But Jehovah's witnesses use of the Bible can be measured against the bible as any Christian faith is.
Do you think the bible is fictional now as well as the existence of a God with answers?
Billy I accept that Bible prophecy understanding/decerment is a fluid medium that awaits fulfillment for full disclosure and so is a dubious area to fault-find witnesses on since the alternative is to deny Jesus's command and ignore these prophecies and not "look" for them.
Hi TD
The Bible itself warns against being unevenly yoked with unbelievers. This guy was being unusually vitriolic in your experience and not something I have ever heard at meetings where the talks tend to be very concerned for the consequences if people do this for their own protection. IT is a general principle not just covering marriage to unbelievers.
2 Corinthians 6:14
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers.Do you think ther bible is wrong in this stated principle?
Judgementalism works many ways. We are told to "Test the spirit" of the Gospel we are taught. Jehovah witnesses have the confidence that any people who think they are God's people following his word correctly have. this is not a sin but a reality of belief in Jehovah. I find them sincere and earnest in this, not smug or superior. In fact quite the contrary I find witnesses very humble in faith and works thatprogress to salvation as apposed to the assumption of salvation taught by others.
Hi madsweeney
I totally disagree with you. I think witnesses teach a level of personal awareness of accountability that go beyond Rich nation charities offering handouts to poorer people and nations. These do great good in the immediate needs of the poor but do little to answer their longterm needs as a people to become less poor and get out of the poverty trap. Man can't offer answers for this only Jehovah can. Hense why Apostles helped the poor and sick but preached the kingdom for peoples actual salvation.
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Bible mistranslation Matthew 1:16
by Kobe in<!-- @page { margin: 2cm } p { margin-bottom: 0.21cm } --> .
first look at luke 3:23 ;23 furthermore, jesus himself, when he commenced [his work], was about thirty years old, being the son, as the opinion was,.
of joseph,.
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debator
Hi kobe
Nice research a pleasure to read. Of course this cannot be proved for definite one way or the other so remains an intriguing issue. Also having a matthew gospel originally written in ancient Hebrew or Aramaic throws up more contraversial points than just this one. It would clear up usage of the tetragramation if found.
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Biggest Harm Caused by Watchtower in AllTimeJeff Eyes.
by Scott77 in"jw's are an entirely different animal from manson's followers.
they bleed you slowly to death (literally and figuratively), but the biggest harm jw's perpetuate is the lives that are put on hold for "theocratic" activities.
a rich life is denied its members because of their doomsday scenarios' said alltimejeff, a former jehovah's witnesses missionary in west africa.. in view of the recent generation change and interpretation, please, what do you think about that?
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debator
Hi paulopollos
I admit I haven't your experience in this field and have already acknowledge my wording was badly put. But your post does confirm how much witnesses do from an insiders point of view which I not so inside see the results of too. It's the fact we all as witnesses are poor and give in "blood and treasure" from the anointed to the publishers. It isn't an easy life but it gave and gives me Biblical answers I found nowhere else and for me is a truer form of love and not just about giving out hand-outs.
I could wish there were more Jehovah's witnesses on this site but it seems that they are definitely in the minority here. And despite my lack of great knowledge on certain subjects. I will try and defend witnesses against clearly biased and wildly exagerated statements of untruths about them especially like on this one where many tried and say they do not do charitable works.
It is hard to see so many people on here holding witnesses to an extroadinarily unrealistic degree of perfection they do not require from any other religion or organisation or even themselves and their family.
Despite a lot of ridiculing your post made some points I enjoyed reading thank you.
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Now versus 7 Years Ago.....
by AK - Jeff inwe have been out of the organization since 1-1-2004 - at least that is the way we mark it to remember.
we began to read ray's books in late fall/early winter of 2003 - a thousand pages later and a few weeks - viola - we were out to never return.. i was contemplating just how significantly i have personally changed in that period of time - not the stages, though there have been many stages.
but the raw contrast of my opinions, moral stance, and view of the world is amazing.
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debator
Hi Poppers and AK-Jeff
Yes I find freedom in searching because as I search I grow in knowledge of Jehovah and his son Jesus which gives me more freedom. I feel free of trying to "live in the now" or "the moment" seeking happiness in the limited escapism-filled, selfish, money needing world we live in. I rejected this world as an option for me long ago so for me the future in Jehovah's love is as real as anything you can touch, eat, achieve and enjoy in this world. My faith makes it real.
Psalm 14:2
Jehovah looks down from heaven on the sons of men to see if there are any who understand, any who seek God. -
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Man arrested for molesting child at church (Kingdom Hall)
by Gayle inhttp://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/man_arrested_for_molesting_child_at_church_98408764.html.
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debator
Hi soldier
Your appeal to emotion aside. I think 12 year old children goto toilet themselves and would find it weird if a parent accompanied them. We do not know how this was dealt with accept it did get reported to the police and he faces charges for it.
While we recognise our kingdom halls as places we can worship Jehovah and gather together, as the Bible requires us to. We do not say the imperfect people that are witnesses are any less imperfect when in them. We cannot stop bad people still doing bad things that is upto Jehovah. We Preach God's message and Bible morality and let that effect people's hearts.
I agree that that comment was totally wrong to imply any wrongdoing on the parents part. But I also think putting some blame on the place of worship for a pedophile using it to groom kids is also wrong. If this had been in a Baptist church or a Catholic church, or a Methodist church would it even be up here? of course not.
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Bible mistranslation Matthew 1:16
by Kobe in<!-- @page { margin: 2cm } p { margin-bottom: 0.21cm } --> .
first look at luke 3:23 ;23 furthermore, jesus himself, when he commenced [his work], was about thirty years old, being the son, as the opinion was,.
of joseph,.
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