the atheists and bible deniers love to talk about how hateful and murderous god is.
i suggest the following.
i believe that the children that were killed in warfare by the israelites were taken to heaven with god.
Hi Caliber
Yes I agree with your point too. I also think Jehovah was limited by "freewill" knowing he could only do so much without unduly effecting this. We have to be able to choose for ourselves to turn to God and his message of peace and love but also face the consequences of our choices if we don't.
the atheists and bible deniers love to talk about how hateful and murderous god is.
i suggest the following.
i believe that the children that were killed in warfare by the israelites were taken to heaven with god.
The Bible is a very warts and all account.
It basically gives us what happens without going into detail as to the why's and wherefores.
Are all the possibilities to be taken in account?
The nations around them were known to be very immoral where they suffering from the usual illness that go with immoral lifestyles on a whole nation?
Did the nations take drugs that were in common use then?
Where there genetic issues with certain tribes that would have been detrimental to interbreeding? The phillistines were known to be unusually tall.
How would the israelites have treated them? Virgins they could marry and children they could intergrate and so would be taken care of but if others survived would the people simply have let them die slow deaths and starvation due to lack of resources then?
If allowed to live would the nations have constantly attacked the israelites? The constant attacks Israel was under then anyway shows this was a fact of daily life?
What attrocities had these already commited against Israel? Could God make them look after people that had killed israelite women and children without seeking revenge?
We know the tribes around the israelites were extremely violent, aggressive, immoral, into child sacrifice (Baal worshipers used to have burning pits that they suspending their own children above then drop them to there deaths in them to appease their God baal) how could they be intergrated?
How could Jehovah minimise the influence of those nations? We know Josiah was shocked at how much the israelites had strayed from the law when he became king?
When nations showed an ability to respect Israel they were spared.
Could God force Jews to be less violent without effecting freewill?
The speculations are endless but just putting a negative spin as the majority are doing on this thread is simply unrealistic and armchair moralising. Do we do better when we are far removed from the attrocities? When the governments you voted in do attrocities to other nations away from your eyes?
We have had Jesus's message of peace for 2000 years and yet we still think war and death are the answer! You may argue but we are imperfect humans but I say back that that is all God had to deal with. He had imperfect cloth he simply couldn't make peaceful he even sent his son with a message of peace and we killed him.
I think the Hebrew laws for the Jews covered a particularily violent and aggressive time period and the people needed preparing to be able to accept a more peaceful message from the messiah and even then they still killed him because of their violent tendencies.
a textual commentary on the greek new testament, by bruce m. metzger.
chm file (e book), 1.25mb.
http://anonym-to.com/?http://rapidshare.com/files/100421737/textual_commentary-greek_new_testament.rar.
HI possible san
You are a different culture from me and obviously put great store by certain writing protocols but I feel that in a debate forum all writers have to answer for their comments. We have the right to question people's assumptions on here.
I would like to think I simply do not agree out of politeness that would be doing niether myself or the poster any favours.
Hi ding
While "God the father" appears in the bible "God the son" never appears in the bible this for me is why I think trinitarians are very dishonest, adding there own doctrine to the bible.
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
Like I keep saying, many witnesses did hype thereselves up about 75' and that is what the young ones are remembering.
Some keep posting "time is short" watchtowers (as if they are some kind of proof) which is just silly since that is stardard preaching for every year since watchtower started posting. Actually standard for the bible too.
1 Corinthians 7:29
What I mean, brothers, is that the time is short. From now on those who have wives should live as if they had none;
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
Thank you for those that have posted watchtowers to show that 75' wasn't an official teaching for Armageddon but the 6000 year date since Adam.
Over-enthusiasm happened to many witnesses at that time (I have never denied this) but sensible people noted the cautionary points in those articles.
To add anything more is just to be repeating myself.
Exageration, conspiracy theories and emotional manipulation from hearsay are poor debating tools.
a textual commentary on the greek new testament, by bruce m. metzger.
chm file (e book), 1.25mb.
http://anonym-to.com/?http://rapidshare.com/files/100421737/textual_commentary-greek_new_testament.rar.
Hi possible san
You clearly did not read my reply. Yes Myelaine was pointing out Jesus was God's son on earth but she was implying that this changes when he goes to heaven.
and for Myelaine.
Revelation 14:1
[ The Lamb and the 144,000 ] Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads.
who is the lambs father?
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
Little Imp
Gods allows for his own people to be kept in readiness for it to be happening at any time that is what marks us.
Matthew 24:42-44 (New International Version)
42 "Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43 But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44 So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.
We keep ourseives ready so when it does happen at an unexpected time we will be ready!
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
Hi thetrueone
I'm pretty sure what I meant was clear but since you need clarification. The doctrine that 1975 as Armageddon has never been official or taught. 1975 was recognised as 6000 years since Adam using bible chronology only and hopefulness was gleened from this but that is the worst you can say. I have not denied at any point of this debate that 1975 was a date for 6000 years from Adam but was not mentioned as a date for Armageddon specifically as an official doctrine like 1914 for the end of Gentile times. As the above watchtowers uphold it was only viewed as supporting the fact we are in the "end times" When Armageddon can come at any times.
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
what was it like to live in the 1950's 1960's and early 70's as a jehovah witness.when they started to push the 1975 date..
I am not denying that enthusiasm made them hopeful that Armageddon would be around this time but it was not an official teaching! If a brother linked them in a talk he was doing it depite this, not because of this. The first wt quoted makes it clear this is hopefulness and not a specific doctrine.
Will it be the time when God executes the wicked and starts off the thousand-year reign of his Son Jesus Christ? It very well could, but we will have to wait to see..