That wouldn't surprise me. I know they claim parts of the Gospel narratives weren't laid out chronologically, which is how they hand-wave away the fact that, contrary to WT teaching, none of the accounts have Judas being dismissed before the establishment of the New Covenant.
Fencing
JoinedPosts by Fencing
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Splane "Bible writer's not logical"
by Backinthebox inbethelite asked splane since mt 25 is set in the great trib because half way through mt 24 events turn to the great trib, does that not mean the generation starts when the great tribulation starts and has nothing to do with 1914. splane replied the bible writers were not logical they would pick a topic then randomly go back to another topic.
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Elders & Ex Elders
by brandnew ini have a question.....if two jw have sex and only one of them goes to the eldurrs and confesses.....do they both get busted?
or does the boe need a confession from both people.?
if one of em denies it happened will that person still get df'd?.
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So their crazy Pharisaical rules can create a sort of quantum state of sin? Where from one observation it happened, and from another it didn't? And both states can be acted on independently and thus it can be stated that the act both did and didn't happen?
This is the kind of stupidity that crops up when you're obsessed with the letter of the law.
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Toasting is Pagan - How many contradictions can fit in 2 pages, I found 5?
by jwfacts inthe watchtower 2007 feb 15 pp.30-31 explains why jehovah's witnesses are not to toast.
what is astounding is that for each point they then go on an explain why the point is irrelevant, yet still conclude toasting is wrong.
what did people think when reading this?
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It occurred to me that this was a compromise to the fast growing numbers of studies and converts from cultures where the Piñata is an entrenched tradition.....
That's exactly what it was. When that article was released, Mexico and other parts of Central America were still the "crown jewel" of JW growth. Not to mention the rapidly growing Spanish circuit within the US. They were doing everything possible to not discourage that growth, and I'm convinced magically deciding pinatas were okay was a big part of that.
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Evolution is a Fact #1 - Protein Functional Redundancy
by cofty ini intend for this to be one of a series of bite-sized ops on the evidence for evolution.. introduction to dna genes are sequences of dna made up of words (codons) each of which are three letters (bases) long.
there are only four letters in the genetic alphabet (acg&t) each word or codon is the recipe for one amino acid.
there are 20 different amino acids in living organisms.
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Fencing
That's one of the most fascinating things about watching Creationists "debate". And I've seen this replicated across all kinds of other venues and forums. They rarely ever will stick to one topic and debate it. They'll throw random nonsense around ("I didn't evolve from no rock!"), and when someone tries to get them to focus and discuss a specific objection, they jump all over the place and do everything possible to avoid discussion.
James Brown is a PRIME example of this, in this very thread. When pressed to express what, exactly, his argument against the specific subject is, he runs away, spams the thread with multiple hours of videos that don't even address the subject, and throws out more red herrings than a fishing trawler dropping off its catch.
It's almost like they're afraid to debate rationally...
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A JW experience
by Saintbertholdt inthis is a quick experience i have recently had and i have two questions at the end.. a couple of weeks ago, the dogs were barking at the gate on saturday morning and wouldn't you know it, it was some witnesses.
there was a father with his lovely wife and their young daughter.
the father did all the talking as mother and daughter just dutifully smiled and watched.
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I could be wrong as I haven't been to a meeting in several years, but I was under the impression that the Society doesn't really encourage lengthy attempts to persuade householders anymore. They want you to get the magazine/tract/invitation into the householder's hands, or show them a video on your tablet, and leave. The training on how to counteract various objections at the door was on the decline even before I stopped going. No one really went over the "conversation stoppers" section in the Reasoning book anymore.
All part of the general dumbing down, I guess. The kind of person who would really be affected by a question like "would you agree that world conditions are becoming worse" would make an ideal candidate for a new recruit, as it would show a complete lack of thinking ability.
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Do You Remember The First Time You Looked At "Apostate" Material?
by minimus ini was always fascinated by it.
as a kid, i used to go to the local library and secretly read books by so called apostates.
later, i would sneak into christian book stores and quickly buy a book or two.
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Yes, about 6 years ago. It was an article in a newspaper site about an upcoming convention, and in the comments section someone was debating with a Witness, and posted something about how Jerusalem wasn't even destroyed in 607 and that Russell had a thing for pyramidology and claimed measurements in the Great Pyramid confirmed his dates. That was the first time I had actually read something long enough to let it sink in. I started digging up all the old Russell publications I could and read through them. It still took another few months before I had the courage to click any links that lead to this site.
But years before, I spent a lot of time reading the experiences of ex-Mormons, I think on exmormon.org. I realize now it was my own way of reading "apostate" material without actually reading JW apostate material. The experiences and situations were similar enough, that it kind of served the same purpose.
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How the Internet is Destroying Mormonism
by slimboyfat ininteresting video, shame it wasn't about jws.
http://youtu.be/-1bdbkjbzzy.
what a would be your top 5 shocking things you found out about jws on the internet?.
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What a would be your top 5 shocking things you found out about JWs on the Internet?
1. That nothing of what the Russell-era Bible Students believed about 1914 is still taught today - and the revisionist history the Society teaches in regards to that, to pretend they've always been right
2. That Jerusalem wasn't destroyed in 607
3. That they sought and attained a UN membership while accusing other religions of cavorting with the Wild Beast
4. Russell's obsession with pyramids
5. All the child abuse lawsuits and coverups
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Quality of newer membership
by Lostandfound inon a previous post mamacita29 pointed up the low quality of new jw converts.. is the quality falling even more as the society use lower than low meeting, talks, broadcasts etc.. when i was active initially the organisation and standards seemed totally different today.
i have seen hard working intelligent elders fall by death or exhaustion.
the younger generation that came along never really grasped responsibility hence shortage of good elders, never mind the watered down to almost nothing quality of meetings.
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I agree with Freddo. The 1995 change was really the moment that the Society transformed away from what Rutherford and Knorr setup, into what it is now. Prior to that, there was always a sense of purpose and direction. That everyone was charging ahead with a feeling of urgency and there was still some sense of excitement, because The End was coming Real Soon Now.
After the death of Franz, and the subsequent re-imagining of the "generation", everything just stalled. It was obvious they had no idea what to do next. The only "ideas man" who could come up with wacky interpretations of prophecies to keep people excited was dead and no one was stepping up to replace him. None of the predictions or expectations that they had been talking up for so long had come true. Even after the 1975 fiasco, they still always had the "generation" to fall back onto to keep some kind of deadline that kept everyone motivated. But now that was gone, and none of the litany of things that had to happen prior to the big A had even come close to happening. There wasn't even a King of the North anymore.
It was at that point that you started seeing less and less "deep" study articles on prophecy. The last big one that I remember studying was right around 94-95. The articles instead got fluffier and fluffier. Same handful of topics over and over. Obey the elders. Love your family. Stay away from porn.
The more recent "adjustment" of the generation teaching was an attempt to try and rekindle that feeling of urgency, but it's completely fallen flat. Mostly because the majority of Witnesses can't even explain what the teaching actually is, since it defies all logic and reason.
1995 was the end of an era, and Society has basically been treading water in the 20 years since. How long can they keep it up? Who knows.
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Types attracted to the sect known as jehovahs witnesses.
by atomant inl have observed the types of people attracted to the sect are many times unbalanced,unstable,emotionally insecure types.the jdubs seem to home in like vulchers circling the prey ,preying on the vulnerables.they tried it on me when my father who was an elder died.promising that if you become a dub you will one day see him again.l said how can you promise that when you keep making false misleading predictions.l was wondering if others have observed this phenomenon.
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The converts I knew almost always had extended JW family (aunts, uncles, cousins, inlaws, etc.) who had been hounding them for years. And within that group, they generally only gave in after some difficult time in their life - death of a close relative or child, major financial problems, etc. Always at some kind of low point in their life.
The ones who converted and didn't have family in already - the straight cold-called converts - were very far and few between, and were typically REALLY odd. Something was always off with them, mentally.
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Elder Mentioning an "Apostate Problem"
by Simon Templar ini bumped into a sister that i have known for at least 40 years or so.
we were catching up.
she and her husband have been in the truth for decades.
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It would be perilous for JW organization to advance a figurative view of the 144,000. What happens to their view of two classes and the enormous focus on paradise earth? What about the mountainous criticism of the churches of Christendom heralding heaven as the hope? JW's exclusive and literal take on the faithful and discreet slave is based on the view that the heavenly class is different from the great crowd.
Making the 144k figurative doesn't mean they'd suddenly have to believe everyone is going to heaven. They would keep their two-class system, and just put heavy emphasis on the 144,000 evidently meaning the number of Christians with a heavenly hope would be a very small subset in contrast with the "great crowd".
The concept of paradise earth is one of the most appealing aspects of the Witnesses to the majority of those who sign up. Thus, you'd still have the vast majority holding to that hope. The percentage of partakers would definitely spike, no question. But I think it would stabilize rather quickly. Probably no more than 5%, quite likely less than that.