Posts by Vanderhoven7

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

@ Fisherman,

All Christians should be aware that the Parousia will happen and be ready when it does. But the timing can not be anticipated. And when it does occur no one will be wondering if it happened or not.

THE OLIVET DISCOURSE; Parallels: Luke 21:7, Mark 13:4

CENTRAL QUESTION:

Is it possible that Matthew 24 (verses 1-35) was entirely fulfilled in the first century?

Which "generation" was Christ referring to in Matthew 24:34? (the time text)

- To which generation was Christ referring in Matthew 23:36?

- If the judicial sentence & prophetic woe of Mat.23:36
applies to Christ's generation, would not the exact same
terminology in Mat.24:34 have the same application?

CHRIST COULD HAVE INTENDED BY VERSE 34 THAT:

a. "all these things" were to happen to the 20th century generation exclusively.

Impossible: conversation centers on "these stones" which were knocked down in 70 AD.
Impossible Lu.21:23-24 states that subsequent to great distress, Jews were to be led captive to all nations which occurred immediately after the 70 AD destruction.

b. "all these things" were to happen to both Christ's generation and our generation. (dual fulfillment theory)

- Impossible: -these buildings and are already destroyed.

- Impossible -Jews are not to be led captive into all nations again at Christ's second coming.

- Impossible -Matt.24:21 precludes dual fulfillment.

c. "all these things" were to happen to Christ's generation exclusively.

Hmmm...possible only if it can be shown that "all these things" declared before verse 34 actually did happen to the generation Jesus addressed ?

QUESTION: Was Matthew 24: 1 - 35 entirely fulfilled in the first century?

ANSWER: Absolutely!

To disprove this conclusion one would have to find something in verses 1-35 that clearly did not happen in the first century A.D.

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi Fisherman,

<<No. I already explained that it would seem like normal times to people who took no note. If actually normal times nothing to notice.>>

The point is that the people in Noah's day were carrying on as normal totally unaware of the coming deluge or they would have prepared for it. The same will be the case when at the coming (Parousia) of Christ. It will be a complete surprise (the timing unknown to believers as well.)

"In a time that you think not, the Son of Man will come.

35 For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. 36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

@ Fisherman

Sorry, but you are still speaking gobbledygook. Try making sense.

How are you praying that your flight will not be in winter or on a Sabbath Day? Let me start the prayer for you...

"Dear Jehovah, when I flee Jerusalem and head for the mountains beyond Judea, please let it not be......."

Finish that will you... without more gobbledygook!

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

@Fisherman

Sorry, but you are speaking gobbledygook. Try making sense.

Note that Jesus ' words. The Parousia would take place in normal times, while unsuspecting people were having fun, not during a world War. No man would be aware as in the days of Noah. Of course Jesus had no idea that Barbour and Russell could figure 1874 out. Trust the scriptures, not your organizations speculations.

36¶But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi DJW

I believe Jesus encouraged them to pray for mitigating factors for their escape from Jerusalem's destruction. The gates of the city would be locked on the Sabbath and restrictions were placed on travel on the Sabbath for those in Judaea. Of course winter's cold would inhibit escape as well. And mothers with babies would have great difficulty making it to the safety of the mountains beyond Judaea.

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi Fisherman

And your point is...?

I notice you did not bother to quote the critical verses that show that the timing of the Parousia would not be known. Let me highlight them for you.

Note that Jesus ' Parousia would take place in normal times, while unsuspecting people were having fun, not during a world War.

36¶But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

Evidently God wanted the Faithful to be on the alert down through the ages so no date was provided to us and no signs given.

And when the Parousia does occur it will come as a snare on the whole earth and will be clear to everyone. And it will be visible as the angels said at the Lord's ascension.

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi Fisherman,

If there was a sign for the parousia Jesus would have told his disciples. But since there wasn't a sign he said, "at a time you think not the Son of Man cometh." But of that day knoweth no man. Matthew 25:36, 44

But of course Barbour and Charles Russell heralded 1874 for the Parousia based on the signs Christ never gave. 1914 was an afterthought made around 1930. Rutherford looked back because Jesus said when you see WW1 you will know I have invisibly returned.

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi Scholar,

In your view, is Matthew 24:34 referring to the 1914 generation or to his own generation or to both?

And are you praying that your flight will not occur in winter or on a Sabbath day?

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

<<1914 is right there at the very centre of the Olivet Discourse>>

False! 1914 is nowhere to be found in the Olivet Discourse.

So Scholar, do you bring a jacket with you when you work on your roof? Or do you plan to disobey Jesus and run into the house to get your jacket when fleeing time comes?

Do you, like Fisherman, pray that your flight will not be in winter or on a Sabbath Day? Why or why not?

540

Simple Question Re 1914

by Slidin Fast in

wt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!

and the end times.

a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?

Vanderhoven7

Hi Fisherman,

"You don't see it, Van."

You are right, I do not see what is not there.

I only see what is there

And 1914 is not there. It is only there to those who are willing to accept a man-made organization's convoluted assumption based non-scholarly speculations. And that's the truth.

"Nothing more I can say"

Yes, there is something more you can say. You can tell me what Jesus' hearers would have prayed about the Sabbath and about winter to mitigate the conditions of their escape and then what you are literally praying today about the poetic Sabbath Day and poetic Winter. What exactly are you praying?