Vanderhoven7

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Posts by Vanderhoven7

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  28

  Should Jehovah's Witnesses Trust the Governing Body?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if there is evidence that jesus invisibly chose specific men at headquarters in brooklyn new york in 1919 to be his faithful slave and that mandate and ability passed on to future directors...then the answer might just be a resounding maybe.. what is the evidence for this invisible appointment and what is the evidence that this is just watchtower mythology?.

  i hope jws like scholar and fisherman will explain why the trust the gb.. i must be honest, i see no evidence at all to put trust in either the 1919 selection or the current men taking the lead in warwick.

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  Vanderhoven7

  @Punky

  Thank you for this somewhat exhaustive list my friend. Copied and stored for imminent use.

  van
• 
  28

  Should Jehovah's Witnesses Trust the Governing Body?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if there is evidence that jesus invisibly chose specific men at headquarters in brooklyn new york in 1919 to be his faithful slave and that mandate and ability passed on to future directors...then the answer might just be a resounding maybe.. what is the evidence for this invisible appointment and what is the evidence that this is just watchtower mythology?.

  i hope jws like scholar and fisherman will explain why the trust the gb.. i must be honest, i see no evidence at all to put trust in either the 1919 selection or the current men taking the lead in warwick.

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  Vanderhoven7

  @Linda

  "It is a serious matter to represent God and Christ in one way, then find that our understanding of the major teachings and fundamental doctrines of the Scriptures was in error, and then after that, to go back to the very doctrines that, by years of study, we had thoroughly determined to be in error. Christians cannot be vacillating – 'wishy washy' - about such fundamental teachings. What confidence can one put in the sincerity or judgment of such persons?" the Watchtower, May 15 1976, p. 298

  We cannot worship Jehovah in spirit and in truth if our worship is based on speculation. Truth and theory are not synonymous. " Wt 6/15 1962 p.383

  How many times did Watchtower speculate on the identity of the Faithful Slave...Will they baptize someone who does not believe in 1919?
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  20

  How do JWs know that millions who were martyred as Christians before the 20th century did not have the heavenly hope?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as i understand it, jehovah’s witnesses believe less than 145,000 faithful christians existed prior to the twentieth century.

  the other sheep christians did not start forming until after 1914. that means jehovah’s witnesses view millions martyred for their faith in christ prior to the 20th century as merely professed christians.. the question is…how do witnesses know that those millions who perished for their faith in christ were not christians at all?.

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  Vanderhoven7

  "For 19 centuries there was only the one calling, the heavenly one, with Jehovah being very selective as to who would serve with his Son to make up the Kingdom government." (The Watchtower, February 15, 1982 p. 30)

  
  

  Here is an astute questioner and the WT response

  w52 1/15 p. 62 Questions From Readers

  According to the article “Hated for His Name” in the September 1, 1951, Watchtower, hundreds of thousands of Christians died in the “ten persecutions” starting in Nero’s time, 144,000 dying in Egypt alone during one of the persecutions. How can this be harmonized with the Scriptural limitation of 144,000 placed on the number being in Christ’s body, and which position was the only one open to Christians during those centuries?—J.A., Dominican Republic.

  The article did not class with any finality the individuals that died during these persecutions, but spoke of the results in a general way. Note that a key qualification was made in the case referred to in the question: “In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works.” The victims are identified as “professed Christians”, not Christians in fact. Many of those persons might have been caught in the wave of persecution, but may never have actually preached the truth or followed in Jesus’ footsteps, being only professed Christians. They knew the world they lived in was rotten and they were listening to the message of the Christians and willing to die for it even though not in line for the high calling in Christ Jesus. Many professed Christians today might be willing to die for their faith, but still not be Jesus’ footstep followers and meeting the Scriptural requirements for such.

  Isn't this response arrogant as well as insulting to those who made the ultimate sacrifice for staying true to their Christian beliefs? The WTS pulls the same stunt today by claiming they alone are true Christians and those non-JWs dying for their faith in Christ in other lands are simply professed but not real Christians. They know who belongs to Christ and who doesn't.
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  20

  How do JWs know that millions who were martyred as Christians before the 20th century did not have the heavenly hope?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as i understand it, jehovah’s witnesses believe less than 145,000 faithful christians existed prior to the twentieth century.

  the other sheep christians did not start forming until after 1914. that means jehovah’s witnesses view millions martyred for their faith in christ prior to the 20th century as merely professed christians.. the question is…how do witnesses know that those millions who perished for their faith in christ were not christians at all?.

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  Vanderhoven7

  @Slim

  Well no doubt numbers of those martyred before the twentieth century will differ.

  Here is one estimate.

  "By 200, the faith had permeated most regions of the Roman Empire, though Christians were mostly in the larger urban areas (Gaul, Lyons, Carthage, Rome). By 325, an estimated 7 million were Christians with as many as 2 million killed for the faith."

  

  https://www3.dbu.edu › mitchell › a...

  Anceint Christian Martyrdom

  Interestingly, Watchtower has has admitted to hundreds of thousands martyred for faith in Christ in the first three centuries CE... but has determined that they were really only professed Christians.

  1935 was the year light flashed from heaven and revealed to Rutherford that the other sheep class was forming. And according to Watchtower, some of the earliest Christian other sheep will be around when the tribulation begins.
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  20

  How do JWs know that millions who were martyred as Christians before the 20th century did not have the heavenly hope?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as i understand it, jehovah’s witnesses believe less than 145,000 faithful christians existed prior to the twentieth century.

  the other sheep christians did not start forming until after 1914. that means jehovah’s witnesses view millions martyred for their faith in christ prior to the 20th century as merely professed christians.. the question is…how do witnesses know that those millions who perished for their faith in christ were not christians at all?.

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  Vanderhoven7

  @Ratti

  ((What do you mean How did we know that millions didn't have the heavenly hope?))
  Good question.

  I'll answer....

  According to Watchtower:

  1. What is the maximum number of Christians that have the heavenly hope?......... 144,000

  2. How many non-anointed Christians were around before the twentieth century? ......Zero

  3. What is the maximum number of anointed plus non-anointed Christians that could have existed prior to the twentieth century? .......less than 144,000 since some of the 144,000 are still with us today.

  4. What does Watchtower identify those millions martyred for their faith in Christ prior to the twentieth century, as? ..... non-Christians

  So, How do Jehovah's Witnesses know that millions who died for their faith in Christ prior to 1914 were professed but not real Christians?.....You tell me
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  20

  How do JWs know that millions who were martyred as Christians before the 20th century did not have the heavenly hope?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as i understand it, jehovah’s witnesses believe less than 145,000 faithful christians existed prior to the twentieth century.

  the other sheep christians did not start forming until after 1914. that means jehovah’s witnesses view millions martyred for their faith in christ prior to the 20th century as merely professed christians.. the question is…how do witnesses know that those millions who perished for their faith in christ were not christians at all?.

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  Vanderhoven7

  As I understand it, Jehovah’s Witnesses believe less than 145,000 faithful Christians existed prior to the twentieth century. The other sheep Christians did not start forming until after 1914. That means Jehovah’s Witnesses view millions martyred for their faith in Christ prior to the 20th century as merely professed Christians.

  The question is…how do Witnesses know that those millions who perished for their faith in Christ were not Christians at all?
• 
  203

  My Explanation of Why They Got it Wrong About Blood Using Only the NWT

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  10 " any israelite or any alien living among them who eats any bloodi will set my face against that person who eats blood and will cut him off from his people.

  12 therefore i say to the israelites, "none of you may eat blood, nor may an alien living among you eat blood.

  15 'anyone, whether native-born or alien, who eats anything found dead or torn by wild animals must wash his clothes and bathe with water, and he will be ceremonially unclean till evening; then he will be clean.

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  Vanderhoven7

  @Fisherman

  Do you think a JW farmer today who find one of his animals dead in the field should simply take a bath and change his apparel if he eats some of its unbled meat? Or would there be other consequences beyond those of the Mosaic law?
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  14

  How many doubt the GB official teaching about who will survive

  by Indoubtbigtime in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i wonder how many have doubts about the gb teaching that only baptised jws would survive the big a?

  even then they still only say you may make it as with unbaptised kids of jdubs.

  i think most people physically in don’t agree with the gb on this and are hoping jehovah would let other good people into the new world even if they are not baptised jws.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Even JWs won't survive Armageddon if they don't fully trust and obey the Watchtower Faithful Slave.
  

  The only way they can be assured of a place in the new system, is to die before the tribulation starts. It's in Bible-based Literature.
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  3

  What makes the Watchtower Society essential to Salvation?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  is the watchtower society and watchtower literature essential for salvation according to jehovah's witnesses?.

  ii timothy 3:15–17 that tells us that the word is sufficient for salvation and holiness, that the man of god might be perfect, thoroughly furnished for good works?.

  people became christians, i.e., were justified and lived holy lives long before the watchtower society came on the scene.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Oops I forgot to acknowledge Juli as the writer of the last post.
• 
  3

  What makes the Watchtower Society essential to Salvation?

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  is the watchtower society and watchtower literature essential for salvation according to jehovah's witnesses?.

  ii timothy 3:15–17 that tells us that the word is sufficient for salvation and holiness, that the man of god might be perfect, thoroughly furnished for good works?.

  people became christians, i.e., were justified and lived holy lives long before the watchtower society came on the scene.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Perhaps it's the Slave.

  The JW leaders talk out both sides of their mouths and the JWs will always lie to protect their 8 leaders.

  Common knowledge from their own literature about needing their 8 leaders for salvation.

  The Governing Body go as far as to claim that trusting in them equates to trusting in Jehovah.

  "The plain truth is that we cannot say that we trust in Jehovah if we do not trust in his earthly representatives—those whom Jehovah trusts.

  Today Jehovah leads the earthly part of his organization by means of “the faithful and discreet slave.” ... We show that we trust in Jehovah’s way of doing things by heeding the direction we receive from the organization and the elders." Watchtower 2022 Feb p.4

  "That faithful slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers in this time of the end. It is vital that we recognize the faithful slave. Our spiritual health and our relationship with God depend on this channel." Watchtower 2013 Jul 15 p.20

  "We need to obey the faithful and discreet slave to have Jehovah’s approval." Watchtower 2011 Jul 15 p.24 Simplified English Edition

  "... show respect for the “faithful and discreet slave” that He is using at the present time. Actually, your very life depends on following this course of action. Remember, too, it is only he that endures to the end that will be saved." Watchtower 1964 Jul 15 p.435

  "To act consistently with our baptism for life and into the Greater Noah we must submit to and cooperate with that slave and its legal instrument, the Watch Tower Society." Watchtower 1959 Oct 1 p.583