Spade

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Posts by Spade

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  82

  "Religion...is the Opium of the People" - What did Marx Mean?

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  when read in context karl marx was not directly attacking religion when he wrote those famous words.. .

  religious distress is at the same time the expression of real distress and the protest against real distress.

  religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation.

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  Spade

  Karl Marx was explaining what he experienced when exposed to Christendom’s Churches.
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  Outlaw, Alice is drunk on Watchtower Kool-Aid........No matter how badly it tastes, she'll always go running for more......

  How the Good News tastes has everything to do with you and innate changes you've made in your personality;

  Taste and see that Jehovah is good, O you people; Happy is the able-bodied man that takes refuge in him. Psalm 34:8
  
  Beware, brothers, for fear there should ever develop in any one of you a wicked heart lacking faith by drawing away from the living God; but keep on exhorting one another each day, as long as it may be called “Today,” for fear any one of you should become hardened by the deceptive power of sin. Hebrews 3:12-13
  
  If, now, the good news we declare is in fact veiled, it is veiled among those who are perishing, among whom the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through. 2 Corinthians 4:3-4
  
  This just means I'm glad I'm not you.
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  7 pages, Alice......

  7 pages of evidence that the WT is wrong on 607.

  You haven't scored even 1 point.....

  I've outlined plenty of evidence in defense of Jehovah's Witnesses for anyone to see. What I haven't done is post any un-Christian, tabloid, satire garbage that destroys the credibility of those that post and get off on it. I'll call the filth out but I refuse to wallow in it.
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  How about starting with the logic of Matthew 24:36 that I just posted.

  “No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. Matthew 24:36

  There's still a logical time frame a person can look to, for understanding when Jehovah will take action on behalf of planet earth.

  The Gentile Times ended with Christ Jesus assuming Kingdom power and the expulsion of Satan and his demons from heaven. This fortifies us with the knowledge that a short period of time is left between Christ Jesus assuming Kingdom power and the day and the hour when God's purposes will be accomplished as in heaven, also upon earth.
  
  And war broke out in heaven: Mi′cha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled but it did not prevail, neither was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. And I heard a loud voice in heaven say: “Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God! And they conquered him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their witnessing, and they did not love their souls even in the face of death. On this account be glad, you heavens and you who reside in them! Woe for the earth and for the sea, because the Devil has come down to you, having great anger, knowing he has a short period of time.” Revelation 12:7-12
  
  Let your kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, also upon earth. Matthew 6:10
  
  We may not know the day and the hour, but there is knowledge as to the time frame when these things will occur.
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  Black Sheep, now that you've decided to try and link these two forums, do you want me to destroy GiordanoBruno's argument?
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  You tried posting pasting this drivel at Chron.com How many times does archeology conflict with the Bible's historical cannon?

  It didn't fool anyone there either."

  Does this joker ever provide a logical response to anything posted instead of going off topic and out on a limb making claims he can't back up.
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  41

  Will Humanity Bring About a New World Order?

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://www.watchtower21.org/2011/02/will-humanity-bring-about-new-world.html.

  will humanity bring about a new world order through government?.

  the cia in the new world order: intelligence challenges through 2015. remarks by john c. gannon chairman, national intelligence council to the smithsonian associates "campus on the mall" .

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  Spade

  http://www.watchtower21.org/2011/02/will-humanity-bring-about-new-world.html Will humanity bring about a New World Order through government?
  
  The CIA in the New World Order: Intelligence Challenges Through 2015 Remarks by John C. Gannon Chairman, National Intelligence Council to the Smithsonian Associates’ "Campus on the Mall"
  
  February 1, 2000

  So, what, in shorthand, will the picture look like over the next fifteen years? My one-sentence encapsulation would say the following: "Globalization will provide mankind with the unprecedented opportunity to improve the quality of human life across the planet; but progress will be hampered by economic volatility, by the political and security implications of sharpening inequalities in income, and by the growing threat from multiple, relatively small-scale programs of weapons of mass destruction." By contrast with the massive but arguably contained Soviet threat, we now face a serious challenge from lesser developed—and less disciplined—states , well-financed international terrorist groups, and powerful individuals with increasingly easy access to conventional explosives and to biological, chemical, and, to a lesser extent, nuclear weapons, along with the missile systems to deliver them. The bottom line is that these adversaries, who are often motivated by ideological rage or ethnic hatred, will have fewer and less powerful weapons than the Soviets, but are more likely to use them!
  
  Tonight, I will try to describe the world as we see it evolving over the next 15 years, and I will attempt to assess the impact of all this on the intelligence business. I hope this broad approach will set the stage for the seven distinguished speakers who will follow me in this series on intelligence in the new world order. I assure you that these folks, many of them my colleagues and friends, will feel free to elaborate on any point I make or to disagree, if so inclined. There obviously is no single or simple response to the challenges we face. Some debate would be healthy!
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

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  Spade

  The statement above is far removed from your opening post. The issue under discussion is NOT the above statement. The issue we are considering is whether Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC, as the WTB&TS asserts. Please try to keep your eye on the ball.

  No, it is not. Facts about the Bible give reason to hold it in higher esteem when coming to conclusions about the related history.
  
  Insight on the Scriptures pp. 448-450 Chronology
  
  The Bible, by contrast, gives an unusually coherent and detailed history stretching through some 4,000 years, for not only does it record events with remarkable continuity from man’s beginning down to the time of Nehemiah’s governorship in the fifth century B.C.E. but also it may be considered as providing a basic coverage of the period between Nehemiah and the time of Jesus and his apostles by means of Daniel’s prophecy (history written in advance) at Daniel chapter 11. The Bible presents a graphic and true-to-life account of the nation of Israel from its birth onward, portraying with candor its strength and its weaknesses, its successes and its failures, its right worship and its false worship, its blessings and its adverse judgments and calamities. While this honesty alone does not ensure accurate chronology, it does give sound basis for confidence in the integrity of the Biblical writers and their sincere concern for recording truth.

  So? This has no bearing on the real topic here - mainly, whether or not Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC.

  The “seven times,” in Daniel 4:25 which Jesus called “the appointed times of the nations” from 607 B.C.E. along with a multitude of other scriptures point to the 20th century for the restoration of Jehovah's visible organization.

  If you are referring to the business documents as "fragments", then your statment is false. They don't conflict with Biblical chronology concerning the fall of Jerusalem. If by "fragments" you mean the astronomical diaries, then your statement is false. These, also, do not conflict with Biblical concerning the fall of Jerusalem. All these fragments DO conflict with the WT's version of history. This, however, is the WT's problem. And your problem.

  You can call it strictly a matter of Watchtower interpretation if you choose, but after Carl Jonson's interpretation a person is left completely clueless as to when Jehovah will intervene and act on behalf of human society.

  The Bible provides a great "big picture" at Jeremiah 25:11. Unfortunately, for the WTB&TS' interpretation to be correct, we would all have to ignore grammar. This is one of the principle points in "The Gentile Times Reconsidered". Please read it! It shows how all of the scriptures involved, if read grammatically and in context, agree with the historical sources 100% of the time; and how all of the scriptures involved agree with the WT's version of history 0% of the time.

  And all this land must become a devastated place, an object of astonishment, and these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon seventy years.”’ Jeremiah 25:11

  The reason “these nations” was used in Jeremiah 25:11 is because the nation of Israel divided in 997 B.C.E. The Northern Kingdom was taken by Assyria and the Southern Kingdom by Babylon. Although Nebuchadnezzar held supreme rulership during Jerusalem's destruction, not every nation and surrounding region could have become a devastated place and taken into captivity. The context clearly indicates the prophecy was primarily against the tribe of Judah:

  “From the thirteenth year of Josiah the son of A′mon, the king of Judah, and down to this day, these twenty-three years the word of Jehovah has occurred to me, and I kept speaking to you people, rising up early and speaking, but you did not listen. Jeremiah 25:3
  
• 
  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Spade

  Everyone here has completely missed the point, that the Bible is a highly unified book that points to a time when God's Kingdom as a visible organization will emerge from Christendom and will put an end to all other kingdoms.
  
  “And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite; forasmuch as you beheld that out of the mountain a stone was cut not by hands, and [that] it crushed the iron, the copper, the molded clay, the silver and the gold. The grand God himself has made known to the king what is to occur after this. And the dream is reliable, and the interpretation of it is trustworthy.” Daniel 2:44-45

  The excavated heterogeneous fragments that conflict with the Bible's historical cannon don't compare with the complete and harmonious Biblical chronology, which gives us a time-line without contradictions, showing the total fulfillment of every prophecy Jehovah gave us.
  
  it-1 p. 310 Bible
  
  The Bible is not an unrelated assortment or collection of heterogeneous fragments from Jewish and Christian literature. Rather, it is an organizational book, highly unified and interconnected in its various segments, which indeed reflect the systematic orderliness of the Creator-Author himself. God’s dealings with Israel in giving them a comprehensive law code as well as regulations governing matters even down to small details of camp life—things that were later mirrored in the Davidic kingdom as well as in the congregational arrangement among first-century Christians—reflect and magnify this organizational aspect of the Bible.
  
  I provided some information that you think would allow a person to step back and look at the big picture. As for the meticulous details, the fact of the matter is the archeology is there to support the end of Jewish exile at 537 B.C.E. From this date, count back seventy years to 607 B.C.E. as the year for Jerusalem's destruction. It's just that simple. None of these facts will not go away if you choose to ignore them. Maybe the Bible as the unerring, inspired Word of God has been repudiated by most here.
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  382

  The Gentile Times Reconsidered

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  disproving the date 1914 as a significant year in bible prophecy is of great importance to some (e.g.

  carl o. jonsson).

  along with the meticulous details of bible and secular chronology, broadening one's horizons when assessing exactly what this date represents when compared against the 6000 years of human history likewise has merit.

  1. 
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  3. 
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  Spade

  "Source? Or is this like saying "Nine out of ten doctors agree..."

  At Ezra 1:1, reference is made to "the first year of Cyrus," not "the year Cyrus became king" (or accession year), so he was speaking of the first regnal year of Cyrus, which cuneiform documentation places in 538/537 B.C.E. Jewish historian Josephus corroborates by referring to "the first year of the reign of Cyrus."—Antiquities of the Jews, Book XI, Chapter I.
  
  This point is generally agreed upon by historians. For instance, the Handbook of Bible Chronology by Jack Finegan (Princeton University Press, 1964), p. 170, states:
  
  "The biblical references to the first year of Cyrus when he made the proclamation which allowed the Jewish exiles to return from Babylon to Jerusalem (II Ch 36:22f.; Ezr 1:1f.) are presumably stated in terms of his reign in Babylon since they deal with an event in that city. According to the cuneiform evidence and the Babylonian calendar, Babylon fell on Tashritu 16 = Oct 12, 539 B.C., and Cyrus entered the city two and one-half weeks later on Arahsamnu 3 = Oct 29. His Babylonian regnal years began, therefore, as shown in Table 77. Accordingly his first year, in which he made the proclamation, was 538/537 B.C."
  
  TABLE 77. BABYLONIAN REGNAL YEARS OF CYRUS AT THE BEGINNING OF HIS REIGN
  
  Accession 539/538
  Year 1 538/537
  Year 2 537/536