Listener

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Posts by Listener

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  103

  New Research at AJWRB

  by Lee Elder in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  the latest research article published at ajwrb estimates the number of jehovah's witnesses who have died from following or being coerced to follow watchtower's blood policy.

  the numbers are staggering.

  http://ajwrb.org/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-tens-of-thousands-dead-in-hidden-tragedy.

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  Listener

  Dunedain, I hear you loud and clear.
  
  If the organization wants to accuse ex Jws of hate speech then let them site your comments as an example and see what sort of sympathy that incites.
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  25

  WT shooting themselves in the foot, or rather the mouth, finally

  by oppostate in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "stop the presses!".

  awesome blog article at bereans.net !.

  http://beroeans.net/2017/08/07/stop-the-presses/.

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  Listener

  This is what the November 2017 Watchtower states
  
  

  Beginning in the late 19th century,The WatchTower drew attention to the prophetic significance of the cities of refuge. “This feature of the typical Mosaic law strongly foreshadowed the refuge which the sinner may find in Christ,” stated the September1,1895, issue.“Seeking refuge in him by faith, there is protection.”

  A century later,The Watchtower identified the antitypical city of refuge as “God’s provision for protecting us from death for violating his commandment about the sanctity of blood.” However,the March15 ,2015, issue of The Watchtower explained why our recent publications seldom mention prophetic types and antitypes: “Where the Scriptures teach that an individual, an event, or an object is typical of something else, we accept it as such. Otherwise, we ought to be reluctant to assign an antitypical application to a certain person or account if there is no specific Scriptural basis for doing so.” Because the Scriptures are silent regarding any antitypical significance of the cities of refuge, this article and the next one emphasize instead the lessons Christians can learn from this arrangement.

  
  It is highly unlikely that any JW would get the significance of this 'new light'. Very few JWs would know that Rutherford used the Old Testament "Cities of Refuge" arrangement to support his Other Sheep theory in 1934 and 1935. However, it is highly likely that the writers of this statement knew exactly the significance of what they were saying. After all, they researched to as far back as 1895.
  
  It took Meleti, a very talented writer and researcher of Beroean Pickets, a great deal of effort to work out what scriptures, if any, the organization used to base it's 'other sheep' teaching on. He searched 2,233 occurrences of the 'other sheep' within the Watchtower library dating back to 1950 and the search didn't stop there. The only basis for the claim that Meleti could find was this silly interpretation by Rutherford.
  
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  21

  Making Every Thought Captive To Christ(Washing the Brain Of Good Reasoning)

  by Brokeback Watchtower in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  not a very good idea to say the least.

  when i read paul's words the more i see how delusional the guy was.

  he was a genuine religious fanatic who contradicts jesus words on the sermon on the mount.. 2 corinthians 10:5 5we demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of god, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to christ.. delusional and in need of some serious psychological help.

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  Listener

  I was surprised to learn how much of this one guy's writings made it into the NT.
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  26

  This convention talk offended me

  by Isambard Crater in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  here are my notes from the r.c yesterday, the talk called "jehovah – the greatest example of endurance".

  many of you will understand why i found it offensive.. jehovah has taken the hard option of choosing to endure:.

  reproach to his holy name.

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  Listener

  Apparently their Convention theme applied to God as well -

  Don't Give Up Jehovah
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  5

  wardrobe for tony M?

  by road to nowhere in

  1. social
  2. humour

  do you think it would be a good idea to take a collection to buy a zoot suit for tm?

  and some orange and green socks.. i also would like to find a way to make a shadow screen to put in the door to answer it when they come by.

  don't forget the odd accent..

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  Listener

  His pants are so baggy in this month's broadcast that it must have taken 10 metres of material to make them. They accentuate his weight.
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  49

  Rookie exJW Question

  by Phoebe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was wondering if someone could help me with a question.. i am a rookie exjw, i only left the organization 4 months ago and everything i've discovered (un/arc/malawi/mexico etc) i've only discovered in the last few months so you can image it's been a huge shock to me especially after after 50 yrs!.

  every time i think i've heard everything, something else pops up.. now i've come across a youtube video that mention tv evangelizer jimmy swaggart and the watchtower.

  i remember jimmy swaggart from the time i lived in the u.s.a and i remember the scandals with him and prostitutes etc.

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  Listener

  Thanks Orphan Crow for the link to the report the Watchtower lodged in regards to the Swaggart case.
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  12

  Spirit directed vs inspired

  by Jules Saturn in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i've always been confused as to what the discrepancy is between the phrases "spirit directed/spirit led" and "inspired".

  in the february 2017 watchtower study article, paragraph 12 says:.

  12 the governing body is neither inspired nor infallible.

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  Listener

  From the Insight Book under "Inspired"
  
  

  The quality or state of being moved by or produced under the direction of a spirit from a superhuman source. When that source is Jehovah, the result is a pronouncement or writings that are truly the word of God. The apostle Paul stated at 2 Timothy 3:16: “All Scripture is inspired of God.” The phrase “inspired of God” translates the compound Greek word the·oʹpneu·stos, meaning, literally, “God-breathed” or “breathed by God.”
  This is the only occurrence of this Greek term in the Scriptures. Its use here clearly identifies God as the Source and Producer of the Sacred Scriptures, the Bible. Their being “God-breathed” finds some parallel in the expression found in the Hebrew Scriptures at Psalm 33:6: “By the word of Jehovah the heavens themselves were made, and by the spirit [or breath] of his mouth all their army.”

  
  By saying that they are not inspired, by their own definition means that they are not
  
  "The quality or state of being moved by or produced under the direction of a spirit from a superhuman source ... God."
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  103

  Using Illegal Means for Righteous Activism

  by John Davis in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i wanted to get people's opinion on something.

  how do you feel when people use illegal means while performing their activism to shed light on the watchtower.

  there have been people who have illegally recorded conversations with elders and with branch offices or at meetings.

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  Listener

  My questions varied from a minor crime to what could possibly be a more serious crime in certain countries. You've admitted that you would be willing to commit a crime and you've justified your reason for doing so. The point is, it's not all black and white and it isn't mentally healthy to consider that under every single circumstance you would be willing to abide be the law.
  
  You say that recording Elders without their permission is more serious than not wearing a seat belt or illegally parking but didn't say whether it was less serious than refusing to go to war. That's your personal opinion, personally I think not wearing a seat belt can be far more serious. A parent could be charged with a very serious crime if they hadn't properly restrained their child and had a nasty accident. Or parking illegally could result in something terrible, e.g. parking next to a hydrant could result in the loss of lives if the fire brigade couldn't access it to put out a fire.
  
  We all have our own measuring stick to determine when and whether we would break a law, either minor or major. Not too long ago, homosexual acts were against the law and still are in many countries yet there are many who are so inclined who are prepared to break those laws, the result is that slowly laws have changed and there is more acceptance within society. It's one example of how laws do change, because people are not always willing to abide by the laws as they currently stand.
  
  It is a very minor thing to record an elder in a Judicial Committee without his permission. On the other hand, through that Judicial Committee the Elder has the power to judge you as non repentant and cause friends and family to shun you. There are many who find those recordings very beneficial, that's why people are prepared to break the law and do it. The good outweighs the bad.
  
  

  It is are you willing to obey the law no matter what your motive may be either good or bad.

  
  That would be black and white and even you admitted that you would break the law.
  
  In the latter part of your comments you seem to be attempting to correlate recording Elders as 'seeking vengeance'. That's a bit over the top, especially when most of the recorded JC's that I've seen don't appear to be doing it for that reason at all. It's more to do with exposing them and warning others.
  
  I agree with you, let the law take care of it. In the case of recordings, perfect, now let's see the Elders start reporting those crimes and let the legal system take care of it. The likelihood of that happening is very slim, but if it's such a bad thing to do then why don't the Elders report it. If someone broke into their KH and caused damage they'd report it and without doubt, recording JC's causes much more damage.
  
  Personally, I feel the whole motive behind your post is to scare individuals off from recording their JC.
  
  
  

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• 
  103

  Using Illegal Means for Righteous Activism

  by John Davis in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i wanted to get people's opinion on something.

  how do you feel when people use illegal means while performing their activism to shed light on the watchtower.

  there have been people who have illegally recorded conversations with elders and with branch offices or at meetings.

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  Listener

  JD- Wait JP are you saying that viewing the law as black and white is a sign of not being mentally healthy. I will have to disagree with you on that one. Not trying to justify breaking the law is not a mental health issue it is being a law abiding citizen.

  Does this mean you would follow the laws of your country no matter what they are?

  Let's say you were driving an injured person to hospital who was bleeding to death. Would you take the time to put their seatbelt on , even if it meant injuring them more? What if the only place you could stop to get them into the hospital meant illegally parking?

  What about being called up to serve in the front line during a war, with no options for alternative service, would you do that?

  Do you think the Watchtower has always been law abiding and will not deliberately break the law in the future?
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  49

  Rookie exJW Question

  by Phoebe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was wondering if someone could help me with a question.. i am a rookie exjw, i only left the organization 4 months ago and everything i've discovered (un/arc/malawi/mexico etc) i've only discovered in the last few months so you can image it's been a huge shock to me especially after after 50 yrs!.

  every time i think i've heard everything, something else pops up.. now i've come across a youtube video that mention tv evangelizer jimmy swaggart and the watchtower.

  i remember jimmy swaggart from the time i lived in the u.s.a and i remember the scandals with him and prostitutes etc.

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• 

  Listener

  Another video is this one, uploaded a couple of days ago

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pehwx1gAnw&t=5s
  
  I've heard it said that the organization were interested in the outcome of the case and filed as 'friends of the court' not to support Jimmy Swaggart but simply to legally express their interest in the outcome of the case. In the video above Jason Zelda shows a seven or eight page submission that the Watchtower lodged in this Swaggart court case. It would be interesting to see that report because from what Zelda is saying it does sound like the Watchtower were supporting Swaggart in believing that their should be no requirement to pay taxes.
  
  If nothing else, the fact that they filed their interest in this case seems to demonstrate that they believed neither Swaggart or themselves should be taxed. On that basis, it could be said that they supported Swaggart's claims and therefore, by extension, his ministry in the fact that Swaggart shouldn't be paying taxes and neither should they because they acknowledged that their activities were similar.