Conversations like this one might benefit from the clean and decisive application of Ockham's razor. When two explanations are tabled one must discard the one that explains the least, or the one that explains nothing at all, or the one that raises more questions than it answers. The application of God as a prime mover is guilty of all three. The cleanest, most decisive explanation of all the observations tabled in this thread is there is no creator of the universe. The universe is not even created, it is in a neverending process of being created and destroyed by itself. It is chaos. If convincing yourself that it is otherwise makes you happy, then by all means sail on.
Nickolas
JoinedPosts by Nickolas
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
We keep circling back to belief. Do you ever ask yourself, really ask yourself honestly, why you believe these things, why you believe in God and Jesus? Why you believe the things you do about Isreal and the end of the world as it is? Love is the only thing you can trust, but only if that love is real. This excludes faith because faith demands accepting as truth that which cannot be demonstrated.
And, yes, the world is a living hell, N. It has been ever thus. This is a fact. The world has always been a living hell. My parents' generation saw the horrors of WW2 and shared the deprivations of the great depression with their parents, who lived through the almost as horrible WW1. Previous generations lived under the repressive regimes of monarchs and priests who could end your life in the most brutal of ways with impunity. There has not been a golden age of humanity. However, the world is not getting worse, it is getting better, but only for some, like you and me. We can expect to live healthier, longer and more fulfilled lives than our parents. That is something you can measure. If there is any other measure that matters, I don't know what it is.
Pleasure chatting with you.
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
Eloquent, N, but is it true? I read what you have written above and my mind is filled with questions. What makes you believe these things so strongly? Was it the Bible the understanding of which you acknowledge is interpretive? It seems to me you have chosen to believe some things but not others, but that is what everyone who believes the Bible does, after all.
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
I do not believe the World is saved through good works. I think the world is saved by righteousness.
From whence did righteousness come, child?
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
I have similar beliefs as the Universalist I think, just by reading JWN. Bhagavad Gita has sparks of truth imo. I just googled it.
It was a bit of a rhetorical question, N. Are all holy books helpers? What about the Book of Mormon? The Talmud? Or The Tipitaka, The Kojiki, The Zend Avesta, The Guru Granth Sihib? Or all the other holy books? They all contradict one another. The Qu'ran specifically says the Bible is a fatally flawed, earlier revelation and following it will lead to eternal punishment in hell. It cannot be a helper at the same time it claims the Bible will lead to damnation. Since it follows that all of these books cannot be simultaneously right and wrong at the same time it follows that none of them are right.
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
Bhagavad Gita?
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
I don't believe the Bible is the perfect inalterable Word of God. So your right!
added: Why do you disbelieve some parts but believe others?
The Bible is a helper. It is lesser than me.
Why not the Qu'ran?
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
Air needs wind. God needs nothing.
The Bible told me. Oh my! I may or may not have figured it out myself. I'll never know.
Ah. Who told you the Bible is credible? Why not the Qu'ran? 1.1 billion people believe it is the perfect and inalterable Word of God. Could they possibly be wrong? Of course they can. Could your belief that the Bible is the perfect and inalterable Word of God possibly be wrong too?
Anything you figure out for yourself that involves the creation of the universe is going to be very, very simple and will by definition be wrong.
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
A spirit is that which is. It needs nothing to be maintianed.
That's mysterious, indeed. Who told you this?
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186
Questions From Thinkers
by Perry inhow do you explain david's graphic portrayal of jesus' death by crucifixion (psalm 22) 1000 years before christ lived?.
how do you account for the odds (1 in 10 to the 157th power) that even just 48 (of 300) old testament prophecies were fulfilled in jesus christ?.
in what sense was jesus a "good man" if he was lying in his claim to be god?.
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Nickolas
My what? LOL!
No, really. Who told you that God is a spirit?