Posts by Nickolas

29

Contradictions, should we really care?

by garyneal in

i'm not sure if the title is appropriate but i figured i'd point out some contradictions i see in jehovah's witnesses like my wife and i often ask myself why should i care when obviously she does not?

the motivation to 'fit in' with the people who you believe 'have the truth' is a strong one and facts are rendered powerless since in the end i get asked, "so what do you have that is better?

" but like morpheous on the movie, the matrix, all i have to offer is the truth.. .

Nickolas

Some really thoughtful perspectives from Shelby and Terry. I can see that your challenge is rather different from mine, Gary, insofar as you can pursue a scriptural solution to greater effect than I can. My wife sees me as a non-believer, so whatever purely Christian logic I might apply will have a muted effect. Citing biblical references are still worthwhile in my case, but my wife will see secular proofs coming from me as more in line with my headspace. A few years ago, when I was not yet a defacto atheist (See Dawkins' scale of 1-7, 1 being a strong Theist who's belief in God is absolute and 7 being a strong Atheist who's non-belief in God is absolute. I'm a 6.) a purely scriptural approach would probably have worked for me. My fault for waiting this long.

Thanks for starting the thread. Horizons of possibility and understanding continue to expand.

29

Contradictions, should we really care?

by garyneal in

i'm not sure if the title is appropriate but i figured i'd point out some contradictions i see in jehovah's witnesses like my wife and i often ask myself why should i care when obviously she does not?

the motivation to 'fit in' with the people who you believe 'have the truth' is a strong one and facts are rendered powerless since in the end i get asked, "so what do you have that is better?

" but like morpheous on the movie, the matrix, all i have to offer is the truth.. .

Nickolas

Hey there, Gary. I think sometimes you and I are kindred spirits (insofar as our life's greatest challenge is the same). There are no contradictions. It is only that your understanding of things is not as advanced as a Jehovah's Witness. Things that appear to be contradictions are either simply not contradictions at all or are dichotomies, maybe. Except your half of the dichotomy is always wrong. That's all. Those things you're having trouble with, they're sort of like alexandrite stones that change colour depending on the kind of light shone on them. You just don't use the right kind of light, you see. You need Watchtower Light in order to understand. If you don't use Watchtower Light then you'll see those things you're talking about as contradictions but the real contradiction is only in your mind. See? Every once in awhile Watchtower Light changes. That's ok, because all it does is change the coloration of the thing a little. It's still the same, though. Just like the alexandrite stone. It's just that the light is different, not the thing itself. See? Clear now? Glad I could clear that up for you.

http://www.alexandrite.net/chapters/faq/why-does-alexandrite-appear-to-change-color-in-sunlight-and-artificial-light.html

49

Shackled to the Watchtower: A distinction every Jehovah's Witness should acknowledge

by Nickolas in

jw
friends

if one was to take a poll of all the registered users of this board he might be surprised by the number of people who still attend meetings and/or still go door to door.

a contributor to a recent thread, expressing worry that she is on the threshold of being outed, posited that fear is what fills the seats in the kingdom hall.

fear, not love.

Nickolas

Heh. Yeah. I understand, Shelby. I understand you better than you do me. I was once where you are. You have never been where I am.

I will wish you both Peace and Security. Those where the words I was supposed to listen for back in 1975 when I was a jr-JW, or JW-cadet or whatever else you call someone taking bible studies with the JWs and going to assemblies and meetings. Armageddon was imminent. The sky was going to turn scarlet any day now and then the great Tribulation would come and hallelujah there'd be the Kingdom! and I wuz gonna be saved, hallelujah brothers and sisters! But only when everyone was using the words "peace and security" in that order would it happen. Preferably the UN would be repeating it over and over again on the radio and TV, but it might come from some other Satanic organisation. I actually believed this mental diarrhea to be true for a time and, not saying it is the same thing, I actually believed what you believe to be true for a much longer time after that. But I do enjoy most of your posts.

Nickolas

100

These are good people

by Retrovirus in

in my introductory post i told about the jws that have been visiting me at my sil's request.

at first i spoke with them for her sake, then found i liked them anyway.

what i didn't like was the literature, especially the stuff trying to disprove evolution.

Nickolas

The only bacon my wife cooks us is, turkey bacon- but, if I was starving, then I could eat some of that barbecue- just so I don't die from hunger.

Neither of my sons will eat bacon, and they're not even Jewish. One will eat ersatz bacon (turkey) but the other won't eat it unless it's made from soybeans. Soybeans. I clawed myself up to the top of the food chain so that my progeny could eat tofu. One will eat fish and birds but no mammals. The other will eat fish, no other animals. My daughter will eat no fish but will eat the meat of birds and mammals, so long as they have no bones in them. Bones remind her that the meat is from animals. I think I screwed up with these kids. Fact is I know I did. 25 years ago I came home from a weekend hunting trip with the biggest bull moose I'd ever seen in my life in the back of my pickup. The kids were raised on wild meat so I just figured they knew where it came from. Wrong. I had been tracking and calling this animal for more than a day and it finally obliged me by exiting the trees just before sunset. He was with a cow moose and proceeded to mount her. He was 75 feet away. I waited until he was done (I averted my eyes, of course) and then I shot him in the forehead with a Browning .308 180 grain softnose and he dropped like a sack of potatoes. If there is a god, he will grant me the gift of dying like that. Anyway, when I got home the kids ran out to greet me at the driveway and I was so proud of myself that I picked each of them up and put them in the box of the pickup to get a real close-up look at this beast their heroic dad had felled. He was 1500# on the hoof and had a 62" rack, a hole in his forehead, his eyes bulging slighly in their sockets and his tongue lolling to one side out of his mouth. Not to mention all the gore in the pickup box. That was the last moose I ever shot, and it's why my kids don't eat bacon.

100

These are good people

by Retrovirus in

in my introductory post i told about the jws that have been visiting me at my sil's request.

at first i spoke with them for her sake, then found i liked them anyway.

what i didn't like was the literature, especially the stuff trying to disprove evolution.

Nickolas

Ok, debator. Don't read the next paragraph. It's just me talking to the other people in the thread. Not to you.

I wonder, frankly, why we bother with this person. She/he won't answer questions, is always changing the subject and without fail reverts to rote programming. It is sad to say that I have encountered no-one on this board who thinks highly of debator, because if one strips away all the really screwed up cookie-cutter thinking debator puts forward, there is a hint of intelligence. I sometimes wonder if it isn't all an act. Can anybody be so blind?

49

Shackled to the Watchtower: A distinction every Jehovah's Witness should acknowledge

by Nickolas in

jw
friends

if one was to take a poll of all the registered users of this board he might be surprised by the number of people who still attend meetings and/or still go door to door.

a contributor to a recent thread, expressing worry that she is on the threshold of being outed, posited that fear is what fills the seats in the kingdom hall.

fear, not love.

Nickolas

I bid you peace too, friend. Do we understand one another?

49

Shackled to the Watchtower: A distinction every Jehovah's Witness should acknowledge

by Nickolas in

jw
friends

if one was to take a poll of all the registered users of this board he might be surprised by the number of people who still attend meetings and/or still go door to door.

a contributor to a recent thread, expressing worry that she is on the threshold of being outed, posited that fear is what fills the seats in the kingdom hall.

fear, not love.

Nickolas

I dunno, Shelby. Sometimes we seem to be splitting hairs (so you don't think the Society isn't a "manifestation". Ok, then it's a puppet. Whatever. It ain't good).

I realize that it may be hard for you to believe, dear one, that I, just some lady at a computer in a corner of her home... and not some seminary-educated "theologian", or religious council-recognized/other scholar... would be privy to this information. Believe me, for some years it surprised me even more than it does you. Truly, I am not foolish enough to think that I am something or somebody. To the contrary, I absolutely know that I am nobody, a good-for-nothing servant... a little black girl somewhere in California, USA... with nothing to offer anyone... other than the truth.

I could almost hear the fifes and drums and the violins in the background, and picture the innocent doe-eyes, index finger poised tentatively at your mouth, little ribbons in pigtails, short flowered dress, bobby socks and saddle shoes kicking shyly in the dirt. You are as much a mercenary for your brand of truth as all the others who prosthelytise in here. No offense, old girl.

100

These are good people

by Retrovirus in

in my introductory post i told about the jws that have been visiting me at my sil's request.

at first i spoke with them for her sake, then found i liked them anyway.

what i didn't like was the literature, especially the stuff trying to disprove evolution.

Nickolas

(early ancestors where observably complex civilisations not ape-like brutes from the evolution theory)

Wrong again. Early ancestors were not ape-like. They were proto-human-like. Get your facts straight, Reniaa. However, are you saying there were observably complex civilisations prior to the Garden? I realise this cannot be, but it sure sounds like it.

Evolutionists cling to what they do know while ignoring the glaring problems

Such as?

100

These are good people

by Retrovirus in

in my introductory post i told about the jws that have been visiting me at my sil's request.

at first i spoke with them for her sake, then found i liked them anyway.

what i didn't like was the literature, especially the stuff trying to disprove evolution.

Nickolas

Well, OUTLAW, I do enjoy eating pigs. I particularly like BBQed back ribs, but one roasted whole over a spit is also delectable. Perhaps the chase would be worth it?

100

These are good people

by Retrovirus in

in my introductory post i told about the jws that have been visiting me at my sil's request.

at first i spoke with them for her sake, then found i liked them anyway.

what i didn't like was the literature, especially the stuff trying to disprove evolution.

Nickolas

Many scientists, I even think the majority of scientists, have personal religious beliefs.

Nope. It's only 40%. And these are American scientists. Compare this to the percentage of all Americans (93%) who say they believe in god. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1355/is_n22_v91/ai_19332942/