Posts by fulltimestudent

I've been forgetting to keep up with the South Korean pop-scene. Its one of the most edgy pop scenes in the world. Yesterday I met up with a South Korean student friend and we had a talk about contemporary life in South Korea. He suggested I look at this 2012 song. I should explain that the SK pop scene is likely the most competitive in the world. The owners (usually companies) will do anything to peddle their latest production.

So here's a few clips piggy backing on Troublemaker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQxZvQMfJOk

3

What I know so far..

by Crazyguy in

jw
friends

its been about a year and a half since i started being on this site.

before i came to this site i had already blown up in my mind several of the key teachings of the org.

the final ones were their teaching on christ being the mediator only for the 144k and all it entails, they also only being in the new covenant etc.

fulltimestudent

Crazyguy:

This common language helps to dispel them being from Egypt for if they were in Egypt for 400 years they would have probably spoke Egyptian. There is no archeological evidence of an exodus from Egypt but plenty that they were very much Phoenician/Canaanites.

The Egyptian Connection.

I essentially agree with what you say, but may I suggest to you that you can find a connection to Egypt in the successive Egyptian invasions and occupations of territory along the eastern Mediterranean coast.

Donald Redford's book, Egypt, Canaan, and Israel in Ancient Times, may be of assistance to your study.

Amazob: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0691000867/ref=nosim/dannyyeesbook-20

Book Description:

Covering the time span from the Paleolithic period to the destruction of Jerusalem in 586 B.C., the eminent Egyptologist Donald Redford explores three thousand years of uninterrupted contact between Egypt and Western Asia across the Sinai land-bridge. In the vivid and lucid style that we expect from the author of the popular Akhenaten , Redford presents a sweeping narrative of the love-hate relationship between the peoples of ancient Israel/Palestine and Egypt.

and ...

Whenever one puts Egypt and Israel in the same sentence, the stories of Joseph and Moses springs to mind, at least to Christians such as myself. This book shows that there is a lot more to it than this. Starting from 5000 years ago, the book traces in great detail the history of Egypt for 3000 years, and particularly its relation with its Asian neighbors in the lands of Canaan and beyond. In here we get to learn about the Canaanites, Phoenicians, Hittites, and Assyrians, as well as Egypt's African neighbors such as the Kushites and the Libyans. The book is extremely well-researched, drawing upon a vast wealth of archeological findings and recently discovered ancient texts and tablets, as well as the various sources of recorded history. The book is exceptional in terms of acknowledging in detail all the possible competing theories and explanations before thoroughly proving the author's theories beyond doubt through impeccable logic. The notes alone fill almost a hundred pages! But volume is far from being a dry history text. The writing is exceptional, almost bringing the ancient pharaohs and ordinary people to life in its realistic and thorough description of life in those ancient times.

The core of the book concentrates on the relationship between Egypt and the land of Canaan or southern Syria. Thus the book analyses the Hyksos invasion in detail and introduces us to the countless wars and treaties between Egypt and its Asian neighbors. Of particular interest in this book is the rise of the Hebrews, nomadic tribes from Southern Jordan who later became known as the Israelites. This book illustrates how their history has become misrepresented over the years, sometimes by well-meaning but unscholarly "Biblical scholars" who take the word of the Bible literally. Thus this book goes a long way towards establishing a history based on scientific analysis of facts, rather than purely on spiritual beliefs. Though long and tedious at times, it is a rewarding read that provides many of the answers to the most intriguing questions: Was Joseph a historical figure, and if so, is there any evidence? How did the Egyptians view their relationships with Asia? Are there any Egyptian records of the story of Moses? Why does Egypt not play a significant role during the reign of say, King David? These are all basic and fundamental questions that are of interest to all Christians, Jews, and Moslems, and the answers can all be found in this book.

6

Corruption in China

by fulltimestudent in

consider this scenario:.

a young lawyer is elected mayor of the city and promises to rid it of the corruption it's famous for.

the problem is that most of the corruption he's vowed to eliminate is caused by the crooked political machine that helped elect him.. .

fulltimestudent

As a footnote to the Imperial Examinations, its interesting to note that Hong XiuQuan, son of a poor farmer, sat for the Imperial examination four times and did not pass. He became a Christian and decided that the Christian God wanted him to rid China of demon Gods.

He preached a mixture of communal utopianism, evangelism, and Christianity. While proclaiming sexual equality, the sect segregated men from women and encouraged all its followers to pay their assets into a communal treasury. [6] By the end of the 1840s, Hong had a sizeable following which he called the God Worshippers (拜上帝會), but local officials still attempted to suppress his religious movement after his move to Guangxi. [4]

Hong stayed at the Yuan Floral Hall (袁氏花廳) in Shiling, Guangzhou (c. 1845–1847) where he studied, preached, developed his revolutionary theory and wrote many of his famous works. [7]

In 1847 Hong studied with the American Southern Baptist missionary, Reverend Issachar Jacox Roberts, for two months in Guangzhou, during which time he gained most of his knowledge of Christianity. [4] He formally studied the Old Testament. After Hong asked Roberts for aid in maintaining his sect, Roberts (wary of people converting to Christianity for economic aid) refused to baptise him. [8]

Most of Hong Xiuquan's knowledge of the scriptures came from the books known as "Good Words to Admonish the Age" by the Chinese preacher Liang Fa as well as a localized Bible translated into Chinese. Many Western missionaries grew jealous of Hong and his local ministry. These missionaries were fond of spreading rumors about him, one such rumor being that he had not been baptized (Hong and his cousin were in fact both baptized according to the way prescribed in the pamphlet "Good words to admonish the age"). [9]

......

By 1850 Hong had between 10,000 and 30,000 followers. The authorities were alarmed at the growing size of the sect and ordered them to disperse. A local force was sent to attack them when they refused, but the imperial troops were routed and a deputy magistrate killed. A full-scale attack was launched by government forces in the first month of 1851, in what came to be known as the Jintian Uprising , named after the town of Jintian (present-day Guiping , Guangxi ) where the sect was based. Hong's followers emerged victorious and beheaded the Manchu commander of the government army. Hong declared the founding of the "Heavenly Kingdom of Transcendent Peace" on 11 January 1851.

...

However, in March 1853, Hong's forces managed to take Nanjing and turned it into the capital of their movement.

After establishing his capital at Nanjing Hong implemented an ambitious programme of reforms. He created an elaborate civil bureaucracy, reformed the calendar used in his kingdom, outlawed opium use, and introduced a number of reforms designed to make women more socially equal to men. [2] Hong ruled by making frequent proclamations from his Heavenly Palace, demanding strict compliance with various moral and religious rules. Most trade was suppressed and property socialized. Polygamy was forbidden and men and women were separated, although Hong and other leaders maintained groups of concubines.

From a DEViant Art comic

Hong Xiuquan's throne on exhibition.

Hong's attempt to create a "Christian China" almost succeeded. However, he made a strategic error in 1860 when his forces attacked Shanghai, then governed by Christian Europeans who had their own designs on China.

Now Christian Europeans, with an army eventually under the command of the devout Christian, General Charles Gordon. In 1864, the old story of Christian killing Christian was repeated and the Taiping, the heavenly kingdom of peace came to its end.

Up to 50 million people may have died in this rebellion that attempted to change the course of Chinese History.

I have a little booklet published by the CPC praising the Taiping as an example of a peasant army fighting entrenched corruption and injustice

(Sorry for the off-topic diversion, but the Taiping rebellion is a fascinating topic)

6

Corruption in China

by fulltimestudent in

consider this scenario:.

a young lawyer is elected mayor of the city and promises to rid it of the corruption it's famous for.

the problem is that most of the corruption he's vowed to eliminate is caused by the crooked political machine that helped elect him.. .

fulltimestudent

The concept of corruption in Imperial times.

The political structure of China in most dynasties was of an all powerful Emperor, who was advised by an extensive well-educated bureacracy who also administered the law and implemented Imperial decrees. To gain a place in that bureaucracy candidates had to study very hard and sit for a public examination. As a system, it likely had some important advantages. The examinations were relatively open. If influential people in a certain district heard of a bright young man, they may well pay for his education with the goal of being able to use his influence if he was succesful. (you can see where that could go).

The Imperial Examination

The origins of the exam system lie in the Han period, but the early scholarly examinations were consolidated during the Sui period, and began to be truly effective under the Tang Dynasty. Between the Tang period and the late Qing, the civil service examinations dropped out of use for short periods and underwent occasional reform. But the content remained remarkably constant. The core texts consisted of the Four Books and the Five Classics, works attributed to Confucius and certain of his disciples, along with a number of approved commentaries.

Until the Guanxu Reforms of 1898, the notorious eight-legged essay, a rigid traditional format, was the mainstay of the exam papers. Rote learning of the Confucian classics was fundamental to success in the exams, and the scholar who obtained the highest degree, the jinshi, would have his memory trained to a tremendous degree. Texts of a total of over 400,000 characters had to be thoroughly memorised if a candidate was to have any hope of progressing to a civil service position, and even at the district level, the pass rate was only 1 or 2%.

Joining the Imperial Civil Service

To obtain a civil service post, a candidate had to pass through several stages, starting with preliminary local exams, and progressing, if successful, through to district, provincial and palace examinations. Exams were held every three years. The district degree was the shengyuan, which entailed exemption from both corporal punishment and the corvee labour dues, the right to wear a scholar's robes, and a small state salary. Essentially, a successful candidate became a member of the gentry.

To obtain a civil service position, a scholar generally required the juren provincial degree, which would take would take years of study, and even a candidate could not reasonably expect to do so before he was thirty. Many candidates who were eventually successful did not achieve office until they had reached a venerable age. The jinshi degrees were prospects for only a very few exceptional scholars. For the very highest ministerial posts, the best examination essays were selected by the Emperor himself.

A Meritocratic Aristocracy

Aristocracy-by-examination had far-reaching consequences. A high degree of national stability was ensured despite changes of emperor and dynasty because the civil service, fuelled by the exam system, could continue independently of the imperial regime. Even China's foreign conquerors, the Mongols and the Manchu, realised the benefits of the examination system. Despite denigrating Han Chinese scholars as the “Stinking Ninth” in their social ranking, the Mongols of the Yuan Dynasty retained the system. The Manchu tribesmen who captured Beijing in 1644 to found the Qing Dynasty restored the civil service examinations only two years later, and although they excluded Han Chinese from the highest echelons of the Civil Service, they clearly recognised the adhesive value of the exams in binding the Han intelligentsia to the Qing regime.

Most importantly, the civil examinations provided a conduit for the aspirations of able men from almost any social stratum. While there are a few famous literary instances of women dressing up as men to take the exams, in practice, women were entirely excluded from the system. But amongst men, the exams were generally open to all, with the exception of a few classes such as actors and slaves.

Undoubtedly, success in the examinations was easier for the well-off. In the late Qing period in particular, corruption was widespread; examiners could be bribed, and early stages of the exam process could be skipped for a fee. Tutors, books and brushes all cost money, so poor candidates were at a disadvantage even during periods when bribery was frowned upon. Despite this, many poor scholars did succeed in their ambitions. During the Qing period, over a third of jinshi degree holders came from families with little or no educational background. Nor was the system biased towards the inhabitants of the capital. Degrees were awarded to scholars from throughout China; indeed the provinces of Jiangsu and Zhejiang boasted the greatest number of jinshi graduates.

From a 2002 essay by Justin Crozier, published in China in Focus magazine. (web-link: http://www.sacu.org/examinations.html )

The Emperor often became a figure-head in this system, in which case the bureaucracy just kept on doing what it was supposed to - run the country.

Of course, some of their tasks were more esoteric, as in this painting of scholars in the Northern Qi dynasty collating classic texts.

The above painting is held today in the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston

Sinologist John K. Fairbank, in his book, China: A New History (Cambridge: Belknap Press of Harvard University Press, 2006) describes the scene,

... the four scholars shown in this detail [the left-hand side of this painting above shown in his book] are at play as well as at work. Although the two seated on the far side of the large wooden platform have their brushes and papers in hand, the foreground pair appear to be smiling and teasing each other with pushing and pulling, while a small boy removes shoes on the right. Two maid-servants have set out cups and heaping dishes and food, but one dish has been knocked over by the playful pair. On the left edge of the platform are still more diversions—a musical instrument, the qin (zither), and equipment for competing at throwing arrows into a vase.

Some may say, were Public Servants ever different? But that would be unfair to many clever men who worked hard in the assigned posts.

The Northern Qi dynasty ruled part of north China for about 25 years in the 6th century CE. History tells us that the State was plagued by corrupt officials.

6

Corruption in China

by fulltimestudent in

consider this scenario:.

a young lawyer is elected mayor of the city and promises to rid it of the corruption it's famous for.

the problem is that most of the corruption he's vowed to eliminate is caused by the crooked political machine that helped elect him.. .

fulltimestudent

Consider this scenario:

A young lawyer is elected mayor of the city and promises to rid it of the corruption it's famous for. The problem is that most of the corruption he's vowed to eliminate is caused by the crooked political machine that helped elect him.

When you read that description, where do you think the story is located?

If you cannot guess, I'll make the answer simple (it's not really important to the topic). That was a summary of the screenplay for a 1933 film in the USA. ( web-link: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0023909/ ). Machine politics in the USA of that era, had the reputation of being notoriously corrupt. I use the film to illustrate my contention that the root cause of corruption is human venality.

A problem in discussing this subject is to be able to definite corruption. Modern western thinking states that paying a bribe is a corrupt act. OK, consider this. Today, western States set fees for services provided by the State on what is called the 'user pays,'principle. But what if, in a less sophisticated state, the issuing authority is an unpaid political appointee, authorised by the primary State to collect fees that provide for his livelihood (or, self enrichment) ? Where is the line at which the user-pays principle ends and corruption starts? In that situation does the word 'corruption' have any meaning at all?

I don't want to get lost in an endless discussion concerning what is coruuption. My goal in this thread is to attempt to provide an overview of what is happening in China today. It is however neccessary to provide background. So the first few posts will attempt to provide such an overview

20

One language in the new system

by OneEyedJoe in

so at the convention, one of the talks was about how all people will speak a single language in the new system.

my ears perked up when i heard at the outset "now, we can't be dogmatic about this" because that immediately makes me think that they're backing away from a previously dogmatic stance.

he went on to say that everyone will be speaking hebrew in the new system because "evidently" (another word that gets my ears to perk up these days) that was what was spoken before the languages were confused at bable.

fulltimestudent

I recall this as being one of Freddie's concepts.

Whether it existed as a belief before Freddie's time, i.e. in Charlie Russels time, is something I'm not sure about, but clearly it fits in with the mythology of the Bible Students.

It is, as an idea, totally dependent on the witness/biblical myth**, a myth that is undermined by the archeology of human migrations across the globe, and the modern study of languages.

I have neither the inclination nor the time to do a more complete study on the topic, but by using google scholar, it is possible to locate some scholarly studies on the origins of the Hebrew language.

I've found:

A History of the Hebrew Language, By Angel Sáenz-Badillos ( Cambridge University Press (English trans. 1993) Google Books extracts. Web-link: http://books.google.com.au/books?hl=en&lr=&id=EZCgpaTgLm0C&oi=fnd&pg=PR11&dq=how+old+is+hebrew+as+a+language&ots=YfkwNVFGBD&sig=rZoHRc5TJIEU4ZCUGVxDgz76UsY#v=onepage&q=how%20old%20is%20hebrew%20as%20a%20language&f=false -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oneeyedjoe's post does not state whether the speaker differentiated between modern Hebrew and ancient Hebrew. There is a difference. This book may help us to understand the difference

Front Cover

The Schizoid Nature of Modern Hebrew: A Slavic Language in Search of a Semitic Past, By Paul Wexler. Otto Harrassowitz, 1990

Google Books Extracts: Web-link: http://books.google.com.au/books?hl=en&lr=&id=q_ebGe7FhVEC&oi=fnd&pg=PA1&dq=how+old+is+hebrew+as+a+language&ots=JpERJYNsTj&sig=gTzZ3wFc_1SZkRPlV-i9x3oSB_Q#v=onepage&q=how%20old%20is%20hebrew%20as%20a%20language&f=false

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and:

Is Biblical Hebrew a language?

Edward Ullendorff

ABSTRACT:

There is no need to explain what I mean by “Biblical Hebrew” (BH): I refer, of course, to the language of the major part of the Old Testament (OT) which is written in a Canaanite tongue clearly distinguished from the few chapters in Daniel and Ezra which are composed, or at any rate extant, in Aramaic. While we have no knowledge of the precise nature of the language spoken by the Hebrew immigrants into Canaan, it is likely that from a linguistic point of view the OT owes more to the vanquished Canaanites than to the conquering Hebrews. The latter are called 'iḇrīm already in the Patriarchal narratives (Gen. xiv, 13, xl, 15, etc.), but their language ('iḇrīṯ) is never as such mentioned in the OT. This may, of course, be owing to one of those purely fortuitous circumstances in the transmission of the ancient Hebrew vocabulary with which this paper is in part concerned. Whether yәhūḏīṯ‘Jewish’ (2 Kings xviii, 26, Isa. xxxvi, 11, etc.), śәṗaṯ kәna'an ‘the language of Canaaan’ (Isa. xix, 18), and 'iḇrīṯ‘Hebrew’ (first attested in the prologue to Ben Sira) are wholly identical is—as I have endeavoured to show elsewhere—not fully established.

Footnotes

Text of the Presidential Address delivered to the Society for Old Testament Study, meeting at Oxford on 6 January 1971.

The above article is from a Cambriudge University Journal.

Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies

Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies / Volume 34 / Issue 02 / June 1971, pp 241-255

Your area library may be able to access that journal for you without charge.

The web-reference is: http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=4056200&fileId=S0041977X00129520

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** Grin-I'm referring to the myth that Yahweh created the first humans some 5000 odd years ago, and despite the disobedience of Adam and Eve, some humans 'walked with God,' perhaps literally (another grin) and those humans evolved into the glorious nation of Israel (when obedient to Yahweh) and to a train-wreck when disobedient.

16

I've got a Problem - exam tomorrow, and I can't get interested

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

by 09:20 tomorrow morning i've got to front up for an exam ( in my study unit, the new testament in its times).

and, even though two of the questions are known to me (and all the students sitting for the exam) - i'm finding it hard to concentrate.

the problem is not helped by having a dose of the flu - but i'm just finding it so hard to focus..

fulltimestudent

Second example:

Q. 8 The “Damascus Rule” from Qumran, section 6. (25%)

None of those brought into the Covenant shall enter the Temple to light His altar in vain. They shall bar the door, forasmuch as God said, Who among you will bar its door? And, You shall not light my altar in vain. (Malachi 1.10.) They shall take care to act according to the exact interpretation of the Law during the age of wickedness. They shall separate from the Sons of the Pit, and shall keep away from the unclean riches of wickedness acquired by vow or anathema or from the Temple treasure; they shall not rob the poor of His people, to make of widows their prey and of the fatherless their victim (Isaiah 10.2). They shall distinguish between clean and unclean, and shall proclaim the difference between holy and profane. They shall keep the Sabbath day according to its exact interpretation, and the feasts and the Day of Fasting according to the finding of the Members of the New Covenant in the land of Damascus. They shall set aside the holy things according to the exact teaching concerning them. They shall love each man his brother as himself; they shall succour the poor, the needy and the stranger.

This was an extract for one of the Dead Sea Scrolls. In this case I believe the examiner was looking for comments on how the passage may throw some light on NT documents, and possibly what evidence this document provided for the claim that the Qumran sectarins were also known as the Essenes

Some of the interesting points are (in my opinion):

This document was already known before the Qumran discoveries. The name 'Damascus Documeent' is derived from the references made to the 'New Covenant' made 'in the land of Damascus.' It is believed that this document was written around 100BCE, a conclusion supported by the absence of any mention of the 'Kittim' (Romans) who only invaded west Asia after 70BCE. The work is in two sections, an Exhortation made by the preacher (Likely a Guardian of the Community) to his 'sons' encouraging them to remain faithful. He teaches form the OT, that faithfullness is always rewarded and apostasy chastised by Yahweh. The document is an interesting read as there are some very unusual interporetations of OT Texts.

The second part is a list of Statutes (rules) that had to be kept. Some of these were sectarian re-interpretations of OT commandments pertaining to ourity the Sabbath vows etc.

In particular, the extract may find parallels in the Johhanine community writings - particularly the first letter of John.Some of the features of the extract above, include evidence for the influence of Dualism (borrowed from Zoroastrianism- sons of light versus sons of darkness sort of things. cf. 1 John 1:5-7 and 2: 7-10). Note, the need to be separate from apostates (the sons of the pit), the encouragement to loves their brothers cf. 1 Jo 4: 7-12. To succor the poor and needy. cf. Galatians 2:10

16

I've got a Problem - exam tomorrow, and I can't get interested

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

by 09:20 tomorrow morning i've got to front up for an exam ( in my study unit, the new testament in its times).

and, even though two of the questions are known to me (and all the students sitting for the exam) - i'm finding it hard to concentrate.

the problem is not helped by having a dose of the flu - but i'm just finding it so hard to focus..

fulltimestudent

Here's samples of the exam questions, for those who may want to try (grin):

First example.

Comment on the following passage's historical and literary context, and explain its historical significance. What point is the author making, and why? Pay particular attention to historical problems and other issues related to your chosen passage.

Q. 5 James 2.14-24. (25%)

What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can that faith save him? Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to him, “Go in peace, keep warm and well fed”, but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

But someone will say, “You have faith, I have deeds.” Show me your faith without actions, and I will show you my faith by my actions. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that – and shudder. You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. And the Scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness”, and he was called God's friend. You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.

What was looked for in an analysis of this passage, is the following (my understanding):

Who was the author, what evidence is there for your conclusion?

Who was the writer addressing? What evidence is there for that conclusion? I

s there evidence that permits dating of the document?

Are there parallel accounts in the other NT documents? Are there significant differences between them?

Do they help to explain this passage?

Do particular themes of the passage appear to represent special interests of this writer?