Joking is appropriate, because ALL religion is a joke.
fulltimestudent
JoinedPosts by fulltimestudent
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45
What language was Jesus most at home with?
by fulltimestudent inour former loving brothers and sisters have been instructed to think that, jesus likely spoke a form of hebrew and a form of aramaic.
(aid to bible understanding-103-105).
of course, there is no way to demonstrate the truth of that assertion or any other assertion about the languages that the common people of the land spoke.
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45
What language was Jesus most at home with?
by fulltimestudent inour former loving brothers and sisters have been instructed to think that, jesus likely spoke a form of hebrew and a form of aramaic.
(aid to bible understanding-103-105).
of course, there is no way to demonstrate the truth of that assertion or any other assertion about the languages that the common people of the land spoke.
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fulltimestudent
This conversation (to date) illustrates the problem we have with early Christianity. We just do not have enough information to be confident about the early developments.
To get too heated (as opposed to enthusiasm for an idea) will lead nowhere, because sooner or later you come to a dead end.
So it is with the GoT (abbreviation for the Gospel of Thomas) - I can't say that my exposure to biblical scholarship is all-embracing, but in the one year in which I attended weekly lectures and tutorials, (conducted by an excellent biblical scholar, with whom I got on well, in spite of his being a committed believer and knowing that I was an uncommitted disbeliever at a University with one of the best early Christian departments in Australia), I hope that I learnt something (Also note, I have no axe to grind, no doctrine to defend, just a passion to understand how I wasted my life in a unorthodox Christian group).
So which scholars believe GoT is Q? I can't remember any names being mentioned, although that's no proof.
And there is a another question for passionate believers in GoT being Q (or, at least a development of Q), do we then accept the Acts of Thomas as being true? If yes, then when you read, as an example, in the Acts of Thomas 57 (Apologies for the dated English, there are better versions available, but I've no time to search for one):
57 Again he took me and showed me a cave exceeding dark, breathing out a great stench, and many souls were looking out desiring to get somewhat of the air, but their keepers suffered them not to look forth. And he that was with me said: This is the prison of those souls which thou sawest: for when they have fulfilled their torments for that which each did, thereafter do others succeed them: and there be some that are wholly consumed and (some, Syr.) that are delivered over unto other torments. And they that kept the souls which were in the dark cave said unto the man that had taken me: Give her unto us that we may bring her in unto the rest until the time cometh for her to be delivered unto torment. But he answered them: I give her not unto you, for I fear him that delivered her to me: for I was not charged to leave her here, but I take her back with me until I shall receive order concerning her. And he took me and brought me unto another place wherein were men being sharply tormented (Syr. where men were). And he that was like unto thee took me and delivered me to thee, saying thus to thee: Take her, for she is one of the sheep that have gone astray. And I was taken by thee, and now am I before thee. I beseech thee, therefore, and supplicate that I may not depart unto those places of punishment which I have seen.
From "The Apocryphal New Testament" Translation and notes by M. R. James
Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1924Clearly, these are all imaginative stories, told to influence the lives and actions of others. And, that is the function of all religious writings and also the oral stories, which are now lost to us.
At present Q is an imagined document. It may have existed, if it did, I imagine it to be like the hand-written notes that may be taken down at a lecture. Most likely, some people wrote down things they heard Jesus say and that impressed them, As his death receded into the past, and those who heard him speak got older, someone may have attempted to collect some of those notes. They would be scribbled of course, and brief. There were no desks to write on, when Jesus was lecturing. The sort of people we are dealing with were not scribes, and may have had only primitive writing materials, but if Q existed, it's origins may have been like that.
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What language was Jesus most at home with?
by fulltimestudent inour former loving brothers and sisters have been instructed to think that, jesus likely spoke a form of hebrew and a form of aramaic.
(aid to bible understanding-103-105).
of course, there is no way to demonstrate the truth of that assertion or any other assertion about the languages that the common people of the land spoke.
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fulltimestudent
Our former loving brothers and sisters have been instructed to think that, Jesus likely spoke a form of Hebrew and a form of Aramaic. (Aid to Bible Understanding-103-105)
Of course, there is no way to demonstrate the truth of that assertion or any other assertion about the languages that the common people of the land spoke. But, historically we can demonstrate what languages are more likely to have been used.
We do know that in 332 BCE, a Greek army commanded by Alexander the Great marched through Palestine (after beseiging Tyre), beginning centuries of Greek influence and political control. By the time of Jesus political control had been ceded to Rome and soldiers speaking Latin controlled the a land, but Greek culture and language seemed to have remained prevalent. This is demonstrated when, a few centuries later the Eastern Roman Empire, with its capital located at Constantinople, used Greek as its language.
So what about the claim in the Aid book? Ex-witnesses may be interested in the arguments of a scholar G.Scott Gleaves (Dean and Associate Professor, Kearley Graduate School of Theology, Faulkner) in this essay:
Did Jesus Speak Greek?
http://www.bibleinterp.com/articles/2015/09/gle398009.shtml
He argues - Contrary to contemporary scholarship, I find that Greek was more widely used in both written and oral form by Jesus, his disciples, and the Jews who inhabited first-century Palestine. Interestingly, the evidence reveals that Greek became the dominant language spoken among Jews and Gentiles in Galilee in the first century CE.
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A problem with the book of Daniel
by wozza inleft the wts some years ago, but just before i left we were studying the daniel book that they produced in the book study .. i noticed something wrong in the bible account of daniel and brought this up at the end of the study when the conductor asked if everyone understood that nights study,.
i think i may have started a topic here some years ago about this event ,it was a time when i started to question the wts in my heart and mind.the scriptures are lengthy so i will just shorten things by describing the stories in daniel and how one point really got me thinking about things and perhaps made the brothers wierd out about me sand distance themselves ,here it is..........dan ch 1-4. daniels ( who came to be called belteshazzar)in babylon along with shadrach,meshach & abednego ,daniel,after praying with these 3, interprets and states what nebuchadnezzars dream is( we all know this ,the image with the head of gold body of iron and copper etc) and they are rewarded by being positions of authority.
daniel made ruler of the province and chief prefect over babylons wise men ,the 3 were made overseers of the administation of the province ,all very important jobs ,.
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fulltimestudent
CalebInFloroda: To begin with, when the First Temple fell, according to Jewish history and tradition, Nebuchadnezzar took the House of David and cared for it in a special place where the descendants of the monarchy could still retain some freedom as well as the dignity afforded royalty. According to tradition and Scripture, the Babylonians had control of the Iberian Peninsula, which is Sepharad or modern Spain and Portugal.
There does not seem to be any secular reference to Nebuchnezzar's political or military authority reaching as far as modern day Spain.
The web-site Livius, which may be regarded as speaking with some authority, certainly does not mention it, not, at least, in my rather hurried scanning.
Link: http://www.livius.org/articles/place/babylonian-empire/
I think the confusion has arisen, somewhere, somehow, between the Iberian peninsula and the Kingdom of Iberia located in Asia, near Georgia.
Wikipedia is not the best reference in the circumstances, but I choose it because it has a reasonable map.
Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Iberia
As you can note, both the location and the dates of this Asian Iberia fit the historical details.
BTW, If we are seeing the bible as a historical record, it is quite specific as to the numbers of people deported to Babylon, actually not a very large group of people in total and clearly comprising the elite, who ( from their own viewpoint) comprised the 'nation'. The common people were not deported and the land was never left physically desolate, although in the view of the elite, it may have been spiritually desolate.
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2. This is not an argument that there were no Jews in what we now call Spain. There are many references to Jewish migrants in many locations in both the Hellenic and Roman empires. The Jews who refused to return to Jerusalem and stayed behind in Babylon became famous as traders, with groups of Jews in all the major trade markets of the east-west trade network (the silk road). One collection, known as the Radhanites (although that may have been a tag that referred to all) were particularly active in the Euro-Asian slave trade and are reputed to have maintained a facility in Verdun for castrating boys for the eunuch market.
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3. At this link: ( http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/nets/edition/40-daniel-nets.pdf ) there is a copy of, 'A New English Translation of the Septuagint,' published by Oxford University Press. The Introduction may be of interest to some readers here.
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A young kid with determination
by fulltimestudent ini've posted about this chinese kid before.
i think he was around the age of 8 when he had an accident with hi-voltage power and lost both arms.
since then he's taught himself to deal with life without arms.
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fulltimestudent
btw, that blog (the Shanghaiist) and I understand (though, I've never seen it) a hardprint version is 'owned' (if that's the right word, by a New York company (another strange NY company), called the Gothamist.
The namesake blog, Gothamist, focused on New York City, was founded in 2003, with launches in other cities shortly thereafter. Other blogs operated by the company As of June 2014 include LAist, DCist,Chicagoist, and SFist in the United States, as well as Shanghaiist internationally.[2]
See Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothamist
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A young kid with determination
by fulltimestudent ini've posted about this chinese kid before.
i think he was around the age of 8 when he had an accident with hi-voltage power and lost both arms.
since then he's taught himself to deal with life without arms.
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fulltimestudent
I've posted about this Chinese kid before. I think he was around the age of 8 when he had an accident with hi-voltage power and lost both arms. Since then he's taught himself to deal with life without arms. In 2014 he failed the tough gaokao (University entrance) exam, But tried again this year, this time successfully and won a place at Sichuan Universities Law School.
Here's some piks from a Shanghai newspaper, the Shanghaiist. (It was originally published on Netflix, but that version is in Chinese, so the Shanghaiist version is better here.
http://shanghaiist.com/2015/09/16/student_lost_both_arms_first_day_of_uni.php
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Saturday morning us newly weds visited by closet gay Special pioneer see why we stayed home!!? WIERD!!
by Witness 007 infirst let me tell you about george (his real name) the special pioneer.
not that good looking...a bit goofy, he had spiritual sisters literally ask him to date and flutter eyelids because of his positon.
he always made excuses about why sisters were "not his type"...had a bedroom full of pics of him hugging other brothers with a content strange look on his face....like this is my girlfriend look!
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fulltimestudent
Witness 007: Point number 2 was I'm sure he had sexual issues but was not allowed to "come out" or be himself be gay which must have been awful for him yet he judged us for taking some time off together. I resent him for that NOT for being gay
OK, but isn't that what Christianity does in general (and not just the jws)? Western culture is riddled with "judgementalism," just look at the public discussion over equal marriage rights.
This poor bastard, whether gay or not gay, but more particularly if he was gay, is told in many subtle and not subtle ways that he's got to do this and do that, if he wants the Yahweh/Jesus combo god to 'heal' him of his perversion, and if he doesn't then he's finished because the monstrous Yahweh/Jesus combo god will kill him.
All of us that were involved in that organisation likely became judgemental, if not all the time, then sometimes.
Postscript:
A comment on stereotyping gays:
Through my gayxjw friend, I've had the interesting experience of being able to meet a lot of gay men and a few gay women, some 'out,' some not. I want to say that some of the masculine people I've ever met, are gay. Even, if not so aggressively masculine, most gay men cannot be stereotyped. That's why its often a shock when they do come 'out.'
Those who are judged, in conversations like this one, as 'gay,' are usually stereotyped, because they are seen as effeminate, and unless you are using the term 'gay' to cover a whole range of alternative sexualities that can be misleading, as they may be transexual or transgender and have a different genetic make-up.
For some research on 'gaydar,' the ability to see people as 'gay,' read:
The science of stereotyping: Challenging the validity of 'gaydar'
Link: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/09/150903160505.htm
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Hysterically tragic - the west stuffs up in Syria
by fulltimestudent ina former lebanese (christian) terrorist once told me a story (meant to be funny) about west asian politics.. a turtle was swimming past the shoreline of the red sea.
on the shore a scorpion calls out,"hey!
give me a lift over to the other side.
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fulltimestudent
Perry: They did that for years for the people of Iran. When the US troops left, their US trained/supplied army fled like girls when faced with battle.
I think you may have confused Iran with Iraq.
The US Army has not been recently involved in training Iranian troops, at least not since the Shah (who had regained the throne after a MI5/CIA organised coup overthrew the elected government of Dr Mossadegh) was expelled for the second time.
It is interesting though (in the whole confusing picture), that when Saddam Hussein was America's bumboy in the Middle East he fought a war with Iran, in which he was a proxy for the USA, and received military information and technical assistance from the US.
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Hysterically tragic - the west stuffs up in Syria
by fulltimestudent ina former lebanese (christian) terrorist once told me a story (meant to be funny) about west asian politics.. a turtle was swimming past the shoreline of the red sea.
on the shore a scorpion calls out,"hey!
give me a lift over to the other side.
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fulltimestudent
Xanthippe: One thing's for sure until all humans have enough to eat and no longer have to watch their children die from hunger and easily curable illnesses, none of us are safe.
Yup! That's about it. Sadly acknowledging that is, of course, just the start of the journey.
And, what we have talked about is only a small part of a complex problem, and the propaganda and counter-propaganda is extremely confusing.
The small boy in the first posts has become a political football. Think of the implicit message in this claimed 'expose' of the drowned boy story:
I'm under some pressure this week (a uni assignment) so I wont expand, except to say that this 'expose' does ask one excellent question. And that is, that if the Muslim world is one BIG BROTHERHOOD, where are all the Muslim Relief Agencies? And from that flows another question, how difficult would it be for a Syrian to get to Egypt or Malaysia or Morocco or Saudi Arabia or Indonesia to build a new life?
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Arctic Ice Increasing
by Perry inarctic has gained hundreds of miles of ice the last three years.
red shows the september 2012 minimum extent.
green shows the current extent, which is likely the minimum for 2015. the arctic has gained hundreds of miles of ice over the past three years, much of which is thick, multi-year ice.. article.
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fulltimestudent
Yeah! I think I understand why!
In Australia, we have the unfortunate situation where a sort of a 'Perry' is in control of the state. The current Prime Minister, one Tony Abbott, was educated in a Jesuit College and later trained for the priesthood in a Catholic seminary. Since becoming PM he has demonstrated an ideologically biased opposition to any steps previous governments have taken to overcome this climate crisis, all apparently based on a belief that god will not allow a human disaster. (sour smile).
Which leads us to ask why is it that these fanatical christians think this way?
You can read (and then think) about possible reasons in this Huffington Post Australia discussion. (I'd like to elaborate but I'm under a bit of pressure at the moment).
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/g-elijah-dann/christians-climate-change_b_3668179.html?ir=Australia
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