irondork

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Posts by irondork

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  14

  WTS Legal Dept: "Try to make your kids seem normal."

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just finished reading the segment on setting double standards from in search of christian freedom.

  franz gives as an example what is probably the most wanton display of in-your-face hypocrisy.. citing a brochure produced by the legal department designed to help witness parents in child custody battles:.

  this can be used to show that they are normal.

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  irondork

  I finally found a pdf of the brochure but it doesn't mention a copyright date. Does anyone know when this thing was published?
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  17

  Watchtower admits Bible Teaches Trinity & hellfire!

  by williamhconley in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the wathtower admits that by reading the bible alone without their help, people will believe in the trinity, hellfire, visible return of christ, heavenly hope for all christians etc etc.. here's the quote:.

  "from time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of jehovah's people those, who, like the original satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude... they say that it is sufficient to read the bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home.

  but, strangely, through such 'bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago..." (watchtower, aug. 15, 1981, p. 29).. why would people revert back to christendoms doctrines unless the bible actually teaches them!.

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  irondork

  William, I looked up the article you referenced on the CD and found this at the end of the paragraph cited:

  and some have even returned to celebrating Christendom’s festivals again, such as the Roman Saturnalia of December 25!

  Really? Some reverted that far back and took up celebrating the festival of Saturnalia (of 217 BC) in honor of the planet Saturn? That's extraordinary! Who knew?
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  14

  WTS Legal Dept: "Try to make your kids seem normal."

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just finished reading the segment on setting double standards from in search of christian freedom.

  franz gives as an example what is probably the most wanton display of in-your-face hypocrisy.. citing a brochure produced by the legal department designed to help witness parents in child custody battles:.

  this can be used to show that they are normal.

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  irondork

  Just finished reading the segment on Setting Double Standards from In Search of Christian Freedom. Franz gives as an example what is probably the most wanton display of in-your-face hypocrisy.

  Citing a brochure produced by the legal department designed to help Witness parents in child custody battles:

  This can be used to show that they are normal. Try to have kids from local congregations who have been raised as Jehovah's Witnesses and, in the eyes of the presiding overseer, are spiritual but also enjoy the normal healthy things that young people do. They don't have to be competitive to enjoy sports. Be careful that they don't get the impression that they are in a demonstration at the circuit assembly, when they would show that the first things in life are service and going to the Kingdom Hall. Show hobbies, crafts, social activity, sports and especially plans for the future. Be careful they don't all say that they are going to be pioneers. Plans can be trade, getting married and having children, journalism, and all kinds of other things. Maybe you can show an interest in art and the theater. They must be clean, moral, honest, but with the interests that you would expect from other young people.

  The footnote provided: "As to "having children," the Watchtower of March 1, 1988, pages 18-27, carried two articles on the subject and one need only read these to see the manner in which negative aspects are mephasized and married couples' abstaining from having children is promoted as evidence of their appreciation of the "limited time" remaining to finish the organization's "vital work"."

  One other thing. Doesn't becoming a journalist require at LEAST a four year degree?

  They absolutely know what they are up to. Instructions to hide what we really are so they won't see, and for the sake of personal advantage. (Did I just say "we" in that last sentence? Oy! I still have so much work to do.)
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  12

  "never receive him into YOUR homes or say a greeting to him" - 2 John 10

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  it's us who should be shunning them!.

  2 john is talking about the anti-christ.

  he describes it:.

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  irondork

  It's US who should be shunning THEM!

  2 John is talking about the anti-christ. He describes it:

  verse 7 - For many deceivers have gone forth into the world, persons not confessing Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist.

  and

  verse 9 - Everyone that pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God.

  and so concludes... verse 10 & 11 - If anyone comes to YOU and does not bring this teaching, never receive him into YOUR homes or say a greeting to him. For he that says a greeting to him is a sharer in his wicked works. Do I understand this correctly?
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  47

  Well I have a choice to make

  by Igot2bme in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the elders came today without any notice and visited with me.

  they told me that my mother in law said i didn't want to have anything to do with the witnesses anymore.

  i said yes i did say that and then i laid it all out for them why i felt that jehovah god wasn't with them.

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  irondork

  ahem... "letter"
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  47

  Well I have a choice to make

  by Igot2bme in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the elders came today without any notice and visited with me.

  they told me that my mother in law said i didn't want to have anything to do with the witnesses anymore.

  i said yes i did say that and then i laid it all out for them why i felt that jehovah god wasn't with them.

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  irondork

  sizemik: Others see it as pandering to their rules and requirements.

  Black Sheep: Giving them a letter just reinforces their delusion that they are important.

  I thought of this before writing my DA leter but decided to write it anyway because I wanted to expose, probably what they already knew. But I cast them in with the rest of religion by refering to the elders as "clergy", the information from the "platform" "pulpit", stating I was leaving in cimpliance with Jehovah's admonition to "get out of her" and a reference to them being an element of Religion, Inc.

  I wish I still had that letter. I posted it here once and then rewrote it and never saved it.

  Stooopitt!
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  62

  WE CAN DO THIS....if you think the idea is as good as I do!

  by Terry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have long had an idea that i think is a very powerful tool in reaching even hard-nosed jw's.. .

  it would consist only of actual photographic scans of various documents, articles, photographs such as these from marvin shilmer's blog: (see next panel).

  there would be no extraneous non-official text whatsoever.. it would be published the size of an old life magazine and sent anonymously to jw's at their homes.. the cover would clearly contain the words: "all contents originally published by watchtower bible &tract society".

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  irondork

  If someone could organize this LIFE-size magazine into a PDF file, individuals could download it and take it to their local Office Depot and have as many copies printed as they can afford / distribute.

  I would certainly share in the cost and distribution of such a magazine.

  It'll be just like old times! *wipes tear from eye*
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  1

  She agrees completely - still doesn't get it - maybe she does - I just don't know

  by irondork in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been dropping little factoids about the wts's history, failed predictions, new light, current interpretations, lawsuits, etc... my housemate hears all this, agrees that it's messed up but it doesn't phase her.. difference in perspective.

  my thinking on religion has been molded my whole life to recognize false religion and run from it once identified.

  add the personal violations i have endured and the ripping apart of the family and it brings it to a personal level causing me to react with anger at first, followed by a strong determination to keep clear of it for myself and then help others out of the "burning house".

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  irondork

  I've been dropping little factoids about the WTS's history, failed predictions, new light, current interpretations, lawsuits, etc... My housemate hears all this, agrees that it's messed up but it doesn't phase her.

  Difference in perspective. I was a born-in. My thinking on religion has been molded my whole life to recognize false religion and run from it once identified. Add the personal violations I have endured and the ripping apart of the family and it brings it to a personal level causing me to react with anger at first, followed by a strong determination to keep clear of it for myself and then help others out of the "burning house". When I see and present a pile of evidence regarding that church and my listener agrees with me... I guess I expect a different reaction. Not, "I have to get ready for meeting now" or "I'm going out in service tomorrow."

  She was baptized five years ago. She has since told me that when she was being studied with she noticed and (silently) questioned the beating of the obey-the-society-or-you-won't-make-it drum and some other things, but decided to file it away in the "Doesn't affect me" file, in favor of just learning more about the bible and wanting to have a relationship with God. The information that I bring to her, we talk about it. Calmly. She absorbs it, agrees with me, has stated repeatedly, "I don't know what kept you going back to meetings for as long as you did." (anti-gay issues)

  I know for a certainty she only has one person at the Hall she really considers a friend, and I don't blame her. I adore her friend also. She's super awesome and has no stomach for this shunning crap, as she has come over to visit a couple times since my DA. (But she has to be careful, her huzzband is a MS.) The only other person my housemate talks to is the older sister who used to study with her. Aside from the coming and going pleasantries, she has no other ties that bind... and I know this for a certainty. She has told me as much and I believe her.

  We read the bible together once or twice a week and talk about various points. Sometimes these topics (not even WTS topics - just the bible) can last way past our bedtime. We enjoy that. She, WE, are getting spiritual food - directly from the source it SHOULD come.

  Am I missing something? I'm so afraid to push her too hard that I possibly tip-toe too much. I don't know how to understand her indifference vs. her lack of WTS connection (so far as I am able to percieve) vs. her enjoyment of our own study and conversations.

  Input, please!
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  11

  History of Disfellowshipping

  by daringhart13 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm looking to compile a real history of how this heinous practice came into existance.. i've read the 1947 article condemning it and i believe knorr instituted it in 1952 when frustrated with a wife swapping ordeal at columbia heights.. can someone confirm?

  post information?

  the more the better.......thanks!.

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  irondork

  Please post the 1947 article.
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  5

  Elder Involvement — Graphic Presentation

  by Marvin Shilmer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  elder involvement graphic presentation.

  today i uploaded a new article to my blog that begins publishing a 13-page submission by a doctor of psychology that is a watchtower appointed elder.

  he had ideas about elder involvement with jehovahs witnesses suffering mental illness, and particularly victims of child abuse, and thought it best to share these with watchtower.

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  irondork

  Do you have a copy of this referenced 3/23/92 letter to elders? Has it already been posted on this site?