what do you think about the Candace Conti case? Do you side with the society on this?
Hoffnung
JoinedPosts by Hoffnung
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53
Umm Hi
by Killa inso i have something interesting to share.. i am a jehovah's witness.
i have been in the truth for 26 years of my life.
as a young boy i deeply loved the truth.
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53
Umm Hi
by Killa inso i have something interesting to share.. i am a jehovah's witness.
i have been in the truth for 26 years of my life.
as a young boy i deeply loved the truth.
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Hoffnung
how come you registered like 2 years ago, but only now make your 1st post? been lurking a lot?
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Update on Candace Conti's Case
by mind blown injust ran upon this info:.
candace conti beats the watchtower society!submitted by teeny on august 27, 2012 - 9:22 pm .
http://www.jehovahswitnessblog.com/jw-lawsuits/candace-conti-beats-the-watchtower-society/?fb_action_ids=348543075229733&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_source=aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=246965925417366.
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Hoffnung
what is the deadline for appeal?
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53
Umm Hi
by Killa inso i have something interesting to share.. i am a jehovah's witness.
i have been in the truth for 26 years of my life.
as a young boy i deeply loved the truth.
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Hoffnung
Hello Killa,
quite an unusual story, except then for the faking your feelings toward the people around you. You are making a good elder, the society needs guys like you to run the show. But that is no compliment, in fact, it is kind of scary to think you take life-changing decisions for other people, did it already actually happen when you were on a Judicial Comite? If your story is true for more than 1/4, I am afraid it is going to catch up with you sooner or later. I would like to advise you to get some professional help, it is cheaper than the fallout of substance abuse or a divorce. Is there any other reason why you choose to register on this board? If you do not give a damn about the right or wrong of something, I guess there is no need to discuss the pros and cons of the society.
Hoffnung
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DF
by turtleturtle ini am having a hard time understanding why the current jw doctrine is to df a jw who associates with a df'd person.
however, the elders cannot do anything to you for hanging around df'd family, even if you admit it is not necessary and they know it.
can someone explain this?.
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Hoffnung
it is all about controlling the information active witnesses get access to. If somebody is disfellowshipped, nobody is supposed to spread any information about the case. This is ensured by this rule. If you are unrighteously disfellowshipped, you have no chance to defend yourselves, as none of the 'friends' wants to hear your story. They absolutely do not want the dirty little secrets see the light.
Hoffnung
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Field Service Requirements
by DATA-DOG inhas there ever been any official letters stating the amount of field service required to be considered exemplary?
usually the number given is 10hrs, but if you look up " 10 hours " in the cd-library you get 14 hits.
none from the bible of course, and only 3-5 are related to field service.
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Hoffnung
on the application forms for bethel, mts, gilead, etc, you have to provide your average field service hours for the last 6 months. if it is lower than 10, you have to state a reason.
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Let's Discuss Ray Franz's Books
by Recovery ini have been repeatedly pleaded with to read the books of ray franz in my short stay on this board.
apparently these are all the all-powerful, wt crushing arguments, that lead so many to leave jw's and become ruthless opposers of god's people.
we can discuss any claims/statements/scriptural arguments presented in either of his books, as long as it somehow proves jehovah's witnesses are not god's people.
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Hoffnung
if you want to get the main points of Ray Franz books, they have been discussed at length in many other threads already. a little search for 'christian freedom' or 'crisis of conscience' will reveal them. i found it very interesting reading material, presented in an honest and matter-of-fact way, supported by plenty of scriptures and wt-publications quotes where appropriate. it cleared away a lot of 'fog' around bible and organization questions i had back at the time.
Hoffnung
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Conti Trial Transcripts and Court Documents of Attorney Zalkin's cases of 5 victims WT settled out-of-court, San Diego, all available to download using MediaFire
by AndersonsInfo inthe conti trial transcripts have been uploaded using mediafire.. .
conti trial transcript: http://www.mediafire.com/?oj940x48xuuaa.
the public domain court documents for the 5 victims wt settled out-of-court case in may-june 2012, attorney irwin zalkin, san diego, calif., have been uploaded using mediafire:.
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Hoffnung
what does the minutes below mean? did the society drop the appeal?
Hoffnung
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For Immediate Release JW-MEDIA.org post response to child sex abuse verdict
by BlindersOff1 inhttp://www.jw-media.org/usa/20120620.htm .
just plain old corporate denial.
let the games begin.. .
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Hoffnung
official policy statement:
Our Families
Jehovah’s Witnesses and Child ProtectionAlso in Spanish
Child abuse is abhorrent to us. This is in harmony with the Bible principle recorded at Romans 12:9 . Even one abused child is one too many. For decades The Watchtower and Awake! have featured articles to educate both Witnesses and the public regarding the importance and the need to protect children from child abuse. Among others, there were the articles “Let Us Abhor What Is Wicked!” published in the January 1, 1997, issue of The Watchtower; “Help for the Victims of Incest,” in the October 1, 1983, Watchtower; “Your Child Is in Danger!” “How Can We Protect Our Children?” and “Prevention in the Home”, all in the October 8, 1993, Awake!, as well as “Child Molesting—Every Mother’s Nightmare,” in the January 22, 1985, Awake!
(my comment: so cannot even come up with an article of the last ten years? it is not important enought to write an article about it for ten years?)
When any one of Jehovah’s Witnesses is accused of an act of child abuse, the local congregation elders are expected to investigate. Two elders meet separately with the accused and the accuser to see what each says on the matter. If the accused denies the charge, the two elders may arrange for him and the victim to restate their position in each other’s presence, with elders also there. If during that meeting the accused still denies the charges and there are no others who can substantiate them, the elders cannot take action within the congregation at that time. Why not? As a Bible-based organization, we must adhere to what the Scriptures say, namely, “No single witness should rise up against a man respecting any error or any sin . . . At the mouth of two witnesses or at the mouth of three witnesses the matter should stand good.” ( Deuteronomy 19:15 ) Jesus reaffirmed this principle as recorded at Matthew 18:15-17 . However, if two persons are witnesses to separate incidents of the same kind of wrongdoing, their testimony may be deemed sufficient to take action.
(this is not a policy, this is a list of possibilities. A policy has a different tone and feeling)
However, even if the elders cannot take congregational action, they are expected to report the allegation to the branch office of Jehovah's Witnesses in their country, if local privacy laws permit. In addition to making a report to the branch office, the elders may be required by law to report even uncorroborated or unsubstantiated allegations to the authorities. If so, the elders receive proper legal direction to ensure that they comply with the law. Additionally, the victim or anyone else who has knowledge of the allegation may wish to report the matter to the authorities, and it is his or her absolute right to do so.
(so they don not report to the branch when local laws do not permit? that is not what the flock book says. Elders always have to call the legal dept. Proper legal directions means = report anonymously from a telephone boot so the organization is nowhere involved. Victims and others are also pointed out that they are responsible for the potiential reproach on the organizations reputation)
If, when confronted, the accused confesses that he is guilty of child abuse, the elders take appropriate congregational action. If he is not repentant, he will not be permitted to remain a member of the congregation. Even if he is repentant—is cut to the heart and is thus resolutely determined to avoid such conduct in the future—what was stated in the January 1, 1997, issue of The Watchtower applies. The article said: “For the protection of our children, a man known to have been a child molester does not qualify for a responsible position in the congregation. Moreover, he cannot be a pioneer [full-time missionary of Jehovah’s Witnesses] or serve in any other special, full-time service.” He would not qualify Scripturally. ( 1 Timothy 3:2 , 7-10 ) We take such action because we are concerned with maintaining Bible standards and protecting our children. Everyone in our organization is expected to meet the same requirements, namely, to be clean physically, mentally, morally, and spiritually.— 2 Corinthians 7:1 ; Ephesians 4:17-19 ; 1 Thessalonians 2:4 .
(but under all circumstances, the molester is never restrained from having contact with children, parents are not informed about the potential threat. The action to strip someone of priveleges does not protect any child, it just protects the reputation of the organization.)
In a few instances, individuals guilty of an act of child abuse have been appointed to positions within the congregation if their conduct has been otherwise exemplary for decades. All the factors are considered carefully. Suppose, for example, that a long time ago an 18-year-old male had sexual relations with a 15-year-old girl who was a willing participant. Depending upon the U.S. jurisdiction where he lived when this happened, elders may have been required to report this as an incident of child abuse. Let us say that 20 years have passed. He has been living an exemplary life and he is respected. In such a case, the man could possibly be appointed to a responsible position within the congregation.
(So we have to accept that the rules set forth a paragraph earlier are not valid after 20 years, the rules are way too vague to be reliable)
Our procedures have been refined over time. Over the years, as we have noted areas where our policies could be strengthened, we have followed through. We are continuing to refine them. We do not believe that our system is perfect. No human organization is perfect. But we do believe that we have a strong, Bible-based policy on child abuse. Anyone in a responsible position who is guilty of child abuse would be removed from his responsibilities without hesitation. We certainly would not knowingly allow him to serve elsewhere, either because he moved or through a transfer. Further, we regularly review our procedures to ensure that they are in compliance with the law.— Romans 13:1 .
The Bible teaches that individuals can repent of their sins and “turn to God by doing works that befit repentance,” and we accept what the Bible says. ( Acts 26:20 ) Still, the safety of our children is of the utmost importance. We take it very seriously.
(not seriously enough, that is why you have to pay)
Hoffnung
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Why Did Romania's Jehovah's Witnesses Disfellowship The Governing Body For Apostasy?
by Bubblegum Apotheosis inthere is a large group of jehovah's witnesses that broke away from the watchtower society in the 1990s.
can someone explain to all the interested jwn lurkers and faders, why these romanian and other eastern european witnesses disfellowshiped the governing body in new york?.
i received a email from a member claiming to be part of this group, i was told they "disfellowshiped the governing body" for disobedience to jehovah god and not following the fine examples of brother russell, rutherford and knorr.
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Hoffnung
In 1962 the society changed the viewpoint concerning the "superior authorities". As Romania was under communist rule, this cause a lot of problems for the Romanians, and a first schism occurred. What happened in the nineties, I do not know, but Ray Franz was invited for a meeting and speech, and I think this had to do with it. You can find the videos of that speech on YouTube.
Hoffnung
