Posts by Retrovirus

7

Choices have Consequences

by AggieNostic in

jw
friends

my wife and kids are inactive/trying to fade - see my previous posts for our story - last meeting for me was over 5 years ago.. in laws and parents active - fil and dad are elders, fil and mil are pioneers, mom just follows dad's lead.. anyway, my wonderful son is finishing up college and is engaged to be married later in 2011 to a beautiful young woman who we all love dearly and have welcomed to our family.

ceremony to be held in a public space - no denominational identity.

when engagement announced, my wife and i's parents reacted positively and assured their attendance.. however, phone calls a few days after the elders school over xmas advised us that they would not be attending since our son - although inactive - is baptized and his fiancee is not a jw.

Retrovirus

Hi AggieNostic,

You've clarified something that has been bothering me for ages, yet I never understood it. I'm a non-jw, and over many years have made every effort to keep in touch with my jw ex-SIL, even to "discussing the Bible" with a couple of local jws she sent around without asking me first.

In all that time and letters (she won't email), I've censored myself to avoid mentions of birthdays, Christmas, Easter, Mothers Day etc, but she never hestiates to proselytise or to tell about conventions or meetings. And I'm beginning to wonder why I bother.

If our "friendship" is only to draw me into her religion then it isn't a friendship.

It does seem to be all "their way" and yes, that has consequences.

Thanks, and I really hope the wedding is a great day for all who attend. Perhaps if your soon-to-be DIL learns to understand the jw religion better, she'll realise it's not because of her, it's because they choose to keep their blinkers on.

Retro

4

Moving to Melbourne. Bit of advice please.

by bigmouth in

jw
friends

oneoftwelve and i are moving to melbourne with our 15 year old son soon.. she's transferring to one of the spotlight stores and my boy's looking to further his footballing (soccer) career.. can anyone recommend a secondary school and a good suburb/area to live?

somewhere safe for my pussycat.. what is reasonable for a 3br house rental ?

we're comfortable travelling from outside city limits.. thanks all.. pete.

Retrovirus

I'm a bit closer in. Melbourne is a big sprawling city. I'd recommend checking public transport availability; your son will need it.

Please PM if I can help more.

Retro

180

Brotherdan seems like he really DID leave

by sabastious in

jw
friends

he was an interesting presence on this board.

he had integral knowledge about bethel and the like.

i am an emotional guy too so i can kind of relate to why he left.. but, you gotta get thick skin on the forum.

Retrovirus

This site has helped me so much; i really could have been in danger of drawing too close to the JWs.

Ziddina, thank you for your kindness and insight.

BrotherDan, your posts were the first things I read on this site, and I admired your openness and trust.

Outlaw, your pics and comments worried me bit made me think.

Please, friends, don't give those that say people are bitter and angry after leaving jws any more ammo.

Retro

59

Elder wants to do "other activities" with me

by InterestedOne in

jw
friends

i'm fully aware that this is a cult, and i was waiting for the social elements to kick in.

so far, i have just been doing the "bible study," discussing doctrine, etc.

however, recently one of the elders said he wants to get together with me to do other activities.

Retrovirus

I'm watching this with great interest, as it's a bit like my situation.

The jw ladies who visit me for a "bible discussion" used to open with a prayer, but now sometimes forget to do it. They also come around every few weeks; no longer each weekend.

Also they pressured me hard to attend meetings, especially when the CO was there, but I didn't go. Mainly i'm a bit afraid because I'm a softie. I want to keep the dialogue going but could do without the pressure to be "helped".

Retro

21

delema... thoughts of not deprograming son

by Aussie Oz in

jw
friends

this might sound a little strange but i hope some of you might understand.. my 17 year old boy is hot and heavy with his jw girlfriend.

he told me the other day that they had talked about getting married an two or three years, how they want to travel the world before having kids etc.

i asked him where getting baptised fitted into this, as they will need to be baptised if they want a kh wedding.

Retrovirus

Hi fellow Aussie!

I'm probably the least qualified re JWs, but I did raise two kids as a single working mum. It seems to me that you've already started "deprogramming", and despite temporary hormone interruptions, that genie won't go back into the bottle.

Of course it's possible that he and his girl will become "laid-back", moderate jw's. But what i'm reading here is that the WT is increasing control. also a lot would depend on the girl and how much her family can influence her (assuming they are all "in").

Don't know the circumstances, but I doubt that Satanus' idea could be made to work. I was a very headstrong teenager once!

Most of all I'd urge you to stay close to your son. If possible, arrange outings and interests that he would miss as a "good jw". Keep him thinking and respect his opinions. If at all possible meet the girl and do the same.

Finally make sure that he knows you are always there for him, so that whatever happens, he has support outside the WT.

Best of luck, Retro

8

Why are they afraid?

by Retrovirus in

hi, i was just reading the.

flow chart - how to have a rational discussion thread, and my first thought was that the "you cheated" box was too confrontational for someone not used to logic.

then i realised that in all my discussions with my jw ladies, i'd been tiptoeing around my points for fear of scaring them off.

Retrovirus

Yes, Outlaw, I do feel the pressure to agree! They do try to manipulate emotions but frankly these two aren't very good at it. You do it much better; your pics are scary!

Ziddina and BrokenPromises, thanks for your thoughts. I'm trying to understand the mentality, but don't seem to be able to learn fast enough. I am sure that I can't get anyone to leave, I'm more trying to scatter enough clues so that if or when they're ready they have something to go on. Seeing how the WT destroyed my brother's marriage and what their kids went through makes me want to do what I can; however little.

InterestedOne, thanks for that lead; I'll try to get them onto another doctrine and take it from there.

Retro

8

Why are they afraid?

by Retrovirus in

hi, i was just reading the.

flow chart - how to have a rational discussion thread, and my first thought was that the "you cheated" box was too confrontational for someone not used to logic.

then i realised that in all my discussions with my jw ladies, i'd been tiptoeing around my points for fear of scaring them off.

Retrovirus

Thank you for your thoughts, and sorry if I'm rehashing stuff. It's just that when they discuss the Bible or moral standards, they come across as so authorative! Yet this fear is always hovering.

I try to broaden the discussion, to talk as friends would, about the garden, entertaining, books and movies etc. Yes, I do drag them off topic! At the same time, they ask questions to find out what's bothering me or worrying me; I believe, so they can provide the 'solution".

So we'll continue the dance.

Retro.

8

Why are they afraid?

by Retrovirus in

hi, i was just reading the.

flow chart - how to have a rational discussion thread, and my first thought was that the "you cheated" box was too confrontational for someone not used to logic.

then i realised that in all my discussions with my jw ladies, i'd been tiptoeing around my points for fear of scaring them off.

Retrovirus

Hi, i was just reading the

Flow Chart - How To Have A Rational Discussion

thread, and my first thought was that the "you cheated" box was too confrontational for someone not used to logic. Then I realised that in all my discussions with my jw ladies, I'd been tiptoeing around my points for fear of scaring them off. And I don't understand why.

They visit in pairs, bring all their literature which I have to read so that we can talk about it. They will not even look at any of my sources.

Yet, they have an organisation to support and reinforce them, ongoing "study" and most of all, they believe that they are doing the will, and have the support of, the most powerful being in the universe.

So why the angst? and is this delicate approach the right way to deal with it?

Happy 2011 from

Retro

57

Attention Lurkers- Consider the effectiveness of your lifesaving work

by stuckinamovement in

jw
friends

hypothetical scenario.

you are a city manager in a major metropolitan city with a population of 3,000,000.. .

if the governing body was truly convinced themselves of the impending disaster and the fact that the end is imminent would they not focus their efforts in spreading the message through effective means such as telephone, television, internet, social networks etc?

Retrovirus

Thomas Covenant writes:

How would you feel about the 3,000 employees?

My limited experience tells me that most jws are honest, and trying to do right within the limits of their cognitive dissonance. It worked when I challenged my jw acquaintances about distributing material when they could not verify it's truthfulness.

The whole Nuremberg trials thing was about doing what you know is right, not just mindlessly carrying out orders for fear of consequences.

I believe that this might work, at least for "honest hearted ones"

Retro

29

...WBT$ Jehovah`s Witness Child Labor...

by OUTLAW in

"these child laborers are paid very little"... .

these jehovah`s witness child laborers.. .

are forced to work for free... "wbt$ child labor"... .

Retrovirus

Marked, thank you!

There is a group of JWs who i've met twice on my morning walk. Each time they send a little pre-schooler to intercept me and give me a pamphlet; I'd take it because i didn't want to upset the kid.

Now I'm thinking, perhaps instead I could chat a little and finish with "it's been a long time, but nice to see you let the kids talk to apostates now!"

would that work, or is there a better way?

Retro