Retrovirus

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Posts by Retrovirus

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  53

  Nov.15th WT - Quotes Dissing - Internet, Higher Education, Earning a Living

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as most of us here are aware the wt society is using the " kool-aid " , or witness only version as i call it - to indoctrinate and intimidate jw members through fear and guilt to avoid anything that takes their devotion and attention away from allegiance to the wt society's ambitions.

  so the wt society is amping up it's control methods once again in various articles in this issue as well.. first off - notice this quote from page 14 , paragraph 16 , regarding how " dangerous " allegedly the internet is.

  it states, " these desires ( of the world ) involve such things as promiscuity, prominence , and possessions.

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  Retrovirus

  This brings to mind the thread about the WT's subtle deception.

  Vigilant Christians refrain from using the world to the full with regard to higher education. Many people in this world consider higher education an indispensable stepping-stone to prestige and an affluent life. But we Christians live as temporary residents and pursue different goals . We avoid "minding lofty things ". Consequently, young Christians are encouraged to pursue spiritual goals, getting ONLY AS MUCH EDUCATION AS IS REQUIRED to meet their BASIC NEEDS

  So, nothing is defined. How high is "higher education"? Isn't it probable that in poorer countries that bar would be set lower? And this miserable article would discourage even the education within their reach!

  And what are "Basic needs"? Wouldn't these include health care, a home without a mortgage, the ability to raise and educate children, look after elderly parents, fund a retirement? And how can these be assured without a decent income?

  Associating undefined "higher education" with "prestige and an affluent life" - as if that is the only reason it is undertaken - is grossly dishonest!
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  15

  Belief to non-belief

  by Awen in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  have anyone here went from being a very strict believer in god to a non-believer?.

  actually i think many are.. but outside of the usual answers of "god doesn't exist" (which you must have had some very valid reasons for), were there many things that caused you to come to this conclusion?

  i was watching a southpark video about joseph smith and the mormons and i thought it very funny that anyone could actually believe any of that stuff.

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  Retrovirus

  Great thread and OP, Awen!

  I've been reading and asking questions about religion all my life. The Bible is certainly not the definitive word from God unless S/He has a warped sense of humour or cannot avoid self contradiction.

  So what do we really have that is reliable? If the Bible isn't a reliable source then how do we know that the spiritual experiences many claim to have (myself included) aren't products of our shared experiences with the JW and our own unconscious minds via intuition?

  IMO, we don't have anything "reliable", ie, self-consistent, provable and logical to us. I have also had what I think is a spiritual experience, possibly more than one. Where it came from, I simply don't know, but it helped me get through a very bad time in my life.

  And that is the single reason why I don't reject it or explain it away.

  One thing I do believe is that there are many things we don't yet know. I choose to fill the unknown areas with optimism, and rely on facts, probabilities and the Golden Rule for day to day living. Not having certainty is a lot better than the dry, materialistic, narrow-minded doctrines of fundamentalist religions. Let alone when they are demonstrably wrong!

  So far my relationship with Christ has gotten me through some very tough times that I don't think I could have handled on my own. Does this make me delusional to have trust in someone I cannot see or touch? As far as modern psychiatry in concerned, yes it probably does

  As sciences go, psychology and psychiatry have spotty track records at best!
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  19

  Does God Care About Animals? gA Dec 2011

  by Gladring in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  according to the article in the dec 2011 awake although.

  man was eventually permitted to use them for.

  food and other practical purposes, god never.

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  Retrovirus

  Ichneumons thus serve as another example of the diversity and balance of living things that man has yet to comprehend fully.

  Yet . .

  Although one may describe this insect group as ruthless parasites, ichneumon wasps serve an important purpose. Their larvae feed on insects that are harmful to food crops, including chinch bugs, boll weevils, codling moths, and asparagus beetles, to name a few. So ichneumons evidently control the proliferation of agricultural pests.

  Evidently, the wt has all the answers, even when "man" doesn't. And the difficult cases, such as ichneumons preying on spiders that also help control insects, are simply disregarded.
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  6

  Questions for those who are christians, not JW

  by umadevi in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello, i don't post often but i have made it a daily habit to come here.

  currently i am not into any religion after exiting the wtbts.

  i have no knowledge about christianity other than what was taught by wtbts.

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  Retrovirus

  Hi Umadevi! How are you managing, you and your boy?

  Back to topic - I'm a member of a small, inclusive Unitarian-like religion. Roughly, we believe that actions are more important than creeds, and the only "core beliefs" are to love God and love others as yourself. I'm not very regular in attending meetings but do enjoy those that I attend. We discuss and compare personal beliefs without judging and it's great to get a different perspective - without having to subscribe to it!

  To me a spiritual life means connecting rather than following a set of rules. For me it's important to connect, as I'm an introvert by nature. So, I take a lady shopping (she has severe health probs and I'm a palliative care volunteer), and help out with the local Adult education Center. I'm also a member of the local Amnesty International group, and donate to two African chariities, one through work.

  Why did I join my religion? I'm a born-in and it fits my needs. The differences from the wt are pretty clear, I think!

  Retro
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  69

  WT Society Alters their History as " The Party " did in George Orwell's 1984

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  finally my wife and i got around to reading george orwell's " 1984 " .

  as many of you know who have read the book that " the party " or " big brother " as the ruling power in the book is called ; constantly changes records of it's past dealings so as to deceive the public about any false forecasts they may have mistakenly made ; in an effort to put forth a positive image of itself it destroys past embarrassing records or paperwork which would expose the " party " as a failure.

  much the way the wt society has altered their history to deceive the public and their own members.. notice this quote from george orwell's " 1984 " on pg.

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  Retrovirus

  Hi Mr Flipper!

  Yesterday I read this article on Freeminds. It shows a scary number of similarities with 1984. Especially the "hidden library" of history. Very thought provoking!

  Retro
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  20

  A Course in Miracles

  by semelcred in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've just started reading a course in miracles and wondered if any one here has any thoughts or any contact with this book?

  as an ex-jw i find it hard to accept reading any other religious publication but i find the idea of the ego's attempt at separation as the real issue against the idea of original sin a fascinating concept.

  also the book was channeled!

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  Retrovirus

  I'll have a go, Rebel8,

  Terry's post, as I understood it, ridiculed the alleged source of the book, without addressing the content. It also asserted that claiming the source was Jesus, was intended to use Jesus as an authority.

  I've read some but not all of ACIM, and, like others here, enjoy exploring the different ideas it presents. No reason why I need an "authority" to do that, or a basis in fact either.

  IMO, these concepts, and your perception of "cultish", don't apply here. No-one will shun me or regard me as a living corpse if I accept some, all or none of it. Or whether or not I change my mind later.

  And just for context, I get a lot from Terry's well thought out posts. Also I work as an analyst, and my work deliverables are entirely based on facts and probabilities.

  ACIM etc., occupies a different part of my alleged brain .
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  58

  So why

  by bushido8000 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  it has become very apparent to me very quickly that this forum is dominated by ex-jws.

  i have many questions and topics to present but i first want to know who i am presenting these questions and topics to so i have 2 questions that i would like as many of yall to answer as possible.. .

  question 1: did you leave the organization out of the blue or were you first disfellowshipped?.

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  Retrovirus

  Hi,

  My situation is that I studied but never joined.

  I'll interpret Q2 as "why didn't I 'progress'"? Because the literature presented as "Truth" wasn't true. For example quoting Francis Hitching; even citing him as an authority. He has a basic science degree and has never worked as a scientist; the simplest Google search establishes this. And pointing this and other concerns out got me labelled "opposer". Any information that didn't fit was managed by bad-naming the source; a simple logical fallacy.

  I do feel some bitterness as I saw my brothers' marriage to a jw struggle and finally break, and what their children went through. I saw that both parents tried their hardest to maintain the marriage but the jw religion doesn't allow compromise.
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  28

  A Letter to My Sons ... A Request for Help

  by 00DAD in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it has now been over two years since i was df'd.

  in that time i have had limited contact with my 17 year old son, the younger, and almost no contact with my 20 year old.

  the older boy was baptized 5 years ago and sadly the younger just recently took the plunge into the "pool-aid".

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  Retrovirus

  00Dad,

  have you considered keeping a diary? It could form the basis of your message to your sons, or just help you keep track of things you'd like them to know. And if they have the least interest (I'm sure they do!), they'll read it, whether or not you're still here.

  Best wishes for your efforts to stay in touch.

  Retro
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  18

  My trouble

  by bushido8000 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have been facing a small dilemma for some years now.

  i have been in the truth since i was 5 years old.

  after experiencing some troubles with man-made rules (non-scriptural, told me that i absolutely could not join my small school's football team) in the kingdom hall when i was about 16, i stopped going to take a step back and look at what was going on.

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  Retrovirus

  Hello and a belated welcome, Bushido8000!

  I'm a non-jw who "studied" with two kind jw ladies for about six months. I'm still sorting out my own beliefs, so have nothing to convert you to or from.

  What I'm sure of, is that we need to keep learning until we find what we need. Once you've started to do this, following along and suppressing doubts gets harder every day.

  Even the Bible tells us to do this. I cannot imagine a loving Father who would forbid it.

  Best wishes on your search!
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  12

  Celebrate Good Times: Come On!

  by headisspinning in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  today marks our two years free.

  my now husband was df'd on september 13, 2009 and i was officially canned on september 15, 2009!.

  it has been a long road and if any of you remember, we initially came on this board looking for help to get reinstated.that is a huge laugh now, hey!

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  Retrovirus

  Congratulations, Julia