Posts by mindseye

55

Nothing.

by Narkissos in

jw
friends

perhaps this paradoxical "topic" is one with which we here have dealt a little more, or a little more consciously, than the average population.. we used to have our heads full of beliefs (which we called "truth") in every direction: on theology, on cosmology, on paleontology, on past history, on so-called prophetic future, on heaven above, on earth, on she'ol beneath.

on many things -- current events, traditions, other peoples' beliefs and behaviours -- we had strong opinions which were directly or indirectly (the famous "conscience" matters) part of the same deal.

and of course our life was filled with activities and relationships, a community of "friends," people to "help" or "teach," etc.. then, gradually or suddenly, we came to suspect, often with a measure of terror, that all of this was not what we had thought and might sooner or later turn into... nothing.. this "nothing" is perhaps one of the most scary thoughts to people contemplating leaving the org one way or another.

mindseye

What a cool thread. Nothing is what everything's about right now. Taoism and Zen Buddhism is where it's at (nothing, that is).

When breaking away from the JW narrative, like many I swung towards the rationalist counternarrative. "New" atheists, etc. I have friend who's an ExJW, and he's going through the same thing, he's a big fan of Ayn Rand. But I've realized this is just another narrative, and can even become a fundamentalism. It falls into another dualism.

But real bliss came through reading some Zen and the Tao Te Ching (and Zhuangzi). The practice of zazen (zen mediation) helps too. The sort of letting go of all these narratives, and just . . . being (and nonbeing).

The postmodernists were a big help too, the western approach to deconstructing narratives. And phenomenologists like Heidegger (once I got over the fact that he was a freak'n Nazi) had a lot to say about direct experience. Oh yeah, and negative theologians.... Yes all of these can become other narratives to. But it is what they point to that it is all about (nothing).

Anyway this is getting to be too big of a post to be about nothing, thanks for the thread!

13

very bad "JW" teenagers to "very good" JW's

by Iamallcool in

jw
friends

do you know of any "jw" teenagers that were very bad in morals, but later in life they become elders, elderettes, etc...?

what were they like?

what are they like today?.

mindseye

Yes, among a few people I saw the "born again JW" syndrome. These were JWs that sowed their wild oats as a teenager, doing all kinds of wild stuff, in one case even heavy drugs. Then they would have a "born again" moment and rediscover the Jehovah of their youth, and then become the strictest JWs ever.

17

desensitization from the Jehovah's witnesses

by Star tiger in

.

this may be a different way of exit from the jehovah's mentality, for me it should work, first i want to try all the things that were verbotent to them, slowly at first a piece of black pudding, then donating blood, you see the progression.. then a little more flagrant in the laws, buying a pack of tarot cards, reading them and so on.. does anyone think that's a reasonable way of beginning to destroy the subconcious methods of programming, also i am very ocd so any way of destroying the jehovahs witnesses mindset is fraught with potential new ways of worrying me!.

star tiger.

mindseye

Star Tiger, I think you have the right idea. This is the sort of approach that helped me break from the JW mentality when I was a teenager. I started by reading 'blasphemous' philosophers like Nietzsche. I went to different places of religion like churches and a Buddhist temple (that was actually very pleasant, and led to a deep interest in eastern religion). I played around with some tarot cards and saw the 'Exorcist'. I guess everyone's barriers are different. Basically I broke down my barriers so I could build up a new kind of spirituality, one that was based off of authenticity rather than fear.

To quote Fight Club: Its only after we’ve lost everything that we’re free to do anything.

3

Is WBTS supremacist legalism, moralism, ethnocentrism and Gnosticism SOCIALLY destructive (as in Westboro Baptist Church, the "most hated family in America")?

by Fernando in

(galatians 5:2) see!

i, paul, am telling you that if you [yield to watchtower legalism], christ will be of no benefit to you.. .

*** g79 6/8 p. 28 why the emphasis on christian freedom?

mindseye

I don't get why you added Gnosticism in the title. The Gnostics sought esoteric inner knowledge (gnosis) in order to be saved from the Demiurge who controls the material world (Yahweh). WBTS is quite the opposite, they embrace the Demiurge (even naming their religion after him).

Unless I misunderstood your post...

40

Reading is over-rated

by yadda yadda 2 in

jw
friends

have you ever seen people who just constantly read.

they read at every given opportunity, at the gym, on the bus and train, at the beach, all weekend, even while holidaying overseas they mostly just read.

you even see them going down the street holding a book while walking, like some kind of zombie.

mindseye

Another bookworm here. I can't read enough, in fact I wish I could take time off of my job right now to finish a massive series called "The History of Civilization" by Will and Ariel Durant. Sure, I think a person can read too much. Life is about a balance of body and mind, and also one should be informed by experience. But in my experience the problem isn't that people read too much, but that they don't read enough. Many often have strong opinions about subjects like evolution, the Bible and politics, yet have not read enough to have an informed view on the subject.

On being overly influenced by what one reads, I think that's solved by reading viewpoints by different authors. For instance, when studying religion, I'll read a book by an atheist and then one by a theologian.

And Schopenhauer and the others quoted wrote in a time where many probably did read too much as a diversion. Now the problem is too much television and facebook.

322

My son was murdered today

by truman in

i have been on this site daily, almost from its beginning, since i left the jws in 2001, but i have been more of a reader than a poster, as you can see from my post count.

i know few here know me, although i know many of you through reading your posts.

maybe it is not right to ask for support, when i generally stay quietly in the background of this forum, but i want only to speak a human misery of the deepest kind.

mindseye

So sorry to hear that, truman. Still thinking above has the right idea, feel free to 'ramble', talking and writing about it can be an effective way to deal with a loss. Our thoughts are with you and your family.

63

A JWN Member just lost her Husband and She could use some encouragement.

by ohiocowboy in

jw
friends

on 4/6, the poster orphan annie posted about her experiences with jw's and her ill husband.

unfortunately, her husband died monday, and she is feeling very sad.

i just wanted to make others aware of it, so that we can encourage her and give her some much needed support during this rough time.. her original thread is here.

mindseye

Very sorry to hear of your loss, Orphan Annie. Our thoughts are with you and your family.

61

Will you ever go back to the Jehovah's Witnesses?

by XPeterX in

jw
friends

discuss..

mindseye

Only working my way to unbaptized publisher (but born in), my ties probably aren't as strong as some. But after going to college, reading and experiencing so much, my mind is in a place where I couldn't even fathom a reason to attend a kingdom hall. It was like that movie Pleasantville, where life turned from a simplistic black & white sitcom to a complex but beautiful color movie. I guess some people prefer the black & white sitcom, where everything seems safe, and all questions are answered in 30 minutes (or several pages). I'd rather the complexity of reality, where there are no easy answers, where life is a constant conversation. Dogmatic religions like the Witnesses don't want to have a conversation, they just want to tell you what to think. They are conversation stoppers.

26

Are Jehovah's Witnesses fundamentalists?

by Celestial in

i googled the phrase and a q & a from their official media web site appeared within the first few hits:.

http://www.jw-media.org/aboutjw/article32.htm.

are you fundamentalists?.

mindseye

I always went back and forth as to whether JWs are fundamentalists. There seems to be an obvious political element to most fundamentalist groups. JWs avoid this, as they don't vote, lobby, or protest to keep evolution and other things from being taught in public school. But using the wikipedia definition of Fundamentalism - a strict adherence to specific theological doctrines usually understood as a reaction against Modernist theology - I would definitely classify the Witnesses as fundamentalists.

The term comes from an series of Protestant publications from the early 20th century called the Fundamentals. In addition to attacking 'evolutionism', higher criticism, and liberal theology, these early Fundamentalists also attacked the early Bible Students who eventually became Jehovah's Witnesses.

23

EVERYONE IS A THEIST

by botchtowersociety in

since everything comes from god, it's the starting point for each of our journeys even if many move away from it.

some return while others never do though even these remain 'theists' towards a deeply held conviction.

eventually we all die and meet our maker and end up in the presence of belief and knowledge as when we began.. the journey is what makes a life and if yours contains a lack of belief in god that's fine - so long as it causes no harm.

mindseye

Thanks, your post on Pierre Teilhard de Chardin was also fascinating. I don't know much about the guy. I'm going to look up more on him when I get some time. It's unfortunate that religion and science are always seen in opposition, when there have been many religious scientists and religious figures supportive of science (Gregor Mendel, the Jesuits, to name a few).