Posts by LucidSky

21

JW's relationship problems?

by Matty in

the relating to non-jw's thread made me think a lot about myself and where i am and what im doing now.

i have to figure out where im going wrong!

has anyone had similar experiences to me as far as relationships with non-witnesses are concerned?.

Matty, Connie - I can relate too. I felt very social-shy when I first started dating for real (still do sometimes). Even with friends I would try to cover up my past or not discuss it at all. Eventually I started sharing and it lead to some good conversations and enhanced other persons' understandings of me.

I do believe that the topic needs to be introduced a little at a time with new friends or dating partners and only when you feel comfortable with him/her. It's not something I would bring up on a first date... or second or third! An important thing is to not let the other person know it affected you too deeply -- at least not immediately, like larc/PLH already said. If you do, they may start thinking "Hmmmm, emotional baggage... Welp, see ya!" Unless you suffer from bitterness or depression, it should not be an issue at all. ExJW's can actually make great partners.

2

New born Christians

by happy man in

jw
friends

i have read that not so few xjw going in to this,whats this religion , for mee it sound realy misch, masch.

as jw we are fare from this belive i think, or have i miss something.

LucidSky

happy - Is this what you are saying?

"I have read that many XJW's become Born-Again Christians. What's this religion? For me it sounds really mishmash. As JW's we were far from these beliefs, or have I missed something?"

I think Born-Againers have some appeal because they do two things that JW's didn't: (1) they emphasize Jesus a lot more (2) they emphasize the heavenly hope to those who thought they couldn't have one. But then one would have to swallow other things like the Trinity belief. Never appealed to me.

8

Tattoo You? or I meant, me.

by simplesally in

jw
friends

have any of you had a desire to do what once prohibited?

i mean, i know that many guys who leave jw's get a beard....... (now six, i am not talking about you cuz you had it already), some have gotten ears pierced (now six, i am talking about you), some even start wearing berets!!!

really go the extra mile there!.

LucidSky

Have any of you had a desire to do what once prohibited?

I occasionally mused at the thought of getting a small tattoo. But like COMF says, I'd rather have my artwork on a wall and take it down when I want.

Other forbiddens? Karate. I'd like to learn a few basics. I am also planning on skydiving this summer. Of course, I was informed that this was a no-no as JW. Same deal with paintballing, which I did once when I was younger and received a lecture about the next day.

5

Trinity quote....who remembers?

by miner in

jw
friends

i'm hoping someone here can help me out.

i am involved in an on-going study with a jehovah's witness and our current topic of discussion is whether or not trinity is a biblical doctrine.

i seem to vaguely remember a wt quote where if people study the bible alone, they end up believing this trinity idea....did i dream this one up?

LucidSky

miner - I cannot recall anything like that, except the Russell remark you mentioned. True or not, my advice is to avoid discussing the Trinity. Stick with something that erodes their exclusivity status. The quotes page at the bottom might help or Randy Watters' "Thus Sayeth the Governing Body".

178

God is Jesus

by evangelist in

i am looking for more scriptures that can prove to a jehovah witness that god is jesus, and jesus is god.i found only one verse so far in 1jo:5:20: and we know that the son of god is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his son jesus christ.

this is the true god, and eternal life.. if you know more scriptures that say directly that god is jesus please tell me the verses the jhw will see plainly that jesus is no way an angel, and he is jehovah god almighty.. my friend said if i can prove by the bible only that jesus is god he will leave the jhw society, and he will know that they are teaching lies and they would be to him a dogma religious sect.

my friend gave me a booklet called should you believe in the trinity?, and is jesus christ the almighty god.

LucidSky

As for the "category" God, I believe the conccept still holds.
There is a category "God" (just the one), therefore any other attempt at being categorised as "a god" renders the occupant of that category a "false god".

Hello LittleToe.

[Adding to what AlanF already stated.]
Calling something either "God" (in the absolute sense) or a "false god" could be considered a false dichotomy. What if there happen to be more than two categories when applying this term? "God", like "Lord", "King", "Father", "Savior", etc. can be applied in an absolute sense, as well as lesser sense without being false. David was called King and Lord but it did not make him false simply because his kingship and lordship was not absolute.

18

When you are crushed......

by simplesally in

i am disfellowshipped.

whoa.

i just wrote that as the first thing.

LucidSky

((simplesally))

It's a common theme, it seems: Your friends and family are all JW's and suddenly your world comes crashing down when you leave. It's not an easy position to be in. But the sooner you are able to stop seeing yourself as a victim and start seeing that you now possess a new power over your life, you'll be on your way to recovery. It may be scary to think about, but you can live without being told what to do every minute.

Remember you've got friends and a support system right here!

178

God is Jesus

by evangelist in

i am looking for more scriptures that can prove to a jehovah witness that god is jesus, and jesus is god.i found only one verse so far in 1jo:5:20: and we know that the son of god is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his son jesus christ.

this is the true god, and eternal life.. if you know more scriptures that say directly that god is jesus please tell me the verses the jhw will see plainly that jesus is no way an angel, and he is jehovah god almighty.. my friend said if i can prove by the bible only that jesus is god he will leave the jhw society, and he will know that they are teaching lies and they would be to him a dogma religious sect.

my friend gave me a booklet called should you believe in the trinity?, and is jesus christ the almighty god.

LucidSky

AlanF - Great posts. Always worth a read.

Good discussion, but I agree that debating the Trinity rarely convinces anyone. There's too much heritage behind it.

If anyone is interested there is a booklet (work in progress I think) that compares scriptures side-by-side showing the arguments from both (actually four) sides. The Great Debate Regarding The Father, Son and Holy Spirit -- http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/grdebate.html

21

Is Anyone a Pantheist ?

by LucidSky in

jw
friends

is anyone a pantheist ?.

in my search for the meaning of life, it has been only a month or two since i've actually become agnostic.

my reason for the final rejection of christianity was that i could not believe a god of love, justice and wisdom would create a world that along with life/pleasure would also foster death/suffering for seemingly infinite numbers of innocent and not-so-innocent beings.

LucidSky

Siddhashunyata - What you say sounds intuitive.

gravedancer - Good comments. I would like to add some thoughts to what you said.

You cannot prove that fairies don't exists either.

Hey, what about the dimes I got from the teeth under my pillow? But seriously, the universe might be potential evidence, whereas I have no reason at all to believe in fairies. Whether the universe is valid evidence is still inconclusive. I'm stuck.

Again just because something is so big or so out of scope from our thinking ....avoid assigning "supernatural" labels to it. Perhaps try reading some of the work of Dawkins ("The Blind Watchmaker" for instance).

It seems the more I learn of the universe and life, the more in awe I become that it works. I have read Watchmaker and accept evolution as a force in general, but I also have a few issues.

Don't accept anything that you cannot prove.

You're right. But it's hard to see that at times. When being a JW, you think you have absolute proof and then little by little, pieces of that pseudo-truth start to fall apart until the whole thing collapses.

We are "moral" for one reason only - self preservation.

Perhaps "species preservation" as well? That would help describe certain altruistic animal behaviors. The only "moral" it seems I am left believing right now is not harming others (excepting those who wish harm on you). Of course, this can be seen as self-preservation too.

I have left my religion, but still want to seek answers.

27

Suffering

by Realist in

brief question: if the sin committed by adam and eve is responsible for suffering how can one explain the fact that animals died long before that event?

or are animals not considered to suffer?

LucidSky

brief question: if the sin committed by adam and eve is responsible for suffering how can one explain the fact that animals died long before that event? or are animals not considered to suffer?

Realist: Those are exactly the types of questions that caused me to become agnostic! As a JW, I tended to dismiss animals and their death and suffering. Once I left, I couldn't reconcile how a perfect moral God would create a world that harms morally innocent creatures (and this was before sin entered the world). I developed several explanatory theories regarding pre-human animal death, but the theories never seemed natural.

Really, what seperates us from animals? Self-awareness? Bah. That word is far too nebulous. Without civilization humans would simply be highly intelligent primates.

21

Is Anyone a Pantheist ?

by LucidSky in

jw
friends

is anyone a pantheist ?.

in my search for the meaning of life, it has been only a month or two since i've actually become agnostic.

my reason for the final rejection of christianity was that i could not believe a god of love, justice and wisdom would create a world that along with life/pleasure would also foster death/suffering for seemingly infinite numbers of innocent and not-so-innocent beings.

LucidSky

Xena - I'm with ya there. I just find it unfair that at one time I had all the answers to everything I ever needed.

Siddhashunyata - I see some of what you are saying and I can see how such a philosophy can lead do disillusionment. I think ideas coupled with observations can lead to break throughs in human understanding. The Theory of Relativity for example. Most scientists rejected the idea at first, but because observations continued to support it, it was finally accepted.