Posts by MadApostate

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

It should be understood that there is no guarantee that the DPI's review will result in the WTS's "associative status" being withdrawn.

Anyone familiar with "organizational behavior" will realize that it is more likely that the DPI will NOT delete the WTS, since to make such a decision means that DPI must acknowledge that they made a mistake, or at least acknowledge that they were capable of being mislead.

IMO, regardless of what happens, the WTS is in a no-win situation, and we are in a no-lose situation.

The only question is whether YOU FOLKS READING THIS are in the battlelines, or whether you are sitting on the sidelines whining and making excuses that things aren't just perfect enough for you to join in.

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

Msil:

You just don't seem to "get it", or to be able to see the "big picture".

A group of Anti-WTS unknowns have ALREADY bombarded DPI with emails of unknown quantity and quality. DPI has ALREADY decided to review the WTS's "status".

It's hard to criticize the "bombardment" at this point. Due to the timing of the world crisis, and the fact that DPI is currently "sensitive" because it may have granted "associative status" to NGOs with terrorist connections, DPI probably is more willing now than at any other time to review, for possible deletion, the "status" of its NGOs.

A bird in the hand is better than two in the bush. Although it possibly would have been better that this attack on the WTS's "status" be made at some later time, the fact remains that such an attack did need to be made at some point in time, and DPI's "attitude" probably will never be more receptive than it is right now.

Keep in mind that the WTS is the best judge of how beneficial such "status" is. They are using this formal association with the UN to influence governmental, social, and other regulatory attitudes all over the globe. Go to any "human rights" website you wish, run "JWs" on their search engine, and chances are that you will get multiple hits.

Yes, it would be "a positive" if JWs could continue to go to the UN Website and see the WTS listed as being "associated" with DPI. However, the question is whether the value of having such available to the small minority of JWs willing to access such is large enough to offset the downside of the WTS continuing to receive the benefits it is reaping worldwide as a UN NGO???

Whether the UN "disfellowships" the WTS, or the WTS "disassociates" itself, neither event changes the fact that the WTS VOLUNTARILY associated itself to the UN for TEN YEARS. I'm sure that dozens, if not hundreds, of copies of the NGO roster have been saved for future reference and posting on anti-WTS websites. Any JWs who will not believe such are the kind that wouldn't be phased even after seeing such on the UN website.

The fact remains that the WTS voluntarily carried on an "illicit affair" with the "beast" for at least 10 years.

Put yourself in the shoes of "Loyal JW Elder". How would you feel if you picked up the newspaper one morning and read these headlines: "JW Elder's Wife Ends 10 Year Long Affair With Local Satanist". Do you think the Elder would say: "Well, since I didn't know anything about the 10 year long affair until today, and since my wife is no longer blowing the satanist, I'll just carry on as if the affair never happened."

While I have no doubt that there are some JW Elders stupid enough to reason such, I also have no doubt that there are many Elders who would terminate the marriage.

Getting back to the upcoming review by DPI. The horse is already out of the barn, so let's make the best of the situation. If we don't, we may not get another opportunity for many, many years because the DPI will later reason that they have already conducted such a thorough review.

NOW'S THE TIME FOR ALL GOOD MEN TO COME TO THE AID OF THE CAUSE!!!

43

Fallout Over The WT-UN Contraversey

by Ranchette in

jw
friends

yes, fallout has already begun (literally)over the wt-un contraversey!.

a long time jw friend of ours told my husband today that he has already disassociated himself from the organization after seeing the proof of wt's immoral affair with the beast.. this was the last straw for him.. i wonder how many others this info is going to effect this way?.

we will see.. ranchette

MadApostate

Everyone here should be doing everything in their power to get this info to their JW family, JW friends, and JW acquaintances.

Those here who have memberships at GC and WOL should now ask themselves if this is the one issue that is important enough to go ahead and risk their membership by posting this info on those JW DBs.

This is THE BIG ONE folks!

14

Bill Bowen on Radio September 30

by Kent in

jw
friends

i got this message from jim moon:.

talk show host meria heller (herself an ex-jw) has put out the following reminder of her upcoming radio program.

you can tune in on the internet at http://www.meria.net/.

MadApostate

A(stupid)person:

Why am I not surprised that you would feel right at home with the beliefs advocated on Heller's website?

Frankly, it is my opinion that SL's association with such only hurts his credibility with mainstreamers, and also gives ammo to the WTS to say: "Look at the whackos backing those liars."

Oh well, noone asked me!

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

Mac:

I would suggest that folks NOT telephone DPI. Numerous telephone calls might only irritate DPI such as to prejudice our cause.

Emails are manageable within their own time constraints, plus the content of such is obviously a reviewable record.

I would further suggest that those outside the U.S. identify their nationality so that DPI understands that this is an international concern!

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

Msil:

Back on Sept. 14, in post #23, I cautioned as follows:

Zev:
Given the ongoing crisis, I would suggest that you give UN-DPL a month or so to reply, and then try again. Your email is probably about #834,953 on their list right now.
I would also suggest not contacting the WTS on this. What do you hope to gain (?), other than tipping them off on something that I consider one of the more significant "finds" that can realistically be used against them.
Have some patience!

However, as HAWKAW relates in the top post on this page:

But I got to tell you that according to Ms. Oca they have already been "bombed" and "swamped" with Electronic mail and phone calls. That is why they are having a meeting over this issue next week.

With DPI going to look into WTS's membership this next week, what should we do? Allow the WTS to "spin" the thus far received emails as "lies promoted by excommunicated malcontents", or go ahead and provide DPI with full and complete evidence?

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

DIM:

Whenever and whatever occurs which forces the WTS to try to explain to the R&F why it established a formal association with the "image of the wild beast", aka "scarlet-colored wild beast", the WTS is going to be stuttering and stammering with all kinds of excuses, half-truths, etc.

However, there is NOTHING it can say which will JUSTIFY making a deal with the devil.

To those older R&F who have for years studied JW prophecy interpretation regarding the "wild beasts", this "association" will be deemed INEXCUSABLE!!!

However, as always, the problem is making the R&F aware of such. IF we can "help" the DPI to withdraw the WTS's "associative status", there is a good possibility that such withdrawal will be picked up by the International Media, as they will likely be watching for terrorist-connected NGOs being dumped, also.

If anyone has a JW emailing list, this woud make a great email campaign, and all one has to do is include the UN link which proves the WTS "is touching the unclean thing."

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

Moxy:

if i might interject and ask if this is really all that different than becoming a registered religion in a given coutry by means of whatever national agency handles this in each country? or becoming a registered not-for-profit organization with a given country's national finance ministy.

The comparisons you mention are compliances with legal requirements which do not force the WTS to agree with the ideals of the government, nor force the WTS to promote such.

The WTS's association with UN-DPI was a VOLUNTARY REQUEST INITIATED BY THE WTS. The WTS also agreed in writing that it supports the ideals of the UN Charter-thus the UN itself-, and the WTS agreed to carry on a positive educational program to gain support for the UN's goals.

... but it sounds to me now from the discussions with the UN you folks have had that they are pretty lax about this.

Have you read all this thread? Since 1991, the WTS has published several mag articles which promotes UN programs without any negative criticism of the UN, or references to it being the "image of the wild beast". DPI isn't lax! They have been snookered!

Now's the time to provide DPI with evidence of such!!!

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

The WTS sought and obtained "associative status" with UN-DPI because they see such status as helping their cause. Who could be a better judge of such than themselves? Therefore, whether the UN "disfellowships" them, or whether the WTS chooses to "disassociate" under threat of DF, either event is a huge loss for the WTS, as well as a publicity nightmare.

Since the "judicial committee" is set to review evidence next week, then we should provide as much evidence as possible.

It seems that the two major weaknesses of the WTS with regard to its "associative status" with the UN-DPI is the very basis of such association.

First, the WTS is firmly on record as being "anti-UN". However, the very basis for gaining "associative status" is for an NGO to hold UN ideals in common, to agree to support such, and to carry on a positive public education program to disseminate such.

Second, the "subject" of the WTS's association with DPI is "Human Rights". However, as the Aussie politician points out in the link I posted on page 4, the WTS's position on blood violates the rights of children.

Then, there are the issues of:

*Shunning causing the breakdown of family relationships.

*Shielding of child molestors in the U.S.

*The WTS's intra-church judicial procedures which denies
-right to representation.
-right to face your accusers.
-right to a public hearing.
-right to a record of such.

All of these issues (and others) should be brought to the DPI's attention.

Emails should be business-like, and succinct. Each email should address only one issue, and should contain at least one quote from the WTS's own literature. Each email should be sent from a different email account.

Be smart! Write about what you know, and your own personal experiences. If someone has a question about something, post it here.

Now's the time for all good men to come to the aid of our cause!

501

UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp in

following the link given by kent,.

i have several observation to make:.

(from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

MadApostate

Hawkaw:

W. Lloyd Barry, a member of the Governing Body, died from a heart attack on July 2, 1999.

Barry was likely identified as the "contact person" on the original application.

However, that is NOT the answer to my question as to who is the current MAIN REPRESENTATIVE and ALTERNATE REP, or who previously held such positions.

Those two people are the only ones who would be receiving "credentials" to access UN-NGO meetings, and accessing UN assistance/materials. As discussed previously, these people are probably connected to the Writing Staff.