Posts by maxwell

35

How many here are still active JWs? If not.....

by Leander in

jw
friends

when did you leave?.

what prompted you to doubt/leave the organization?.

for those who are still active, do you plan on leaving soon?

maxwell

Wow, I didn't realize how wordy I had gotten. I'll have to preview that thing next time.

35

How many here are still active JWs? If not.....

by Leander in

jw
friends

when did you leave?.

what prompted you to doubt/leave the organization?.

for those who are still active, do you plan on leaving soon?

I've been leaving the past few weeks and it appears I am gone now.
I left relatively quickly. I commited adultery earlier this year. I didn't do it purposely to get out of the organization. The incident was a personal failing. But it did provide a quick exit.

I started to doubt whether there was a God in a philosophy class about 4 years ago. I kinda pushed those doubts aside at the time. But, with that and other observations about the world, I've come to feeling that there may or may not be a God in the past few months. I guess I could describe myself as agnostic.

If one assumed that there is a God and that the Bible was his Word, I would still have thought that Jehovah's Witnesses had the Bible religion down the best. I've seen many arguments here against them and their beliefs, however few of them strike a nerve with me. I have to admit that I may still be biased by things I've been taught all my life. All my life, I've generally approached theological arguments with a bias toward the way JW believe. However, one thing about the organization and even the Bible that does strike a nerve is strong counsel to avoid apostates and to avoid certain other patterns of thought. In my mind, if something is true or correct, it should be able to withstand any rhetorical opposition or contradictory ideas.

Logic and philosophy should not be the enemy of truth. Even if getting to know God requires some higher plane of thought (spirtual thought??), I should be able to start out with logic and reach some firm conclusions clearly manifest in the physical world about God and spirituality before preceding further. After all, I'm only a man, and my natural mode of thought is physical to begin with. Or maybe that's just my personal feeling about what's natural, but I think anyone can agree that the physical world is what we are first able to understand. Babies first learn about the physical world and tangible things. It takes a few years before a child is even able to comprehend intangible and abstract qualities. So I'll probably still read the Bible and the JW publications, but I won't be limited to those. I plan to pick up some stuff by Darwin, Ray Franz and who knows where I'll go after that.

So I decided to tell my wife on Monday April 8. That same day I mailed a letter to the elders confessing, so that my wife would be free to remarry. Well my wife, of course, cried, and then got worried when I said I wasn't going back to the Kingdom Hall. She called an elder herself and a couple of them came over to my apartment that evening. I gave them a copy of the letter and they said they'd have to set up a judicial committee. Maybe I can copy my letter here sometime, but it basically said, I had commited adultery, I am unrepentant, and I don't want to discuss any details of the incident, and that they would probably easily reach a decision to disfellowship. It said I only wanted my wife to be Scriptually free to remarry.

One of the elders apparently went out of town, so he called me the next Monday to ask me if I'd changed my mind and to tell me they scheduled the meeting on Tuesday April 15. I declined to attend. Tuesday night they called twice, but I wasn't there. Sadly, an older brother in my congregation died that week(just last week that is), and that kinda slowed things a little again. They finally called me Friday to say they preferred to tell me their decision in person. So I agreed to meet with them this past Sunday April 21. They once again reminded me that I could repent and asked me if I wanted to stand by my letter. I said yes. They sent me into another room while they discussed among themselves what I knew had to be a clear cut decision. A few minutes later they came and got me and said they had not choice but to disfellowship me. They gave me my appeal options and the options for coming back and said the meeting was over if I had nothing further to say. I stood up without saying a word and walked out.

I really have nothing against those men, the organization, or any JW. They can choose to believe as they want. I can choose to believe as I want. And as far as I can tell, I'm clear of the organization now. The process wasn't painful at all. They were at my apartment that first Monday for about 15 minutes. And the last meeting was about 10 minutes. They'll probably have to wait until next week's service meeting to announce me because of the 7 day appeal thing, but surprisingly I've received only a few calls from people the past two weeks since I haven't been going to the meeting. And that despite the fact that my wife is attending another congregation now and that she has only told a few of her close friends. Maybe more people know that I think. Certain people should be aware that I am having "difficulties". I was reading at the bookstudy, working in literature, working as an attendant and a microphone carrier, 3 weeks ago. So I assume they had to let some people know certain things discreetly, so that they could continue to operate smoothly.

Of course, it has been painful with my wife. But I don't think I should have been married either, so we'll deal with that. She's not been as emotional as I expected and seems to be moving forward and a reasonable rate. I've heard the most "encouragement" from her, but that's simply because she's the one who's around, and she likes to talk.

The biggest thing now to be settled is my family. They were very emotional when I first told them. I was raised in the truth, and they believe it very strongly. But hopefully they can calm down soon. Fortunately they live 850 miles away, but surprisingly my mother has decided to come up and visit next weekend. This will be the first time she's come here since I moved here over 2 years ago. In fact none of my family has been up to visit. I sent them an email and told them they were still welcome to visit and call. I doubt that I will still be welcome to visit them, but we'll see. My mom will at least do this visit.

Maxwell

36

Most Frightening Door to Door Experience

by Kenneson in

jw
friends

in my hometown, this other witness and i were.

going from door to door one day when we reached one particular house.. the householder became so agitated by the presence of jws.

that he "sicked" his dog on us, but thank god it had a muzzle.

maxwell

I grew up in a rural area. Some people would blow their horn if they were way back off the road and saw beware of dog signs to see if the dogs would come out. I would just not get out when I saw those signs. If the dogs heard my car, and came out barking, I'd assume anyone there could hear the dogs. If I saw the sign and didn't see the dogs, I'd give one or two light taps on the horn. Usually the car sound would bring out any dogs anyway.

Anyway one day we drove up to a house and a pit bull comes running out barking loud and growling making a lot of noise. We had a car full of brothers, but of course no one got out. The dog was making plenty of noise, but the brother driving decided to blow the horn anyway. I think he also looked out the window and smiled at the dog. Well the pit bull sank his teeth into one of the mud flaps on his car and just ripped it off. As we were sitting there in the driveway, we saw a pickup truck roll by on the road behind us. After the pit bull ripped off the mud flap, we left. As we pulled away down the road, the truck that rolled by, came back and pulled into the driveway. I guess they just decided to let their pit bull deal with us. It was the summer and we had the windows down as well. You can imagine how fast we rolled those windows up.

I remember another time my sister and a friend were at a door. They were behind some bushes and out of sight. All of a sudden I see them pop down from behind the bushes with a couple of dogs barking. I opened the door ready to jump out and help them with the dogs. Fortunately, the dogs were all bark, but I was scared, they were scared.

Fortunately, I never had a direct threat of violence. But, one other scary thing was going up to those houses with confederate flags flying or on their car. I grew up in a southern state. My congregation was almost all black (I'm black as well), while the county I lived in was pretty much half and half. Of course you can debate over whether the confederate flag has any racial connotations, but you ride way up a long drive way back off the road and see the Dukes of Hazzard looking people acting mean back there it can be kind of scary. You're not sure whether they're tellin you to "git" because they don't like the religion or your color or both. We didn't stay to question them. However, we did have one white pioneer sister who worked in our congregation for a while who reported that some of her calls would come to the turning point when they found out where she was inviting them. That's not to say that all Dukes of Hazzard looking people were mean. Most of the time, they were really friendly and some would talk you to death just because they were happy to see somebody way back there.

26

Memorial policy. Is that true all over?

by Mulan in

jw
friends

i was interested in the post earlier today, about how the 'emblems' were not passed to the disfellowshipped people at the memorial.. does anyone know if this is the policy now, or was it an isolated incident?.

my husband, a former elder, said he had never heard of that being done before.

but we've been gone for 4 years too.. marilyn (aka mulan).

maxwell

At this past memorial, I was an attendant and we didn't have the policy here. I wasn't instructed to ask if a person was disfellowshipped or to seat anyone in any particular place except to encourage the regular meeting attenders to sit toward the front so there would be room for latecomers and new ones who might be shy about going to the front. Maybe a veiled policy?

Ironically enough, they did miss passing me the emblems. Did God know I was not worthy of having them passed to me? Did he know I was about to leave? Nah. They also missed some sister's Bible study who was kinda sitting right up against a back wall of the main auditorium with her handicapped son, who is in a wheelchair. I was standing right next to them. Our hall was full and the servers in the back rooms would finish first and come up front and start on the middle section to meet the servers working back from the front. And the servers on the side sections would finish and assume the guys from the back rooms had gotten us. And the servers in the middle would assume the servers from the side section had gotten us. I thought about tapping one of them on the shoulder and saying we weren't served, but decided it wasn't that important.

27

My Dad called

by Elsewhere in

jw
friends

the other day i sent my family a framed studio photograph that i had made for them.. i called to make sure they got it and my mom said that she did and that it was placed with the other family photos in the living room.. a few days later my dad called to thank me.

he then went off into a tangent about how he wants me to come back to the "truth".

i told him that i respect his right to believe as he will, but i expect the same in return.

maxwell

Wow, reading that sounds somewhat like what I'm about to go through/ am going through.
I don't want to comment to much on my situation now, because I'm right in the middle of leaving, but I've told my parents I'm about to be DF, and they are really upset, feeling as if they've failed somehow. I was hoping that eventually that feeling would at least die down, but sounds like they could feel that way indefinitely.

My father also was an elder but stepped down for an unspecified reason when I was a teenager. But he's still strong in the organization. He's called several times within the past week since I told them. My mom and one of my sistesr also have called. Everytime, they're almost in tears or in tears. My father says my mother is heartbroken. Even if this was the right religion, I don't think that's a healthy response to a person making their own choice about their future. I can't serve God for them. One principle of the religion is that your first relationship is between you and God. It isn't dependent on other humans. So this reaction doesn't make a lot of sense. It hurts me to see them hurting, but if they can never get over their hurt, I think I will just have to get over mine. I don't think one should let others heavily emotional reactions to situations bring them down too long.

23

JWs and Vasectomies?

by sweetone2377 in

i was reading a judicial meeting transcript last night on the inet and the accussed had added vasectomies to the list of procedures that are frowned upon, or forbidden, by the wts.

is this true?.

shelly.

maxwell

I would think that they are at least allowed. I'd be surprised if they were even frowned upon. I remember an Awake that laid out several options for family planning and birth control. Of course, abortion was not mentioned as an option. Sterilization for either sex was mentioned. Maybe I can find it and post. I'm only personally aware of one lady JW who was sterilized. I believe her ovaries were removed because of cancer, so of course that wasn't a normal situation.

Maxwell

13

DO JW'S ALLOW THEIR CHILDREN TO GO ON CLASS TRIPS?

by Darkhorse in

jw
friends

hi, have a question (i am not a jw).

is it unusual for a jw to allow their children to go on school class trips to washington d.c.?

because of their beliefs, i would think going to d.c. on a class trip would be a no-no.

maxwell

In my area, I knew of a few kids who went on over night trips. I believe the thinking is that you should way the dangers of bad association against the benefit of the trip; however, ultimately, the decision is between the parent and the child. Of course individual congregations or elders might take a harsh view on the matter and frown on people who didn't go along with their way.

I never went on any overnight trips but I did go on an annual all day band trip. After the parade, everyone boys and girls would change clothes on the bus. There would be a lot of adolescent, teenager, whooping and hollering on the bus from the guys watching the majorettes in their underwear, but unfortunately, no orgies. Of course there were a few isolated make-out sessions.

32

What did/do you most look fwd to?

by SPAZnik in

after 29 years of bondage.... i'm loving living it up.. and wondering.... when you first left,.

what things did you most look forward to doing.

or, for that matter, what things do u still look forward to?.

maxwell

I'm not sure what I most look forward to. Certainly stepping away will give me a lot more time and freedom.

I'll be honest and say, I do look forward to exploring my sexuality.
I look forward to having more time to work on my secular career.
I look forward to having a simpler life. Yes a simpler life. I live in an urban area, and one of the only reasons I still have a car right now is because of field service and meetings. I really don't need it for anything else. So I get rid of my car and one less thing to worry about. I have a couple of shelves full of Society publications. I'm not sure if I will throw them all out, but getting rid of some books would certainly give me more space.
I look forward to having more time to exercise and stay in shape.

peace,
maxwell

20

hello

by maxwell in

i'm a jehovah's witness who's doubts about god have been kinda forced to front by some adulterous acts on my part.

i don't really feel the the jw's are dangerous presently, at least not any more than any other religion.

i do feel the urge to free myself from it and my marriage within the week.

maxwell

Thanks for all the welcomes. :) How do you do those smilies?

SYN, That mike thing sounds like it would be fun, but actually I'm gonna try to avoid the hearing if at all possible. I'll just write out the confession and the fact that I'm not really repentant. Of course, they'll probably try to "readjust" me. Is that when they "roast me"? Hopefully I'll can just tell them I'm beyond readjustment.

I've only been in the back room with the elders a couple of times and that was in my teens in the congregation where I grew up. First time, I was a junior in high school, they stopped using me on microphones and what not, because I was in the band and I was the drum major. My dad sat in with me. He was an elder at the time and didn't seem to happy about what they were saying. Although I was still making all the meetings and field service, they said some other young ones were possibly being stumbled and wanted to play sports. Apparently the parents in these other undisclosed families lacked the ability to think on their own. I was one of the "exemplary" ones and they couldn't handle having their children point at me and say "look at what he's doing, I want to play sports".

Second time came late teens probably after I was out of high school. I was still at home but being over 18, I met with the elders alone this time. My dad had stepped down from being an elder then for personal reasons. I had gotten my "privileges" back. ( I decided not to participate in marching band my senior year, and eventually they started using me for stuff again). But my field service time average had gone down under exemplary levels (at least 10 hours/month). Eventually, they decided not to use that number thing as a qualification and they started using me again. I guess they were low on man power for doing Kingdom Hall chores. Both times were pretty relaxed. But who knows what'll happen this time. Maybe I'll see how rowdy them elders can get. I haven't had to meet with the elders in this congregation for anything, so I really don't know how they are in that situation. I'll let you know.

20

hello

by maxwell in

i'm a jehovah's witness who's doubts about god have been kinda forced to front by some adulterous acts on my part.

i don't really feel the the jw's are dangerous presently, at least not any more than any other religion.

i do feel the urge to free myself from it and my marriage within the week.

maxwell

greetings,

I'm a Jehovah's Witness who's doubts about God have been kinda forced to front by some adulterous acts on my part. I don't really feel the the JW's are dangerous presently, at least not any more than any other religion. I do feel the urge to free myself from it and my marriage within the week. Later I'll give my story. It's not nearly as shocking or interesting as some of the stories I've read here, but maybe it'll give another perspective. I tried to put a short bio in the profile thing. As this is my first post, this is also sort of a test to see if did this posting stuff right.

peace,
maxwell