MDS

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Posts by MDS

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  9

  God's Kingdom-Can Its Coming Be Pre-Announced?

  by MDS in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the kingdom of god -- is it pre-announced with outstanding, observable events going before its coming?

  jesus said the following,.

  at luke 17:20, 21 we read:.

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  MDS

  Hi "Logical":

  The figure of 200 million comes from Revelation 9:16.

  Take Care,

  MDS
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  46

  Jehovah We'll Believe When We See Signs & M...

  by MDS in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  truly i say, no sign will be given to this generation.".

  " -- 1 cor.

  -- see 1 cor.

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  MDS

  Ianao:

  ...The people here who are having problems LISTENING to your message have gone through the psychological traumas of hearing 'truth' and knowing 'truth'. They are now in REALITY and are VERY reluctant to listen to another who very well may be a "false lamb, misleading many".

  Whatever happened to

  "you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free"?

  Or, this statement by Jesus,

  "my sheep will hear my voice and will follow no other shepherd"?

  Jesus's true sheep CANNOT be misled..its impossible, according to what Jesus said above.

  So, are we saying the real "truth," Bible "Truth," Divine "Truth," is totally unrecognizable?

  Is Divine "truth" recognizable or not, we must ask?

  If Divine "truth" is recognizable, then when one is confronted with it, one either "listens" to it, accepts it, believes it, or he does not. It is a personal choice.

  John 8:47 says:

  "He that is from God, LISTENS to the sayings of God..."

  Simple.

  MDS

  Edited by - MDS on 1 January 2001 19:2:26
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  46

  Jehovah We'll Believe When We See Signs & M...

  by MDS in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  truly i say, no sign will be given to this generation.".

  " -- 1 cor.

  -- see 1 cor.

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  MDS

  The above paragraph is not a quote from any WTS publication, nor any other published journal or publication.

  Take Care,

  MDS
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

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  MDS

  Hello Frenchy:

  MDS...If I understand you correctly you are still assigning the WTBS the status of being God's organization. Am I correct on this? ...I also believe that you are saying this on the basis of their having Jehovah's name? Is that correct?

  The Name is of the Utmost importance...nothing more important.

  However, I would like to say this about "mystery" Israel.

  There are a number of things that point to the true identity of mystery "Israel" of our time. Actually, the ability to truly identify myster "Israel," of our time, is a SACRED SECRET [Greek: "mysterion"]. In other words, if one could identify mystery "Israel," then, he would be close to identifying:

  1. Man of Lawlessness -- 2 Thess. 2:3-12
  2. Temple where Man of Lawlessness Presides
  3. Measuring of that same "temple" -- Rev. 11:1
  4. Prophet-like "Two Witnesses" (& activity) that die on the
  5. "Broadway," of the "Great City," [Babylon] also where the "lord was impaled." [Jerusalem- the city of God's Name.](Rev.11:8)
  6. Male Child who rules the nations in the end
  7. "holy ones," that are trampled by "Small Horn,"
  8. For a length of some "42 months."
  9. Identity of Babylon the Great, who holds "Israel" in Slavery. ["come out of her MY PEOPLE"] - Rev. 18:4
  10. "Woman," who is chased to the "wilderness" and "fed" by God for "3 1/2 times" or "1260 days." [She does not know the "truth," she must be taught the truth, in the "wilderness, away from the face of the Dragon or "kingdom hall."]
  11. Faithful and Discreet Slave, activity defined.
  12. Domestics or "Curing Staff", activity defined.
  13. mystery associated with the "full number of Gentiles" and mystery "Israel's" sensibility being dulled during this time. This is in connection with a special "70 year" observance of God...a time of special inspection and "temple cleansing." The first of TWO "Temple Cleansing." We are fast approaching this unique "situation." -- Romans 11:25
  14. Restoration of the "Woman," or "Israel," or "Jacob." Finally, after several years of Discipline handed to her for blindly following the WTS/Man of Lawlessness in total "wickedness." She must "bear her sin," even AFTER she leaves WTS, while in the "wilderness" -- See Micah 7:8-10
  15. "3 1/2 days dead on the "Broadway" of Jerusalem by Two Witnesses
  16. Kingdom of God, as being a "mystery." "Is it earthly, is it heavenly or both
  17. are there any "anointed" among Jehovah's Witnesses, truly.
  18. The true meaning of the Abrahamic Covenant, who benefits.
  19. Enmity between "stick of Judah," and "stick of Jacob,"
  20. Leaving or "FORSAKING" their "brothers," the "House of Jacob," and "stepping over into the light," to the true "House of the God of Jacob," a slight difference in "houses." ... One "House" has God, and One does not. Please note Isa. 2:3 and compare with verses 5,6 of the same chapter. -- Powerful point lies here.

  And on and on and on...

  But nothing is understood, nothing is understood, until FIRST, you IDENTIFY "Israel,"... mystery Israel of Bible prophecy.

  Frenchy, one of the things I have mentioned to you, one of the Biblical points directed you to carefully consider Matt. 13:41...the content.

  Does it say, The "kingdom of God," has "stumbling" and "lawlessness," unsavory activity, going on in it ... like the "man of lawlessness," from God's perspective? Does it say this?

  This is a key point.

  When the Governing Body is truly found out, ... Frenchy, what do you think is going to happen? If they are as crooked, at least as some of you say on this board...what then if the people find out?

  And let's not miss this point, what if Jehovah turned the JWs religion, UPSIDE DOWN, what then?

  We are talking about Almighty God stepping in... the One who gets things done.

  I know, you doubt that Jehovah's Witnesses are anything to Jehovah...that point is clear.

  But, I am going to post some information in due measure, that will help you identify modern day Israel, perhaps, in my next post to you.

  But simply put for now lets say, if you don't believe, no amount of info I provide will help... if we can't see things, with the "eye of faith." Faith must enter into the picture at some juncture.

  Perhaps, you've notice "Logical," and his quick response to the material presented. He is responding becauase he has "faith," real "faith." And, this is not the first time I've seen this reaction, since I've been teaching this message. I've seen it many times over.

  We must have genuine Faith in Jehovah God, His unfailing Word, the Bible, completely, to make the connections needed. -- Hebrews 11:6

  The things I say on this board, to most of the participants here, is like I'm speaking "Greek" or a foreign language. But I speak a "new language," a new doctrine, a pure doctrine, a "pure language," of truth... and its foreign to most we encounter. Like when Jesus spoke in "parables," and left everyone in a quandary as to what he was talking about. -- See Zeph. 3:9

  But, I will put together some "research," and present to you some "proofs." Three main proofs. And then we can go from there.

  But keep in mind, Jehovah's Witnesses are headed for serious problems ahead, serious problems with Governments and many other problems with their doctrines, practices and idealogies.

  GOD'S NAME -- ITS IMPORTANCE

  You mentioned God's Name ... is that important?

  Well, the Name of God, is the most important issue facing mankind, entoto.

  Think about how important this must be to the Creator, Himself, His Glorious Name, how often it is mentioned in the scriptures, the Vindication of His Great Name. That Name dominated the entire Jewish Society, where the Jews named the offspring after the Divine Name...names like "Elijah," which means, "My God is JAH."

  If we go back in time, and visit ancient "Israel," what do we find? Back during Moses day, David's Day, what do we find? We find this Great Name Dominates the entire civilization, the "Israelite" nation, a People for His name, the altars Named after Jehovah in the Bible, cities Named after His Great name, His Name incorporated within the human's name, The Name upon the temple, everywhere you look, if you are living there, everywhere you look, you see the Divine Name, everywhere... it on the headband of the Priests, the Holy Sign of Dedication, "Holiness belongs to JAH." ... Its EVERYWHERE you look!

  Is God's Name important??? Close to 7,000 times mentioned in the Hebrew Scriptures alone???

  Its EVERYTHING!

  Take Care.

  MDS

  Edited by - MDS on 30 December 2000 16:28:1
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

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  MDS

  .

  Edited by - MDS on 30 December 2000 1:25:52
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

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  MDS

  Larc,

  If I may add this thought:

  Regarding that particular passage, Isaiah 49:1-6, some have wondered whether these verses specifically apply to Jesus Christ.

  This is what many believe, including the WTS and JWs.

  However, if we notice verse 4, we will see something very interesting. It states:

  "But as for me, I said: "It is for nothing that I have toiled. For unreality and vanity I have used up my own power. Truly my judgment is with Jehovah, and my wages with my God." -- Isaiah 49:4

  After reading this verse, we are hard pressed to point to any time, past or present, where Jesus would have ever, ever spoken these above words to Jehovah.

  Is it possible, the true identity of this "mystery" person mentioned above, is still, largely that, a "mystery."

  Just a thought.

  MDS
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

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  MDS

  Larc, you wrote:

  MDS,...As I understand what you just wrote, you are a modern day prophet trying to save the modern day Israel, e.g.,JW-GB, just like the Old Testiment prophets, and Jesus himself tryed to save the Israel of the past. Did I get it right?

  The Governing Body, is really, the soon to be revealed "Man of Lawlessness," officiating in God's [Jehovah's] Temple...whom no one can save. -- 2 Thess. 2:3-12

  Just as the Pharisees, the most of them, could not be saved either, as a group, neither can the Governing Body, as a group be "saved."

  Although, it is possible "individually," for some, to "jump ship," "repent," and be saved, on an individual basis. But not as a collective group.

  This is the same as with, as you remember, the Sanhedrin. Some 71 Priests, who put Jesus to death, as a Council and group. As a group, they opposed Jesus to his death...the vast majority of them. But individually, some few did favor Jesus, receive him as a prophet, and refused when pressured to "vote" for his death.

  As with Jehovah's Witnesses, some 6 million strong, the rank and file JW... God has seen fit to "save" a "remnant" of them... a "remnant" of Jehovah's Witnesses as modern-day Israel, though before this can happen, they must be SEVERELY DISCIPLINED by God's Own hand. He must "treat them badly," God has said. Then they will be restored to God's favor. -- See Isa. 30:26; Micah 4:6,7.

  My role specifically, in all of this, is described for you at Isaiah 49:1-6.

  MDS

  Edited by - MDS on 30 December 2000 0:38:52
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

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  MDS

  If you do not understand my message, whose problem is that? Certainly not mine.

  Ask yourself:

  Did "Israel" understand Jesus, when he was on earth?

  Did "Israel," "understand" his words? I think not. -- John 12:37-41

  Wonder why? .... hmmmmm

  Isaiah 6:9, 10 explains:

  "And he went on to say: "Go, and you must say to this people [Israel], Hear again and again, O men, but DO NOT UNDERSTAND; and see again and again, but DO NOT GET ANY KNOWLEDGE. Make the heart of this people unreceptive, and make their very ears unresponsive, and paste their very eyes together, that they may not see with their eyes and with their ears they may not hear, and that their own heart may not understand and that they may not actually turn back and get healing for themselves." -- Isaiah 6:9, 10

  Also Matthew 13:11 says:

  "...To you it is granted to understand the sacred secrets of the kingdom of the heavens, but to those people it is not granted."

  Understanding of God's Message, must be first "granted," from Heaven above.

  Whatever "your" problem is, you need to work it out with Jehovah, first.

  MDS
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

  1. 
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  MDS

  Hi Frenchy:

  So although Jehovah is displeased with the leadership of the WTBS he is still insisting that people go there for salvation?

  No. No one is "insisting" anything of the sort, at this junction.

  No more than Jesus himself would recommend or "insist," the Pharisees continue to make more "disciples for Gehenna," after he arrived. Jesus did not do this. No, this is not the case at all we us either. Matthew 23:15 tells us:

  "Who to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because you traverse sea and dry land to make one proselyte [literal: "convert", NWT REF Bi] and when he becomes one you make him a subject for Gehenna twice as much so as yourselves."

  Jehovah's Witnesses, whether they know it, realize it, or not, are in no position to spiritually, help ANYONE, now!

  Everything they have "accused" the churches of Christendom of, charged the "sins", condemnations, judgments, against the religionists of their time, so-called "Babylon the Great," is now, yes, now UPON THEM. The "shoe is on the other foot," now. And God and Jesus are the "witnesses."

  Sure, these things were "hidden" from the nation of "Israel," for some time. False teachings, false chronology, and unscriptural practices, "hidden," non revealed to the general populous of "Israel's" eyes. But not so today.

  Jesus plainly said:

  "For there is nothing hidden that will not become manifest, neither anything carefully concealed that will never become known and never come into the open." -- Luke 8:17

  The Governing Body did not pay heed to the above inspired counsel...1914 ... Carl Jonnson's research ... and many more "hidden" things of sinful nation, ...

  They did not pay heed to the counself of Jesus with these sinful things...

  They will pay for this.

  Even back in Jesus' day, the Pharisees "hid" things, wrong things, from the nation of "Israel." But, Jesus "revealed" these "wrongs," these "sins." Similarly, the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses have "hidden" things, sinful "things", that must be EXPOSED.

  It is God who is doing the "exposing,"... bringing them out in the open... to see "our," reactions to them. What will we JWs do? How will we "react?"

  Do we really, really, "LOVE RIGHTEOUSNESS," and hate "LAWLESSNESS", as Hebrews 1:9 recommends?

  Will we "go along to get along," as they say in our society...?

  Will we "go along," with the Governing Body, in known "lawlessness?"
  ..if this becomes KNOWN to us?

  Proverbs 24:12 says:

  "In case you should say: "Look! We did not know of this, will not He himself that is making an estimate of hearts discern it, and he himself that is observing your soul know and certainly pay back to earthling man according to his activity?"

  God will know,... He knows whether we "know," "understand," or not... He knows.

  So, when informed, what will we do ? Will we press for "reform," change, repentance...? Or, just "go along to get along," which?

  Which?

  The "Two Witnesses," of Revelation chapter 11, are wearing, "sackcloth,"... why?

  What is "Sackcloth," a symbol of, according to the Bible?

  Whether we realize or not, whether discern it or not, we today, have reached "critical mass," if you will. The same as when Jesus Christ came to "inspect" the nation of Israel, who was busy "proselytizing" among the nations, converting individuals to "Judaism," -- also the same as Jehovah's Witnesses are doing right now...preaching to everyone. "Critical Mass."

  It is defined as being:

  "the amount of a given fissionable material necessary to sustain a CHAIN REACTION...An amount necessary or sufficient to have a SIGNIFICANT EFFECT or to ACHIEVE A RESULT." -- Random House Webster's College Dictionary, 1991.

  We have reached that time.

  A planted substance has been released among those within the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses... "real truth" or exposure of falsehood. A foreign substance that we are not accustomed to dealing with ... real truth about the FALSE chronology taught the entire organization over many, many years, has been released. It is God's doing. The teaching of the date of 1914, false, a false teaching taught over many, years. This is "leaven," in God's sight. The Pharisees, did it before to ancient "Israel," Jesus revealed they planted it . Similarly, the Governing Body has done the same thing to modern day "Israel" of our times, Jehovah's Name People, Jehovah's Witnesses. -- Matt. 16:12

  1931-2001 70 YEARS CARRYING THE NAME!

  Uniquely, Jehovah's Witnesses, after carrying the Name of God, for close to 70 years, must realize that they, as a people, as a organization, SHOULD, SHOULD, SHOULD, be able to CORRECT THEMSELVES, CORRECT ITSELF as a people, and redeem itself before our God. We've had the Name since 1931. We are fast approaching the year of 2001. Great Significance ahead! 70 years! A special number to Jehovah God...indeed. We've been in a Covenant relationship with God, for 70 years!

  A time for inspection!

  Can we correct ourselves, as an organization?

  We are clearly wrong about 1914, and many, many other teachings and practices...many. Can we correct ourselves?

  Will we ALLOW ourselves to be "corrected," as we know we should?

  Jehovah God, and Jesus, want to know...

  Our inspection, will come as quick, and UNEXPECTEDLY, the same as for "Jerusalem," during Jesus' day. Jesus said,

  "...If you, even you, had discerned in this day the things having to do with peace -- but now they have been hid from your eyes...they will not leave a stone upon a stone in you, because you did not discern the time of your being inspected." -- Luke 19:43, 45

  No one, no one of "Israel," really, "discerned the time" of the all important, "inspection" back in Jesus' day.

  It is the same today.

  Jehovah's Witnesses, modern-day "Israel," does not understand what is really before us, ... what's ahead, the "inspection," the "verdict," being passed on too. A verdict passed upon a Disobedient Nation, who have "carried God's Name," upon itself for close to 70 years now. We have not "discerned," out of own HARDHEARTEDNESS. The problem is ours, not God's. And we will be "judged" according to those terms, in complete righteousness and "fairness." Jehovah is our "judge." -- Malachi 3:5

  ...You openly disagree with the WTBS. Are you saying that they are the true religion? Are you saying that we should all be JW’s and ‘secretly’ do different than what we are taught? What happens when we get found out and get removed? Our salvation is lost? What is your recommendation?

  Now, let's take every thing you said above, and apply it to Jesus, to clear this up.

  Why did Jesus OPENLY disagree with the religious leaders of his time? Why? He did this because he was COMMANDED in the Mosiac Law Covenant to do so. No, He did not want to "bear sin along with" the Pharisees. So, he spoke up. Just like we should do, today. (See Lev. 19:17)

  Are they, the Jehovah's Witnesses, the true religion? And how can such a deplorable situation exist among God's Own People?

  Well, what did Jesus say about the nation of "Israel," the misguided nation under the leadership of the wicked Pharisees and Sadduccees -- what did he say? Jesus tells the Samaritan woman this, at John 4:22:

  "You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know because salvation originates with the Jews."

  Jehovah's Witnesses are in the same boat.

  Actually Matthew 13:41 says it all:

  "The Son of man will send forth his angels, and they will collect out from HIS KINGDOM all things that cause stumbling and persons who are doing lawlessness."

  Clearly, "lawlessness" and "stumbling," DOES EXIST within the "kingdom of God." That point is clear. This must be an EARTHLY "kingdom," since "persons" are involved ... who are constantly "doing lawlessness," and "stumbling" within this particular "kingdom."

  Therefore, we cannot get around it. Spiritual "Israel," is foretold by way of prophecy, to be in SERIOUS SPIRITUAL TROUBLE, in the last days... serious spiritual problems, which makes the most critical situation, for our times.

  The Bible says it. It is undeniable.

  Again are you recommending that everyone become a JW? Are they truly (and exclusively) ‘God’s People’? What about the other religions? They are organized also. As organizations they are able to do much more than an individual. Is Jehovah using them as well? Why or why not? What is it that makes the WTBS God’s organization? What are their credentials?

  "Judgment, must start with the House of God." -- 1 Peter 4:17

  Israel, must be straightened out, before they can help anyone else, namely those people of the Abrahamic Covenant, other people who will be finally allowed to "stream to the Mountain" of Jehovah. Perhaps, you remember reading Isa. 2:2-4 and Micah 4:1-4. These are "Abrahamic Covenant" peoples, from many nations who will benefit from "law going forth from Zion," in these last days of ours.

  But, first, first, first, modern-day "Israel," must get "straightened out." That comes first.

  Case in point.

  In Jesus' day...

  First the Divine invitation goes out to "Israel." A 7 year invitation, starting with Jesus' ministry of 3 1/2 years and extending up to the time of Cornelius' convertion. 7 Years. A 7 year invitation, given exclusively to the Jewish nation.

  This is the way Jehovah God will handle this situation too, of our time, with modern-day "Israel," of our times.

  Remember, Jehovah God is a Great Time Keeper... and as we said be fore, really, "Judgment starts FIRST with the house of God" -- "Israel," as 1 Peter 4:17 brings out.

  Also indicative of this fact, is Revelation 11th chapter which shows a "measuring of the temple and those worshiping in it," work, which is to go on FIRST, before, the "1,260 days" of preaching "repentance," is done, within God's organization itself. -- See Revelation 11:1-3.

  I hope this helps.

  MDS
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  41

  Jehovah's Organization

  by Sassenach in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've recently had a discussion with a witness friend in which she said that jehovah had to have an organization.

  if not jehovah's witnesses, then who else could possibly have his approval?.

  what i would like to know is if jehovah has always had an organization, who were they?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  MDS

  Hi "Ianao":

  If we have lost all this, are we then ALL eternally lost? ... Interesting, yet disturbing question. How DETESTABLE we must truly be to YHWH.

  Actually, we are not... we are made in "God's image." We are not "destestable" to Him. Lets listen to God's inspired Word at 2 Peter 3:9 very carefully.

  "Jehovah is not slow respecting his promise, as some people consider slowness, but He is PATIENT with you because He does not desire ANY TO BE DESTROYED, but desires ALL TO ATTAIN TO REPENTANCE." -- 2 Peter 3:9

  So, what do we learn from these verses?

  Jehovah is Patient, patient, patient...

  He does not "rush to judgment" when dealing with sinful humans. No, no, no. He does not rush to "judge" others of our number [like we see demonstrated on this board, over and over again...constantly judging one another....constantly accusing one another... constantly imputing bad motive to our fellow man... That is MAN's way. But Jehovah is not like man...not like man...but different...superior.]

  Really, Jehovah wants every single person living, that's every single person who has ever lived even, God wishes LIFE FOR THEM. In many, many cases though, "Repentance" was and is a must, but Jehovah wants LIFE for them, in the end. That is God's Will.

  But, some are not willing to repent...like "Jezebel" of Revelation 2:21.

  "And I gave her time to repent, but she is not willing to repent ... ."

  God provided time... as He always does...

  Similarly, Jehovah is going to give every one alive today, a "chance," a real "chance." A Genuine Opportunity for salvation. The same Jehovah back in the first century, the same "judges," is the same Jehovah and Jesus you are facing today. They are the same.

  You will be given a fair "chance," ... for the Bible promises you at that.

  So, let keep a "positive" attitude about all things we see today...really.

  Jehovah will do His part...we don't have to worry about that...But, it is up to us, to do the rest. But, Jehovah is pulling for all of us. He is not our enemy, but our friend...He wants to help.

  Happily we are all "in position," now to visualize many, many wonderful things, all from the Hand of the Almighty, Jehovah Himself. But, even more astounding things are ahead.

  We have "arrived" at that special time, we've been waiting for. That time is now.

  So, take courage, my friend, for we have a "fair judge," watching over all things...who rewards in Justice.

  MDS

  Edited by - MDS on 29 December 2000 19:12:40