jwn poster, uzzah, posted a link to this article in one of his older posts which he brought to the top, but i think this excellent article deserves a thread of its own.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/members/private/178981/1/interesting-phone-call-media-the-blood-issuenational post http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=2041666sept.
28, 2009. a witness accountchurch denies moving children to avoid transfusions.
I think the final straw was dad breaking mom's arm.
Your Dad was an attorney who did work for Watchtower when needed, and his behavior toward your Mom was so violent that he actually broke her arm? It wasn't some kind of accident?
I haven't listened to the broadcast on Six Screens (mentioned on another thread) or read anything of this until your posts. I am always shocked when I hear of violence in JW families. It's something I never saw but read plenty about now that I am out.
i have a request to our friends living in the usa.
im trying to track down an article printed by time magazine in which they interviewed fred franz.
in my local library here in liverpool they have a massive bound volume collection of time going back to the 1930s.
mentalclarity is wrong about Russell's expectation for 1914.
That remark hit me too, but I believe mantalclarity was simply quoting the Time Magazine article about Fred Franz; it was that article that said this...
The next year he [Fred Franz] dropped out of the University of Cincinnati without completing his junior year; he saw no sense in remaining because the movement's founder, Charles Taze Russell, had announced Oct. 1, 1914, as the date for Christ's Second Coming.
But you are absolutely right, C.T. Russell believed in one date only for the return of Christ and that was 1874. Until the day he died Russell believed that Christ had been invisibly present (parousia) since 1874.
Either Time Magazine got their information mixed up or F. Franz had misled them.
i have a request to our friends living in the usa.
im trying to track down an article printed by time magazine in which they interviewed fred franz.
in my local library here in liverpool they have a massive bound volume collection of time going back to the 1930s.
The perks of higher education - you have access to online library/digital journal database
In addition, higher education gives you -- mental clarity!
(That is a great screen name, BTW)
has anyone watched the netflix documentary series called "the keepers"?
it's a true life based series about the murder of a nun and the associated coverup (church + state).
it was riveting to see how much can be swept under the carpet (even today?!
I saw this a few weeks ago and you are right, it was riveting.
Not only were two murders unsolved, one of them a Nun, but the case branched out into child sexual molestation issues by one particular Priest. When the Nun learned of the sexual molestation of one student and confronted the Priest about it she disappeared and was found murdered.
The stalling, cover-ups, lying, etc, by the Catholic Church regarding the molestations is very similar to the same actions by Watchtower, the main difference being that Watchtower has no political clout.
In the documentary information regarding the murders and molestations seemed to vanish when it reached the desk of the District Attorney.
i was a jw for 11 years , came to know ttatt and wrote my disassociation letter 5 years ago.
since then i had been an atheist and trying all i can to spread awareness for “still in” members.
my wife and mom are still jws and i do get along with them perfectly.
I would say "How was prison life?"
Not really - I wouldn't bring that up - but he did do prison time for Fish and Game violations. Although he was an elder for many years he let greed set in, which moved him to violate laws for the profits.
I have lost track of him and have no idea what his standing is with the religion now.
i left the religion back in the early 2000's, tell you the truth it's been so long now i've been out i don't remember exactly when i left.
i definitely used this site a lot when i first left and it was a great asset.
when i left i somehow managed to get my parents to come with me.
I believe this is also why they are against holidays. The paganism thing is to hide their real motive...
I agree wholeheartedly with your remarks. JWs accept many pagan connected practices - wedding rings, sending flowers to a funeral, playing with pinjatas at a party, etc. Holidays get the pagan label, but as you say the real reason for condemning them is to isolate JWs from other people, even their own families.
If you think about it, when do families get together the most? At holiday and birthday times, yet JWs are forbidden to participate in such celebrations, therefore requiring them to separate from family members that are not JWs.
This is a hideous religion. Isolation and control is it's objective. If that isn't a cult I don't know what is.
i left the religion back in the early 2000's, tell you the truth it's been so long now i've been out i don't remember exactly when i left.
i definitely used this site a lot when i first left and it was a great asset.
when i left i somehow managed to get my parents to come with me.
... it's more difficult for people in their 30's and older to make new friends. People by that age already have made their social circles. It's the one problem that is difficult to solve for those who leave the cult.
It is by design.
Watchtower keeps JWs isolated so that the only social life they have is with other JWs. The Organization plays on a very powerful human need, the need for socializing.
If JWs were allowed to make friends outside of the Watchtower organization leaving would be easy, but Watchtower uses isolation as a tool to keep people trapped inside.
(To me, this is a mark of a very high control cult religion.)
I think there are many JWs who stay in for social reasons only, although they might not want to say it out loud, and even though the friendships are very artificial. In a way I don't blame them. Some people can cope better living life without strong social connections, while others need it desperately.
But even if many stay in for social reasons, it still creates a weakened organization because their hearts are no longer in it, and usually neither is their money.
i was looking around from some information on the wt's stance concerning the use of stem cells, and i came across this article on a defending jehovah's witnesses blog.. rather than informing the reader all that much about stem cells, the author diverts the conversation into a discussion of "blood fractions" (*note: the term "blood fractions" appears to be another one of those wt bloodspeak terms coined by the wt.
"blood components" or "blood products" are the terms used more frequently by the medical world.
"fractions" implies tiny amounts).
JWs often don't listen to themselves.
From the OP...
For example, Gray's Anatomy says: "Blood consists of a fluid medium called the plasma in which are suspended minute structures called the formed elements of the blood. The formed elements include (1) the red blood corpuscles (RBC), (2) the white blood cells (WBC), and (3) the platelets."-pg 727
The quote above clearly shows that it takes 4 components to make blood, the plasma, red corpuscles, the white cells, and the platelets.
This quote is then reinforced by another quote...
"Dailey's Notes on Blood" says that red blood cells, white blood cells, platelets, and plasma, "are referred to as whole blood."–John E Dailey; 4th edition.
Again, this shows that it takes 4 things to make blood.
However JWs will not allow even transfusing just one of those things. They will say that plasma, for instance, is blood and is therefore off limits. But the quote they provided clearly says it takes 4 things to make blood, not just one thing - plasma by itself is not even close to being blood; neither are the other components by themselves.
Then the JW poster follows up with this remark...
So, "blood" is naturally and logically differentiated by its four primary components.
Whatever that means. I think he/she means that any single component of blood is equal to whole blood, which is ridiculous. And this is said after a reference was just quoted saying that it takes 4 components to make blood, not just one.
As JWs so often do, the quoted poster cites a few sources, then makes tremendous leaps in logic to try to lead you to their own conclusion.
circuit overseers, elders, ministerial servants, pioneers and rank & file are stressed out over an ex-jw (kevin) who has visited nearly 20 congregations (orange county) and has high-jacked the opening prayers and done some effective witnessing before he is escorted to the back door.
and everything is caught on video!.
kevin is also visiting numerous jw cart locations from the los angeles area to orange county and giving a most effective wiitness at each location and they're all on video.
I noticed that in the videos I watched, the kingdom halls he visited were practically empty.
I noticed the empty seats too. It appears that meeting attendance is not so good these days.
hello there.. my father just claimed that the good thing about being a witness was how they just let the bible interpret itself.
now i know the irony in this statement, but i dont know what to show him that he just cant discard with some ignorant excuse.
any ideas?
Baptizing children.
Watchtower has published articles detailing the baptism of children as young as 6 years old. Two examples..
(Baptized at 6)
In the summer of 1946, I was baptized at the international convention in Cleveland, Ohio. Although I was only six years of age, I was determined to fulfill my dedication to Jehovah. That summer I served as a pioneer for the first time. I remember one morning placing 40 magazines with people seated at The Plaza in San Diego, California. My being tiny and talkative had a lot to do with it, I’m sure. (W 3-1-1992, p27. Pursuing a Goal Set at Six Years of Age, life story of Sandra Cowan)
(Baptized at 8)
"In Bonaire, six-year-old Renzo was invited to the Kingdom Hall and enjoyed it very much. A Bible study was started with him, and from then on he refused to go to the Catholic church....Subsequently, Renzo’s father and mother along with one of Renzo’s Bible students were baptized. Renzo, now eight years old, was baptized at a circuit assembly in Bonaire." (Year Book 2002, p. 110 Curaçao)
Only adults were baptized in the Bible. Even Jesus himself, who was no doubt much more advanced than normal 12 year olds and was discussing scripture with the priests, was not baptized until he reached adulthood. When he was 12 the Bible says - "47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers." (Luke 21:47)
Watchtower has continually said that 30 was the age of manhood in that society, which was Jesus' age at the time of his baptism.
Baptizing small children is a clear example of "going beyond what is written."
As a side point, when those baptized children are misbehaving in some way they are treated as adults in judicial situations.
"When a baptized minor becomes involved in wrongdoing that threatens the cleanness of the congregation, the assigned committee should meet with such individual just as they would with any other member of the congregation" (Pay Attention to Yourself and to All the Flock, p. 98)
