soft+gentle

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Posts by soft+gentle

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  269

  The Hubble, Yahweh, the Bible, and faith.

  by Nickolas in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there have been several threads in which the views of the universe provided by the hubble space telescope have been discussed.

  i guess this will be another one.

  there's a new series being broadcast here in canada on the oasis hd nature channel entitled hubble's canvas.

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  soft+gentle

  jgnat

  soft+gentle - In contrast Yahweh, the bible and faith tends towards denying mystery and possibility suggesting that there will always be more of the same - (to me a kind of annihilation).

  I suggest that fundamentalist religions demand religious certainty. You won't find this with the older religions, such as (non-fundamentalist) Judaism. Catholics as well are comfortable for the most part with mystery. I was contemplating the lives of the saints (post-bible) and I can't imagine there are many modern Catholics who take those stories literally. The chatechism is like a grand made-up story that a community of believers has incorporated as their own. Perhaps ritual supersedes meaning, and that may be closer to spiritual fulfillment than a forced belief "because the bible says so." Muslims similarly, are united by common behavior and rituals, not belief. This is why muslims are bemused by the evangelical's insistence on coming to a common belief about Christ. There is no similar requirement in their religion. I came to a broader understanding of the fundamentalist view and it's implications in The Battle for God by Karen Armstrong .

  this comment has nailed it for me. thank you jgnat. Ordering the book as we speak

  I also think the reformation and protestantism are very implicated in the move toward an emphasis on rational faith and christian fundamentalism. Jehovahs witnessses were born out of this. And to think I was a catholic atheist before I became a witness - what a stupid move
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  122

  "Mentally Diseased" are confirmed as offensive words of hate crime. Help needed, please.

  by Amelia Ashton in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  my youngest is studying law.

  browsing through one of her books i came across a chapter freedom of association.

  it covers the well known categories, colour, race, religion, sexuality etc.

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  soft+gentle

  well done amelia.
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  21

  "Putting on and taking off the flesh" in more scientific terms ;)

  by tec in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i would like to share some understanding i received today, and i would like to share the understanding first and then the scientific understanding.

  as the faithful understand, we are spirit 'underneath' our flesh.

  i put underneath in quotations because that's not quite the right word.

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  soft+gentle

  nice thread Tec, thumbs up from me.

  I don't understand the specifics of the science but what I like is the marriage between ancient wisdom and modern wisdom.
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  269

  The Hubble, Yahweh, the Bible, and faith.

  by Nickolas in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there have been several threads in which the views of the universe provided by the hubble space telescope have been discussed.

  i guess this will be another one.

  there's a new series being broadcast here in canada on the oasis hd nature channel entitled hubble's canvas.

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  soft+gentle

  aguest

  In contrast Yahweh, the bible and faith tends towards denying mystery and possibility suggesting that there will always be more of the same

  "Yahweh" and the Bible, perhaps, dear SG (peace to you!), but certainly not the Most Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies... or faith. Faith is FOUNDED on possibility. Faith BELIEVES in the POSSIBILITY... in spite of the fact that what IS possible may not have been beheld. In fact, it believes even more: in the REALITY of that which some believe IMpossible. That it also includes mystery is only due to what has not yet been revealed to the one OF such faith. Until then, "it"... whatever it is... just may BE a mystery; however, faith in the REVEALER of Truth, the Holy One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH... allows one to know that it will not REMAIN a mystery. Just as faith in the processes of science leads those with faith in THAT (which I also have, as regards the physical world)... to know the same. In that light, I have always said that science hasn't figured out HOW to access the spiritual... YET... because it does not have the TOOLS to do so... YET. But I do not deny the POSSIBILITY... and, therefore, do not deny the REALITY of such a thing. Others, however, vehemently do!

  excellent clarification aguest and I agree wholeheartedly.
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  161

  Theological Arguments, Human Realities

  by AllTimeJeff in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as i have sunken to a new low in condescending posts (according to botchtowersociety, who truthfully is an expert on all things bullshit), it did occur to me that discussions, debates, and mud slinging insult matches on this board often have a common root.. let me put out there that i am not an atheist, nor an agnostic.

  frankly, i respect your right to believe that god is a trinity.

  that he is jesus.

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  soft+gentle

  jeff here is a question for you

  you said

  soft+gentle,

  I think one of the great tragedies of history is to learn how cheap life is. To this day, a woman in most parts of the world is subserviant, if not an outright slave to the man that owns her. The justification in many/most of these cases is the religion they all believe in.

  Those women, by the billions, are as important and equal to the men who abuse them, and WAY more important then the religious theology which keeps them and teaches them that they are substandard

  How is the reasoning you are using here any different from that of jehovahs witnesses who teach that the world empire of false religion is responsible for mankinds's woes?
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  161

  Theological Arguments, Human Realities

  by AllTimeJeff in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as i have sunken to a new low in condescending posts (according to botchtowersociety, who truthfully is an expert on all things bullshit), it did occur to me that discussions, debates, and mud slinging insult matches on this board often have a common root.. let me put out there that i am not an atheist, nor an agnostic.

  frankly, i respect your right to believe that god is a trinity.

  that he is jesus.

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  soft+gentle

  Jeff, you are an intelligent guy and I respect you enormously but I think Sulla's main point is that as jws and xjws we can be quite arrogant and dismissive of subjects we know nothing about simply because this is the way we have been taught to think. It is such a shame as there is a whole new world waiting to be discovered by us.
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  161

  Theological Arguments, Human Realities

  by AllTimeJeff in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as i have sunken to a new low in condescending posts (according to botchtowersociety, who truthfully is an expert on all things bullshit), it did occur to me that discussions, debates, and mud slinging insult matches on this board often have a common root.. let me put out there that i am not an atheist, nor an agnostic.

  frankly, i respect your right to believe that god is a trinity.

  that he is jesus.

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  soft+gentle

  sulla

  very interesting - the idea of masks is also very Greek but it is Roman too ( the Romans kept masks of their dead male ancestors in their homes and the male heir was privilged to wear his father's mask at funerals) - perhaps the trinity doctrine is a fusion of Greek, Roman and Jewish theology although I don't mean any disrespect in saying this.
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  161

  Theological Arguments, Human Realities

  by AllTimeJeff in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as i have sunken to a new low in condescending posts (according to botchtowersociety, who truthfully is an expert on all things bullshit), it did occur to me that discussions, debates, and mud slinging insult matches on this board often have a common root.. let me put out there that i am not an atheist, nor an agnostic.

  frankly, i respect your right to believe that god is a trinity.

  that he is jesus.

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  soft+gentle

  jeff

  The Human Reality is simply that I, we, are more important then Jesus.

  this is a very egocentric view to take and is part of the reason why theology has its place imo.

  edit: by the way I'm not saying that you are egocentric but that the view is egocentric.
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  161

  Theological Arguments, Human Realities

  by AllTimeJeff in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as i have sunken to a new low in condescending posts (according to botchtowersociety, who truthfully is an expert on all things bullshit), it did occur to me that discussions, debates, and mud slinging insult matches on this board often have a common root.. let me put out there that i am not an atheist, nor an agnostic.

  frankly, i respect your right to believe that god is a trinity.

  that he is jesus.

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  soft+gentle

  Sulla, be careful - you are heading towarding getting yourself thrown off this board and that would be a shame.

  Regarding the trinity my understanding is that the doctrine was postioned between 2 extremes - Sabellism and Arianism. At stake I think was whether or not the Son was independently divine whilst being one substance with God (the trinity), or whether or not on the one hand, God manifested via 3 different modes (sabellism) and on the other hand whether he was an incaranation of God's wisdom and became the son when he was born existing as the word before coming to the earth. The middle position would then be the doctrine of the trinity. Although I may be quite mistaken about this as it is quite complicated.

  I agree that we as xjws are very prejudiced against theology.
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  46

  My father's funeral

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  last week i attended my father's funeral in hobart.

  i was the first time i have been in a kingdom hall in several years, and many years since i had attended the hall of my childhood, but felt like it was just yesterday.

  the funeral talk was quite a departure from normal, so worth writing about.

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  soft+gentle

  jwfacts, I'm so sorry about the the way you were treated at your dad's funeral and the situation between you and your mum.