Posts by nicolaou

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

God made everything. He has every right to do as he pleases with his own creation

I can imagine Josef Fritzl making a similar defence. There's an awful lot of word salad in this discussion but ultimately you either condemn someone for failing to save a life or you don't.

It's no defense to say that we can't understand the mind of god. We do understand that it's wrong to let a child die when it could have been prevented.

Argue all you like that it's not as simple as that but in so doing you lose the moral high ground.

Christians (and Muslims etc) regularly denounce atheists as having no moral code. Well you know what? We aren't the ones worshipping and defending the atrocities of a child killer.

You are.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

I was a child!!! Where was this supposed help?

Listen to this plea from the heart and feel ashamed if you dare to try excusing God for failing to lift a finger.

I don't know your story Lee and won't ask you to share anything you don't want to but I can imagine. I hope you are doing well now.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

Try taking Jesus at his word. Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father. That is all we need.” Jesus replied: "Philip, I have been with you for a long time. Don't you know who I am? If you have seen me, you have seen the Father."

John 14:8,9 Contemporary English Version

I really would like the Christians on the forum to engage here. Doesn't it bother you that Jesus aligns himself with the child killing God of the Old Testament/Hebrew Scriptures?
The moral gymnastics you have to perform to maintain your view of Jesus as the 'Good Shepherd' surely betray an unwillingness to see the obvious for what it is.
Don't forget I've been where you are, most of us here have.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Cofty: Then there is no possible excuse and the person is morally responsible for a child's death.

I agree. That's the only conclusion I can arrive at.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

You assume correctly.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Stan, I'm not ignoring parental responsibility, guilt can lay with several individuals all at once, it's the inaction of the observer I'm asking about.

Whether anyone else has failed to care or not would you be guilty if you'd failed to act?

Slim', you have of course seen where I'm going with this so c'mon, give me a good reason for God's failure to act?

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

There's no reason for inaction Cofty. Acting to prevent the child's death would incur no penalty or injury to you.

And I understand what you say about legal liability but put that to one side, it's just the moral responsibility I'm interested in.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

No subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where I'm going with this. Please consider the following scenario.

You're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train. A high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge! Thankfully, disaster can be averted. You don't even have to get up off the bench, just put out your arm and scoop up the child.

But you don't. You watch as the little boy falls onto the tracks and is pulverised by 185 tonnes of metal.

My question. What responsibility do you bear for the child's death?

20

Unbelief and Salvation

by lriddle80 in

hebrews 6:4-8. for it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the holy spirit, 5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of god and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the son of god to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

7 for land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from god.

8 but if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned.. but then i read articles that say that you cannot lose your salvation and that this scripture isn't talking about that.. but then 2 timothy says.

nicolaou

However, nothing external to ourselves can separate us from the love of God in Christ. Romans 8:39

Vanderhoven you have never been willing to debate your faith and the claims you make with me. I'll ask again if you would change your mind.

63

How Do You Know You Are In The Wrong Religion?

by Vanderhoven7 in

i believe this list which many of us worked on needs to see the light of day again...and added to if possible.. you know you are in the wrong religion:1. when the all important question is not: "do you believe in the lord jesus christ?"....but....

"do you believe in the "faithful and discreet slave" appointed in brooklyn in 1919?"2.

when you will be refused baptism if: a. you don't believe jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bc (whereas all non-jw scholars, all encyclopedias and all history books say this event took place in 587 bc.)b.

nicolaou

We visited my parents yesterday. Dad's never been involved but Mum is JW to her core. Baptised around '71 or '72 and never wavered.

Her friends in the only congregation she's ever been a part of are now very elderly, some are in care homes or no longer with us. The congregation has been her support network, social club and extended family for half a century.

I'm as apostate/atheist as it gets but I wouldn't dream of taking this away from her now, how cruel would that be?

Even I would now say that this is the right religion for her.

I'd challenge any Christian here who argues that JW's don't have the truth to take up the debate with me about your own beliefs. It's easy to poke fun at the faith of folks like my Mum when you know they'll never be here to defend themselves.

Pick on me instead - if you dare.