Posts by vienne

15

William Redding

by Bobcat in

is anyone familiar with this person and his possible relationship with ctr or the wt?.

if you are wondering why i ask, take a look here and scroll down one page and start reading a little.. i could not find any mention of him in the wt online library.

i wonder if this is something barbara anderson would be familiar with?.

vienne

The anti-Doctor, anti-vaccination stance arose under Rutherford, not under Russell.

15

William Redding

by Bobcat in

is anyone familiar with this person and his possible relationship with ctr or the wt?.

if you are wondering why i ask, take a look here and scroll down one page and start reading a little.. i could not find any mention of him in the wt online library.

i wonder if this is something barbara anderson would be familiar with?.

Barbour adopted the 1914 date in the 1870s. The first mention of the 1914 date as the end of The Times of the Gentiles is in the September 1875 issue of The Herald of the Morning. In passing Barbour remarked, “The time of the Gentiles,” viz. Their seven prophetic times of 2520 years ... which began when God gave all into the hands of Nebuchadnezzar, in 606 B. C; do not end until 1914."

Russell accepted that. From Separate Identity [pages 216-217]:

Russell wrote an article entitled “Gentile Times: When Do They End?” for The Bible Examiner while still in Philadelphia. It was published in the October 1876 issue. Though his position on Gentile Times was the same as that held by Barbour, he didn’t mention Barbour or the Herald of the Morning, and Barbour discounted this as an open association with him.[1] Russell pointed to 1914, the date Barbour borrowed from Elliott’s Horae, and stated his belief that the ‘taking of the Bride’ was the first act to expect from the Christ:

"At the commencement of our Christian era, 606 years of this time had passed, (70 years captivity, and 536 from Cyrus to Christ) which deducted from 2520, would show that the seven times will end in A.D. 1914; when Jerusalem shall be delivered forever, and the Jew say of the Deliverer, “Lo, this is our God, we have waited for Him and He will save us.” When Gentile Governments shall have been dashed to pieces; when God shall have poured out of his fury upon the nation, and they acknowledge, him King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

But, some one will say, “If the Lord intended that we should know, He would have told us plainly and distinctly how long.” But, no, brethren, He never does so. The Bible is to be a light to God’s children; – to the world, foolishness. Many of its writings are solely for our edification upon whom the ends of the world are come. As well say that God should have put the gold on top instead of in the bowels of the earth it would be too common; it would lose much of its value. So with truth; but, “to you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom.

We will ask, but not now answer, another question: If the Gentile Times end in 1914, (and there are many other and clearer evidences pointing to the same time) and we are told that it shall be with fury poured out; a time of trouble such as never was before, nor ever shall be; a day of wrath, etc., how long before does the church escape? As Jesus says, 'watch, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape those things coming upon the world.'"

Brethren, the taking by Christ of His Bride, is evidently, one of the first acts in the Judgment; for judgment must begin at the house of God.

[1] C. T. Russell: Gentile Times: When Do They End? Bible Examiner, October 1876. The article is signed from “W. Philadelphia.”

15

William Redding

by Bobcat in

is anyone familiar with this person and his possible relationship with ctr or the wt?.

if you are wondering why i ask, take a look here and scroll down one page and start reading a little.. i could not find any mention of him in the wt online library.

i wonder if this is something barbara anderson would be familiar with?.

vienne

Russell's view of Gentile Times and 1914 came from Barbour and other earlier 19th Century writers, not from Redding. Redding read Time is at Hand and loved what Russell wrote. There was no other association. We discuss the development of Barbourite chronology in Nelson Barbour: The Millennium's Forgotten Prophet.

http://www.lulu.com/shop/b-w-schulz/nelson-barbour-the-millenniums-forgotten-prophet/paperback/product-5424152.html

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

Sparky, you are correct.

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

Ruba, I presume you're trying to dish humor. If not, you've scored very high on the gullibility scale.

Orph, That's interesting speculation, but I cannot use speculation. I must be able to document what I write from a contemporary source. All I have from available documentation is his father's shifting occupations and a record of investment gone wrong. Nathan, himself, seems not to have had any social status. He attended high school; there is no record of exceptional behavior or status there. He lived with his parents into his 20s. He worked part time in retail as a clerk and go-for. After high school and after attending the Cedar Point Convention he took up colporteur work, what today's Witnesses call pioneering. His mother was a domestic before marriage, someone's maid or housekeeper, a servant. The family does not appear in the local press except in later years as old timers with memories. His dad managed theaters, one after another, finally becoming part owner of one. This is not a socially mobile family. It is a moderately well off family.

What might have been is not history. What might be is not history. So while your speculations are interesting, they lack proof based on a verifiable contemporary source.

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

This thread helps explain who I am https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5116004591992832/who-b-w-schulz-anyone-know

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

No never a witness. Some family who are. I write history. click the link to my blog on the first page and you'll see our two books on witness history.

The pillow fight story has it that when Knorr was new at Bethel he skipped the family Watch Tower study and got into a pillow fight with two other boys in his room which was directly over the meeting space stage. Rutherford stopped the study and went upstairs to investigate and got hit in the face with a pillow. He, surprisingly, took it rather well. True? No way of knowing.

Told to me by a very old man who was at Bethel in the 1950s.

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

thanks, sparky. very helpful. Did you hear the 'pillow fight story'? Probably apocryphal, but interesting.

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

Sparky,

Your comment is useful to me. Would you please tell me what years you were at Bethel so I can put this in context? If you do not want to put that in a public post you can PM me. thanks

55

Knorr Family

by vienne in

for a secondary project, i need basic biography of n. h. knorr's parents and brother and sister.

we have some details, which i have posted on our history blog: https://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

if you can add to this, please do..

vienne

family is family?

That's a really broad definition. I don't know any of my 'family' beyond my grandparents' [both sides] cousins and I do not consider more distant relations as 'family', though we are genetically related. As a historian, I'm interested in the connections that molded personality and events. Some connections, especially with ideas, are ages long. In forthcoming volume 2 of our Separate Identity, we connect Russellite beliefs with a trail of ideas back to the 17th Century. But what Russell's great great great grandparents did has no traceable effect on him.

On the Austro-German side of my family you can find people who ruled most of Europe. But that's so distant that if it affects my thinking I would not know how. Interestingly though, there is a long line of writers among my ancestors. These include my dad, my great grandfather who was also an artist, back to a 17th Century man who wrote on religious topics. Did my genetics impel me to become a writer? Did the fact that my mom, a grand aunt and others were teachers turn me into an educator? How would one prove that?

N.H. Knorr did not made soup. He became a manager, an executive of a religious publishing house and head of a minor religion. Did his distant relations' ability to form a food company translate into Nathan Knorr's administrative ability? There's no way to prove that. Any conclusion would be mere speculation.