Posts by vienne

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

vint,

Yes, he got a haircut, combed his hair, put on a suit, but with brown shoes and an black suit. He not quite there yet, and a bit of personal clean up does not change what's inside.

59

Why isn't this forum growing like reddit exjw??

by nowwhat? in

admittedly it 90% crap over there but still they are up to 80k in subscribers.

over here it's the same half dozen or so that posts something, including myself.

why is that?.

vienne

How is it right wing? I do not see that. But down votes are okay with me, as long as you read it and think about it. Rejecting it because it makes you uncomfortable is proof of what I wrote.

59

Why isn't this forum growing like reddit exjw??

by nowwhat? in

admittedly it 90% crap over there but still they are up to 80k in subscribers.

over here it's the same half dozen or so that posts something, including myself.

why is that?.

I read most of the posts here. Some are thoughtful and well done. Some, occasionally many, are illiterate and based on poor research. We get those who believe any negative thing they read on the Internet. Their posts are a huge turn off; though they interest me because of my master's thesis [in the works], they are cringe-worthy and won't convince an informed believer.

Spelling errors are common on the World-Wide Web. I try to take care when I post somewhere, but they creep out. And most often here, they're just typos. [e.g. "Maeby after thousands and thousands comments"] But when they're consistent, they indicate a low-level to almost non existent education. That effects thinking ability, and it shows in the post's content. Read up in this comment chain and you'll find a few. The solution must take place on an individual basis. That is, if we know we lack mental training and an informative education, we should seek to remedy that. "Seek wisdom" says one of the Proverbs. And stop being gullible.

One's education should continue through out a life time. I like challenging thoughts. I'm not satisfied until I've either rejected or accepted a new thought - on the basis of rational research. Working with Uncle B has put me to the test many times. It's fun. But I see here some whose response to a challenge is anger and ad hominem. That must lead to a frustrating, unsatisfying life.

Some who post here did not really know their former religion. As Witnesses they took in what others said without delving into it. Be a Berean. Put things to the test. You see these posters when they ask a question about Witness belief that they should have been able to answer on their own with the most basic Witness 'education.' This saddens me. They've brought into their life away from the Watchtower the same problems that caused them issues as a Witness. Again, this is something only the individual can remedy. My grand uncle says "thinking hurts." In fact neurologists have found that intense thought swells brain cells, and thinking can become uncomfortable. In my student-teacher experience I saw students who resisted thinking because it made them uncomfortable. There are free programs in most school districts for adult education. Take a few. Stretch out. Educate yourself.

Some of us, probably most of us, have a firmly planted belief system, not just religiously but in every other aspect of life. That's how people are. But some of those who post here resist challenges to their beliefs without giving them a thoughtful consideration. When we do that we go through life three quarters blind.

Okay, the person who usually down-votes my post can do that now. The rest of you, I wish well.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

I don't care what Lloyd Boy 'exposes,' he is inept, and he hasn't learned from his experience. He will slowly decline, but I think he will 'hang on' hoping for a recovery -- some how, from somewhere, sometime.

Lloyd, go back to school. Get your degree. Become gainfully employed. Adopt some morals. Stop lying.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

Diog,

I understand that you resent the Watchtower. I understand why. I do not understand why you're rude to me.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

I have/had several granduncles. One of them is Uncle B. Yes. He's found a library, actually two libraries.

However, Uncle B isn't the one who abandoned the Witnesses. He is still one and has been since umm about 1952.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

F'Alone, see DerekMoors' post above.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

vienne

I have mixed feelings about agony books. I'm not a Witness, never was, but I have relatives who are. None of those I know have left, though a grand uncle I never knew did. [He was by all accounts a very disreputable man, and I understand why family more or less disowned him,] I understand that leaving is difficult because it cuts off valued associations, even family. But I don't know that agony books influence the still adherent.

Another issue for me is truthfulness. Some are obviously omitting key elements. I think that's true of the 'historic' books such as Schnell's. We all like to see ourselves as the hero [or anti-hero] of our own life. So we are automatically selective. One of the "I left" narratives I've read is by Charlotte Jennings. My granduncle knew the Jennings family, and though reluctant to tell me about them in great detail, added enough to alter the narrative. And I understand why she would leave out those personal details. So while I read them, they do not influence my personal theology, and many of them - Lloyd's is an example - are repellant.

Do I want them to go away? No. Writing is a way of 'cleansing' the soul, so to speak. If someone needs to do that, forge ahead! From an academic viewpoint, they must be read with caution, and note that they are 'preaching to the choir.' I reject the notion voiced by some academics, that the narratives of former adherents have little to no value. But I've read enough of them to conclude that often the value is very limited, and there are cases of 'false narrative,' where the writer claims to have been a Witness but in reality was not.

I'm rambling, aren't I? It's a family trait. Uncle B has a collection of Russell and Rutherford era opposition books and booklets. He quotes from them in Separate Identity, both published volumes. [You really should read these books. Lulu.com] No balanced history can ignore opposition narratives So, while I see them as "iffy", I would never suggest to anyone to not read them.

-Annie

11530