vienne

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Posts by vienne

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  39

  JE-sus making a comeback at the 2024 Convention

  by dropoffyourkeylee in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  attended the friday sesson of the 2024 summer convention.. july 5, 2024 summer convention crowd photo; they invited quite a lot of empty chairs.. .

  the facility usually has 5500-6500. they spun it saying that fewer congregations were assigned.

  there were 6 of the smaller, more distant sections blocked off with tarps to lessen cleaning, which i understand.

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  vienne

  Frag,

  It's past time to restart your meds.
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  4

  The Phenomenology of Sectarianism

  by aqwsed12345 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the analysis of sectarianism has topical relevance today, and increasingly so.

  however, the scarcity and insignificance of the responses to the challenge of sectarianism create the impression as if, for some unknown reason, the historical churches would avoid this challenge.

  they usually satisfy themselves with emphasizing the dangers of sectarianism and the sweeping condemnation of sects - which, although often true, does not delve into the depths of the phenomenon; and does not help those who it is intended for to understand; or they point to the heretical nature of individual sects, the distortions in their teachings, their lack of catholicity, and usually do not omit the self-critical observation that in terms of trust and faith, community, and devotion, we too can learn a lot from them.

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  vienne

  And ... as always, your essay is way too long for this forum. Few here will read it. IF you wish for a critique there are those here more than capable of giving you an informed one. Ask for it.
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  4

  The Phenomenology of Sectarianism

  by aqwsed12345 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the analysis of sectarianism has topical relevance today, and increasingly so.

  however, the scarcity and insignificance of the responses to the challenge of sectarianism create the impression as if, for some unknown reason, the historical churches would avoid this challenge.

  they usually satisfy themselves with emphasizing the dangers of sectarianism and the sweeping condemnation of sects - which, although often true, does not delve into the depths of the phenomenon; and does not help those who it is intended for to understand; or they point to the heretical nature of individual sects, the distortions in their teachings, their lack of catholicity, and usually do not omit the self-critical observation that in terms of trust and faith, community, and devotion, we too can learn a lot from them.

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  vienne

  aq,

  Ignoring the flawed content, your writing is not concise. It is verbose. That makes your readers pause either to translate or leading them to stop reading. Your first paragraph is an example.

  You wrote:

  The analysis of sectarianism has topical relevance today, and increasingly so. However, the scarcity and insignificance of the responses to the challenge of sectarianism create the impression as if, for some unknown reason, the historical churches would avoid this challenge. They usually satisfy themselves with emphasizing the dangers of sectarianism and the sweeping condemnation of sects - which, although often true, does not delve into the depths of the phenomenon; and does not help those who it is intended for to understand; or they point to the heretical nature of individual sects, the distortions in their teachings, their lack of catholicity, and usually do not omit the self-critical observation that in terms of trust and faith, community, and devotion, we too can learn a lot from them. However, this is far too little. The present study does not wish to deal with doctrinal issues or the specifics of individual sects, but restricts itself solely to a general phenomenological description of sectarianism, naturally revealing the appropriate causes and drawing conclusions.

  What you intend is:

  An analytical approach to “sectarianism” is increasingly relevant. Traditional churches avoid this, satisfied with emphasizing perceived dangers of newer, untraditional groups, avoiding in-depth consideration of the causes and content of alternative beliefs. Describing newer systems as heretical fails; that simply means “we don’t agree with them” and ignores what we can learn from them. [Insert quotation from Hilaire Belloc: The Great Heresies or from Schulz and de Vienne: Separate Identity to that effect. A BRIEF quotation.]

  This essay does not consider doctrinal issues but presents only a general study of “sectarianism,” its causes, and the author’s conclusions.

  Note: Sociologists might be pleased with the phrase “a general phenomenological description,” but it is nearly meaningless. It’s an “insider” phrase that is best translated into plain English.

  If you keep your first sentence (“The analysis of sectarianism has topical relevance today, and increasingly so.”) drop the comma. It’s misplaced.
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  25

  Do we have "original" indipendent documents proving that Rutherford was an alcoholic?

  by psyco in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i was wondering if you could prove with "original" independent documents that rutherford was an alcoholic.... .

  i read penton, but since he is a former jw he could not be considered an independent source.... .

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  vienne

  Thanks Pete
• 
  25

  Do we have "original" indipendent documents proving that Rutherford was an alcoholic?

  by psyco in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i was wondering if you could prove with "original" independent documents that rutherford was an alcoholic.... .

  i read penton, but since he is a former jw he could not be considered an independent source.... .

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  vienne

  the one who's making thing up is you.
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  25

  Do we have "original" indipendent documents proving that Rutherford was an alcoholic?

  by psyco in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i was wondering if you could prove with "original" independent documents that rutherford was an alcoholic.... .

  i read penton, but since he is a former jw he could not be considered an independent source.... .

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  vienne

  That's a root beer dispenser. Note the pump on top. If it was beer the container would be on its side and there would be a spigot. Spirits would be in bottles. Fake news.
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  25

  Do we have "original" indipendent documents proving that Rutherford was an alcoholic?

  by psyco in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i was wondering if you could prove with "original" independent documents that rutherford was an alcoholic.... .

  i read penton, but since he is a former jw he could not be considered an independent source.... .

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  vienne

  peacp, you wrote: Penton interviewed former Bethelites who reported having to assist Rutherford after overdrinking."

  Do you have a page number?
• 
  19

  So a JW can date an unbelieving person...

  by silentbuddha in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  but the entire congregation is not to be informed or mark the person.

  the only repercussions are that the individual who is aware of it can decide to "mark" them and not go to the local club or bar with the individual, but they are still obligated to go door to door in the ministry with them, and even speak to them at the kn as if nothing is wrong and not feel obligated to tell anyone else?

  this is crazy.. so they are also basically saying that a person can carry on a romantic (but none sexual) relationship with an unbeliever and still go out in service and participate in meetings?

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  vienne

  D of C, where in the publications does it say a person could be disfellowshipped for "continuing a relationship with an unbeliever." I can't find that, and I could use it in a conversation with a relative.
• 
  19

  So a JW can date an unbelieving person...

  by silentbuddha in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  but the entire congregation is not to be informed or mark the person.

  the only repercussions are that the individual who is aware of it can decide to "mark" them and not go to the local club or bar with the individual, but they are still obligated to go door to door in the ministry with them, and even speak to them at the kn as if nothing is wrong and not feel obligated to tell anyone else?

  this is crazy.. so they are also basically saying that a person can carry on a romantic (but none sexual) relationship with an unbeliever and still go out in service and participate in meetings?

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  vienne

  That's not a change. Except no marking talk.
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  26

  Jehovah's Witnesses - summary critique

  by aqwsed12345 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  since 1931, they have called themselves jehovah’s witnesses.

  founded in 1879 by charles taze russell (1852-1916).

  jw’s publisher is the watchtower bible and tract society, and their publications include "the watchtower" and "awake!

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  vienne

  The sources you cited do not prove your assertion.