There's obviously more here than the GB is saying. I find it hard to believe it's simply because those 80 and older may not be tech savvy. Samuel Herd is about 80 and several other GB members are right behind him. It's not likely many of the GB know much about new media either. It used to be, not long ago, that the organization said it focused more on spiritual things rather than material, or for that matter, technological. (Remember the rantings about the Internet, bulletin boards, chat rooms and more recently Facebook?) Because there is no scriptural basis for this move, there must be more going on here than meets the eye.
matt2414
JoinedPosts by matt2414
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80 Year old COBE Layoff Conspiracy
by XBEHERE inwho else thinks something is afoot with this?
is the gb deciding to go back to pre-1971 times with perhaps the cobe as the man in charge and the rest just ministerial servants.
so for this reason they want younger men in those postitions?
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80 Year old COBE Layoff Conspiracy
by XBEHERE inwho else thinks something is afoot with this?
is the gb deciding to go back to pre-1971 times with perhaps the cobe as the man in charge and the rest just ministerial servants.
so for this reason they want younger men in those postitions?
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matt2414
I'm more likely to believe that some of the older elders are pushing back against all the recent flurry of changes that have been made -- and are about to be made -- by the relatively new Governing Body. Many of the changes are done without strong (or any) scriptural support. Some of the older elders who grew up listening to Franz, Klein, Schroeder and Jaracz may not appreciate what's going on, i.e., fewer meetings during the week, fewer days of assemblies and conventions, frequent and unreasonable changes in the "Generation" doctrine, turning over all the congregation's money to the "earthly organization", sex abuse coverups, etc. ... Of course, it may just be that there are SO MANY changes lately, that these older ones can't keep up.
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Where does the Governing Body say "old light" comes from?
by matt2414 inthe governing body claims they've received "new light" from jehovah every time they change their doctrine.
so where did the "old light" come from that's being replaced?
if the old light is incorrect, could it have come from god?
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matt2414
I asked the question because it puts the GB in a precarious position. For example:1. What would happen to any one of Jehovah's Witnesses who teaches something as truth that is not backed by Scripture? That person would be disfellowshipped and branded an apostate. Yet, isn't that basically what the GB has done with all their false teachings? Luke 12:48 says, "From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked." Wouldn't this make Governing Body members bigger sinners than the average person because they claim to be God's mouthpiece? Wouldn't this mean that God has already disfellowshipped them?
2. Are the GB guilty of blasphemy by tacitly claiming that God lied to them and fed them false light? According to Rom. 3:4, wouldn't that make them the real liars, destined for the "lake of fire" in Revelation?
3. They claim that when you go "give a witness" you are guilty of bloodshed. But because they are bearing false witness, won't that make them even more culpable?
4. Aren't they also calling Jesus a liar by claiming they are God's earthly organization? Jesus was quite clear about there being NO EARTHLY ORGANIZATION, when he was speaking to the Samaritan woman at the well. At John 4, the woman claimed her forefathers worshipped on Mt. Gerazim and the Jews in Jerusalem. So did Jesus say that worship would move to Brooklyn, Patterson, Warwick, or some other earthly location? No. He said, " 21 “Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22 You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.” From these words, it is clear God would have NO EARTHLY organization. God isn't even looking for those who seek out an earthly organization.
5. Where is the humility of the GB members? The Bible describes Moses, David and others imploring God when they made mistakes. It's in the scriptures for all of us to see. Where is such humility of the GB? Like Satan, there is no humility before God.
So are these old uninspired men the faithful and slave, or are they a better fit of the selfish and sluggish "evil slave"?
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Where does the Governing Body say "old light" comes from?
by matt2414 inthe governing body claims they've received "new light" from jehovah every time they change their doctrine.
so where did the "old light" come from that's being replaced?
if the old light is incorrect, could it have come from god?
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matt2414
The Governing Body claims they've received "new light" from Jehovah every time they change their doctrine. So where did the "old light" come from that's being replaced? If the old light is incorrect, could it have come from God? If they do claim that new light comes from God but later it proves to be wrong, don't they owe God a public apology? If they don't apologize, aren't they basically claiming that God misdirected them? Romans 3:4 says, "let God be found true, though every man be found a liar."
Of course, this raised the question, Is the Governing Body really giving spiritual "food at the proper time," if it was a lie?
What a can of worms!
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The Savannah Disputation
by creativespirit insaw a new play at the penguin rep theatre, located in stony point, ny - rockland county, this afternoon, called "the savannah disputation".
it was, i am sure, patterned on jw's knocking on doors and their views on the catholic church.
a lot of the dialogue was exactly what i used to preach, although, at one point they pointedly say, oh no, this is not jw's, jw's is the watchtower.. many of the plays that start here eventually make it to broadway.. this plays thru 6/8.
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matt2414
That sounds like an interesting play. But it looks like it played in an off-Broadway theater in 2009.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/04/theater/reviews/04sava.html?_r=0
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Vacation Destination: Looking for Input
by confusedandalone inso when the kids get out of school we plan on going away for 3 to 4 weeks for vacation but we want to go somewhere that is actually enjoyable and not just packed full of things for the kids to do.
cruises are out, to confining.
i live in the u.s. so i want to abroad an continue to get the kids passports stamped so they can be exposed to as many cultures as possible.. .
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matt2414
I was also going to suggest Argentina. Buenos Aires has lots to see and do including seeing gauchos at the Fería De Mataderos, experiencing a Tango, visiting Palermo, checking out the National Museum of Fine Arts, as well as traveling to Iguazu Falls (spectacular), and then heading across Rio de la Plata on a boat to see Montevideo, Uruguay, as well as its beautiful resort city of Punta del Este or even Piriapolis. Of course, Argentina is heading into winter now, so the weather won't be the best.
A second choice would be Los Cabos, Mexico, which includes the resort cities of Cabo San Lucas and San Jose del Cabo on the southern tip of Baja California. Actually, these are trips that I would like to make myself, so I'm living vicariously through your travels.
Problemaddict: It sounds like you are quite familiar with Argentina. When were you down there?
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Any gay exJW's?
by Trapped in JW land inwas just wondering how many gay exjw's were on this site, and how did you deal with being in this organization?
and also, how did you end up leaving?.
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matt2414
Since leaving the JWs behind, I've undergone a wonderful transformation. I used to be proud to be a Witness and ashamed to be gay. Now I'm a proud gay man, and an even prouder ex-JW. I now have real freedom and enjoy real "truth." No more living lies. I feel more of a "brotherhood" with all of you here than I even did as a Witness. Life is good. Thanks for the post HOAB. I always enjoy Timmy's, Fernando's and Quendi's comments. You guys are awesome!
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Any gay exJW's?
by Trapped in JW land inwas just wondering how many gay exjw's were on this site, and how did you deal with being in this organization?
and also, how did you end up leaving?.
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matt2414
Thanks HOAB, I appreciate your kind comments. But sometimes I wish I lived closer to other gay ex-Jdubs. It would be interesting to have a gay ex-JW support group. lol
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Any gay exJW's?
by Trapped in JW land inwas just wondering how many gay exjw's were on this site, and how did you deal with being in this organization?
and also, how did you end up leaving?.
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matt2414
I've been out of the Org since 2005 and haven't stepped foot in a Kingdom Hall since, with the exception of a relative's memorial service about 6 months ago. I used to pioneer, special pioneer, be a ministerial servant, an elder, attended an early MTS class, worked at Brooklyn Bethel and Watchtower Farms, and served as a missionary in South America. But all of that pales to the joy I now have of living my life as God created me, with my partner of 8 years.
Heartofaboy: Thanks for the great post! Yes, there is a double stigma of being gay and an ex-JW, but I try to look at the positive. I may have lost JW "friends" when I left, but now I've found better friends on this ex-JW site, many of whom are gay and lesbian. We can all be ourselves and not worry about being judged. This is something I NEVER had as a JW. If anyone here wants to chat further, I'm always willing to listen and share.
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Special Talk Outline 2014 - Does anyone have it?
by gbrn ini was wondering if the upcoming special talk outline has been available by way of a leak?
if not and somebody has access to it, can we somehow get it uploaded for us.
i may be in a position where i attend with family, and would like to know what i'm in for.. thanks!.
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matt2414
Jehovah has permitted evil to exist for the past 6,000 years in order to settle the issues raised by Satan once and for all time (Ge 3:1-6)
This is the most stupid reasoning anyone could possibly have conjured. Why does it take 6,000-plus years for this issue to be settled, and yet imperfect humans only have six months or so with a free home "Bible study" with one of Jehovah's Witnesses to be convinced on this matter? If you design and create a faulty structure, aren't you responsible for any imperfections that may bring harm to others? Even if someone else throws broken glass or nails on your property, aren't you responsible for cleaning it up before someone gets hurt? If you're a parent, and your teenage children throw a drug/sex party in your home, and you are aware of it, who's really responsible? As an all-knowing and all-powerful Father and parent, how can God throw the blame on someone else? How can he just stand by and watch his "children" bully, beat, rape and kill, and get bullied, beaten, raped and killed right before his eyes? Don't the scriptures apply to him also, namely, "If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn't do it, it is sin for them" (James 4:17)?
Doesn't the Watchtower's argument, in effect, make God a sinner? Isn't the all-knowing Governing Body really making a mockery of God with such a weak and untenable argument?
Just sayin'.