Posts by cappytan

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

HMTM: Am I to understand then that an atheist can believe in evolution but suspend belief in abiogenesis until it is proven? And until it is proven does that mean his belief in abiogenesis is up in the air and could go either way? Truly? In practice though, is not abiogenesis a firm belief among atheists and one which atheistic scientists are hard at work trying to find evidence for.

I can't speak for all atheists, but for me, personally, the answer is yes, I can "suspend belief." Actually, though, I don't believe in the current hypothesis on abiogenesis. I believe it could be plausible. But it hasn't been proven to me, so it's a question mark. And you know what? I'm okay with saying, "I don't know."

Question: When you come across something unknown, which of the following is more rational to say?

A: "I don't know."

B: "It must be magic."

17

Do NOT go to college, system is coming to an end, EVEN in 1969!!!!!

by Jez in

if you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that.

you will never grow old in this present system of things... .all evidence in fulfillment of bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years... as a young person you will never fulfill any career that this system offers.

if you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career.

cappytan

For those curious about the article:

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

But, in respect to the original question, I have a theory. I MEAN, a hypothesis.

I just saw a Ted Talk last night that wasn't really on this subject.

The talk is about qualities of leadership, but something the guy said kind of relates.

He was making the point that with really successful leaders, whether that leader may be Apple or Rev. Martin Luther King, people weren't buying what they sold.

The guy kept saying throughout the talk, "People don't buy what you sell, they buy what you believe."

He talked about how this related to the way the brain functions.

And I think, ultimately, that's the problem with religious people. They buy into religion because it appeals to the part of their brain that is emotional, irrational.

For instance, I love my MacBook Pro. I would buy a brand new MacBook Pro tomorrow if I needed another one. Why? Because I believe it to be the best. But, on paper, the hardware isn't top of the line, the software isn't necessarily faster, etc. But, I buy into the belief that it is a quality product, and nothing you show me or say will change my mind because I LOVE MY MACBOOK PRO. Yes, it's irrational, but that's how I feel! I don't care that it's irrational! And, I haven't experienced enough discomfort to try the alternative.

Back to religion. How did I snap out of the religious, theist mindset? I was experiencing discomfort. EXTREME discomfort. So, I started listening to the rational part of my brain.

I dunno, does this make any sense?

PS. For those curious, here is the Ted talk I'm referring to:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4ZoJKF_VuA

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

Still no answer as to why scientists make the claim that life originated from non-living matter without backing it up.

I did answer your question. Your premise is incorrect. You are implying that Scientists claim that it is a settled fact that life originated from non-living. Science doesn't claim that. It is a hypothesis. And Science admits that it is hypothesis and admits that it could be incorrect.

There has been research and evidence that indicates that the hypothesis is plausible, however there is not enough available evidence as of yet to call it a proven theory or fact.

That's where Science and Religion are different. If Science can't prove a claim, the claim is not considered factual.

Religion claims that a God exists, yet, instead of acknowledging that there is no evidence to support the claim, religion holds that God is an undeniable fact without presenting any verifiable evidence.

Don't you see the difference here?

How do you prove something that you have no evidence for? You go and try to find if the evidence is out there.

That's what Scientists do. They make claims, then instead of just accepting the claim as true, they go and find evidence to support the claim. Once they find the evidence, the claim becomes Theory.

What Theists do is as follows: They make claims, then tell everyone else that their claim is fact without any supporting evidence and say that if you do not believe their claim without evidence, something bad will happen to you.

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

Science claims many things it can't prove....

Wrong. Science never claims anything as fact that can't be proven.

For instance, consider the idea of multiple universes. That is not a theory. It's hypothesis. Can't be proven at this time. Not all scientists agree with the idea either. But that doesn't mean that scientists aren't working on it, trying to find evidence to support it.

What Science does is first, identify a problem or question. Next, make a hypothesis, a guess. After that, try to prove the hypothesis through experimentation or observation. Then, analyze the data from the observations or experiments. After that, if the data supported the original hypothesis, you now have a theory.

In the english language, the word theory is bandied around a lot and often used in place of the word hypothesis. However, in Science, nothing can be called a theory until it is PROVEN.

So, in your initial comparison, remember that any time a Scientist claims something as fact he must have evidence to back it up.

Atheists are holding religious claims to the same standard as they hold scientific claims. PROVE IT.

Once a Scientific claim is proven, then it is no longer a claim, it is a theory with documented evidence to back it up.

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

HM-TM: I've often wondered why it is that those who believe in evolution claim that life started from non-living material but refuse to back that up. It's a mystery to me. They claim something they have no proof of. Unheard of!

You're talking about abiogenesis not evolution.

FYI, the current models for abiogenesis are not proven theories (yet). They are hypotheses. Science doesn't claim that the current ideas of abiogenesis are fact. There have been some experiments that show promise that the concept is plausible, but there is not at this time conclusive proof that the hypotheses are theory.

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

CAPPY! I was trying to get clambake to come to that conclusion or at least allow him/her to prevaricate enough that it was obvious he didn't know.

Sorry! I didn't mean to be rational! Where was my ~~brainwashing~~ "training from infancy" when Viviane needed it?!

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

cappytan

Asking religious people to prove the existence of god is like asking an atheist to disprove there being any intelligence in our design.

There's a huge difference between those two things.

Atheists/agnostics do not claim that there is no intelligence in our "design." They just point out the fallacy of coming to a conclusion that something exists when there is no evidence to support that conclusion. You can't prove a negative. Either you have evidence of something or you don't.

Faith is not evidence. Warm and fuzzy stories are not evidence. An old book is not evidence.

39

I've just been disfellowshipped!

by maksutov in

apparently it was announced last night.

i was not informed (for 'legal reasons'), but they phoned my dad and told him.

i understand it is due to my apostate book.

cappytan

Congratulations!

8

Japanese Branch Tour - Parody Video

by cappytan in

stay with it to the chorus.

there's an easter egg.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxq5or2z1cg.

cappytan

Haha! Easter egg is nerd speak for something extra hidden. You spotted it. The masturbation bit was it.