HarryMac

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Posts by HarryMac

• 
  42

  The Bible - Which books get to stay or go decided my men - cut & paste old school

  by HarryMac in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  western traditioneastern orthodox traditionoriental orthodox traditionassyrian eastern traditionbooksprotestant.

  [o 1]roman catholicgreek orthodoxslavonic orthodoxgeorgian orthodoxarmenian apostolic.

  (part of 4 esdras)no.

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  2. 
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  HarryMac

  trujw:

  Your comment has sailed right over my head.
• 
  26

  What are the qualifications to be a baptizer at the assemblies?

  by Iamallcool in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

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  HarryMac

  An able bodied man who can glimpse the sun Seinfield style.
• 
  42

  The Bible - Which books get to stay or go decided my men - cut & paste old school

  by HarryMac in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  western traditioneastern orthodox traditionoriental orthodox traditionassyrian eastern traditionbooksprotestant.

  [o 1]roman catholicgreek orthodoxslavonic orthodoxgeorgian orthodoxarmenian apostolic.

  (part of 4 esdras)no.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  HarryMac

  I almost feel bad posting this for people not ready for that level of 'truth'. It's a kick in the nuts.
• 
  42

  The Bible - Which books get to stay or go decided my men - cut & paste old school

  by HarryMac in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  western traditioneastern orthodox traditionoriental orthodox traditionassyrian eastern traditionbooksprotestant.

  [o 1]roman catholicgreek orthodoxslavonic orthodoxgeorgian orthodoxarmenian apostolic.

  (part of 4 esdras)no.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  HarryMac

  ^oops

  'decided by men'
• 
  44

  Drinking at meetings / assemblies / conventions ... who's done it?

  by HarryMac in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  for me .... 1).

  last district convention after having 'read up' (took some family to it).. 2).

  last 'meeting' to watch step-father-in-law finally get his and get disfellowshipped for molestation.. ...both were taking vodka shots in the bathroom.. i'm sure there's lots of good stories out there..

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  2. 
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• 

  HarryMac

  Wow.

  That was before my time. Never even heard of this mentioned.

  Respectfully, just how old are these days?
• 
  42

  The Bible - Which books get to stay or go decided my men - cut & paste old school

  by HarryMac in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  western traditioneastern orthodox traditionoriental orthodox traditionassyrian eastern traditionbooksprotestant.

  [o 1]roman catholicgreek orthodoxslavonic orthodoxgeorgian orthodoxarmenian apostolic.

  (part of 4 esdras)no.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  HarryMac

  	Western tradition		Eastern Orthodox tradition			Oriental Orthodox tradition				Assyrian Eastern tradition
  Books	Protestant [ O 1 ]	Roman Catholic	Greek Orthodox	Slavonic Orthodox	Georgian Orthodox	Armenian Apostolic [ O 2 ]	Syriac Orthodox	Coptic Orthodox	Orthodox Tewahedo [ O 3 ]	Assyrian Church of the East
  Pentateuch
  Genesis	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Exodus	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Leviticus	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Numbers	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Deuteronomy	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  History
  Joshua	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Judges	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Ruth	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  1 and 2 Samuel	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  1 and 2 Kings	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  1 and 2 Chronicles	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Prayer of Manasseh	No (Apocrypha) [ O 4 ]	No – inc. in some mss.	Yes (?) (part of Odes) [ O 5 ]	Yes (?) (part of Odes) [ O 5 ]	Yes (?) (part of Odes) [ O 5 ]	Yes (?)	Yes (?)	Yes (?)	Yes (part of 2 Chronicles)	Yes (?)
  Ezra (1 Ezra)	Yes	Yes 1 Esdras	Yes Esdras B'	Yes 1 Esdras	Yes 1 Ezra	Yes 1 Ezra	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Nehemiah (2 Ezra)	Yes	Yes 2 Esdras	Yes Esdras Γ'	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  1 Esdras (3 Ezra)	No 1 Esdras (Apocrypha)	No 3 Esdras (inc. in some mss.)	Yes Esdras A'	Yes 2 Esdras	Yes 2 Ezra	Yes 2 Ezra [ O 6 ]	No (?) – inc. in some mss.	No – inc. in some mss.	Yes Ezra Kali	No – inc. in some mss.
  2 Esdras 3–14 (4 Ezra) [ O 7 ]	No 2 Esdras (Apocrypha)	No 4 Esdras (inc. in some mss.)	No (Greek ms. lost) [ O 8 ]	No 3 Esdras (appendix)	Yes (?) 3 Ezra	Yes 3 Ezra [ O 6 ]	No (?) – inc. in some mss.	No – inc. in some mss.	Yes Ezra Sutu'el	No – inc. in some mss.
  2 Esdras 1–2; 15–16 (5 and 6 Ezra) [ O 7 ]	No (part of 2 Esdras apocryphon)	No (part of 4 Esdras)	No (Greek ms.) [ O 9 ]	No	No	No	No	No	No	No
  Esther [ O 10 ]	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Additions to Esther	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Tobit	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Judith	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  1 Maccabees	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	No	Yes
  2 Maccabees	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	No	Yes
  3 Maccabees	No (Apocrypha) [ O 11 ]	No	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes [ O 6 ]	Yes	No – inc. in some mss.	No	Yes
  4 Maccabees	No	No	No (appendix)	No (appendix)	Yes	No	No (?) – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No (?) – inc. in some mss.
  Jubilees	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes	No
  Enoch	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes	No
  1 Meqabyan	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes	No
  2 and 3 Meqabyan [ O 12 ]	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes	No
  Ethiopic Pseudo-Josephus (Zëna Ayhud)	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (broader canon) [ O 13 ]	No
  Josephus's Jewish War VI	No	No	No	No	No	No	No – inc. in some mss. [ O 14 ]	No	No	No – inc. in some mss. [ O 14 ]
  Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs	No	No	No	No	No	No – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No	No
  Joseph and Asenath	No	No	No	No	No	No – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No (early tradition) [ O 15 ]	No
  Wisdom
  Book of Job	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Psalms 1–150 [ O 16 ]	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Psalm 151	No	No – inc. in some mss.	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Psalms 152–155	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (?)	No	No	No (?) – inc. in some mss.
  Psalms of Solomon [ O 17 ]	No	No	No – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No	No – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No – inc. in some mss.
  Proverbs	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes (in 2 books)	Yes
  Ecclesiastes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Song of Songs	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Book of Wisdom	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Sirach (1–51) [ O 18 ]	No (Apocrypha)	Yes [ O 19 ]	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Prayer of Solomon (Sirach 52) [ O 20 ]	No	No – inc. in some mss.	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No
  Major prophets
  Isaiah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Ascension of Isaiah	No	No	No	No	No	No – liturgical (?) [ O 21 ]	No	No	No (Ethiopic mss.) [ O 22 ]	No
  Jeremiah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Lamentations (1-5)	Yes	Yes [ O 23 ]	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes (part of Säqoqawä Eremyas) [ O 24 ]	Yes
  Ethiopic Lamentations (7:1-11,63)	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (part of Säqoqawä Eremyas) [ O 24 ]	No
  Baruch	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes [ O 25 ]	Yes
  Letter of Jeremiah	No (Apocrypha)	Yes (chapter 6 of Baruch)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes (part of Säqoqawä Eremyas) [ O 26 ] [ O 24 ]	Yes
  Syriac Apocalypse of Baruch (2 Baruch 1–77) [ O 27 ]	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (?)	No	No	No (?) – inc. in some mss.
  Letter of Baruch (2 Baruch 78–87) [ O 27 ]	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (?)	No	No	Yes (?)
  Greek Apocalypse of Baruch (3 Baruch) [ O 28 ]	No	No	No (Greek ms.)	No (Slavonic ms.)	No	No	No	No	No	No
  4 Baruch	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	No	Yes (part of Säqoqawä Eremyas)	No
  Ezekiel	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Daniel	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Additions to Daniel [ O 29 ]	No (Apocrypha)	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Minor prophets
  Hosea	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Joel	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Amos	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Obadiah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Jonah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Micah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Nahum	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Habakkuk	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Zephaniah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Haggai	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Zechariah	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes
  Malachi	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes	Yes

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Alexandrian_Fathers

  This was one of the biggies for me... all this fighting about scripture. What gets to stay in the accepted biblical canon was decided by a group of self-important men.
• 
  6

  I think I'm,,,,,,,,,,,

  by Kool Jo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello folks.... so after a year of fading (some ups & downs), reading, researching and even praying....i'm starting to think i'm agnostic.... there are a couple things i'm having a hard time understanding:.

  1. what's the real purpose of life and creation?

  so we're created to live a perfect life, two clowns over 6000 years ago made a mistake and everyone is paying for it, although no fault of our own?.

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  HarryMac

  Yup, it's a process.

  1. The elders in this town are no good
  2. Jehovah's Witnesses don't have the truth based on the bible itself
  3. The bible itself isn't true
  4. There is no god
  5. There may be a god bigger than all religions idea of it?
  6. There's likely no personal god(?)
  7. Why can't we just admit we don't know for sure?
  8. [repeat 4-7 in any order]

  As you can see, I'm not done.
• 
  46

  SECRET LETTER of Watchtower Media Changes!

  by TheSnarkyApologist in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  here's a letter that has circulated among many ex-watchtowerites!.

  just thought you'd want to know!.

  awake!

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  HarryMac

  My wife brought home the March 2013 Awake. She found it in a doctor's office reception area.

  Sixteen pages and a total rag. At least when I was handing these out like the well trained monkey I was they looked like something that just might be taken a bit seriously. How embarrassing for them.
• 
  40

  Neanderthals, Early Modern Humans, and a Creator

  by Comatose in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/neanderthal.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/cro-magnon.

  http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102011413#h=8:0-9:682. were neanderthals like us?.

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  HarryMac

  If I remember correctly they've found graves with the dead adorned with jewellry (necklaces, etc). That's sad.
• 
  87

  Bible Writers not just ignorant "goat herders"

  by applehippie in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  really, the bible was written by nothin' but goat herders?

  i don't post much but this does irk me.

  yes a few may have been shepherds or fisherman, but a fair amount were far more educated and were professionals in their fields of occupation.

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  HarryMac

  yada yada yada

  -----

  Holy shit! This has made me realize you're right!