Posts by Olympiad

17

WT-CD 2001 Missing the Babylon the Great Book

by blondie in

.

i was putting away the books that are on the cd and lo and behold the btg book is no longer on the disk.

blondie

Olympiad

One more time:

I believe the real reason for removing the book is because it provides a wealth of information regarding the Neo-Babylonian period. You can in fact use this one publication to discredit the Societies erroneous date of Jerusalem's destruction by Neguchadnezzar in 607 BCE. This publication with the help of a couple of others in fact shows that the total reigns of the Neo-Babylonian kings was in fact 87 years which would support the true date of the destruction which took place in 587 BCE. When this book was published a great deal of scholarly work was done no doubt, but boy has it haunted them in the last few years with recent discoveries and the internet. In reality if the year 607 BCE (Pivotal Year) can be discredited by their own publications then 1914 has no basis nor des anything else that they might say. Remove the foundation and all will eventually fall. They are very clever. Most JWs do not have a clue as to the great lengths the Society has gone through to suppress this information, however they are aware that the average JW will not spend the time to research these thigs because they can barely keep up with what is required reading and study.

17

WT-CD 2001 Missing the Babylon the Great Book

by blondie in

.

i was putting away the books that are on the cd and lo and behold the btg book is no longer on the disk.

blondie

Olympiad

I believe the real reason for removing the book is because it provides a wealth of information regarding the Neo-Babylonian period. You can in fact use this one publication to discredit the Societies erroneous date of

17

WT-CD 2001 Missing the Babylon the Great Book

by blondie in

.

i was putting away the books that are on the cd and lo and behold the btg book is no longer on the disk.

blondie

Olympiad

I believe the real reason for removing the book is because it provides a wealth of information regarding the Neo-Babylonian period. You can in fact use this one publication to discredit the Societies erroneous date of

81

Who's Your JW.com Crush - Post pics here!

by Prisca in

jw
friends

we had a thread started way back that has gone on for 11 or more pages, so i thought i'd start up a new one.

who's your jw.com crush?

are you game to tell us?.

Olympiad

Hi guys. It has been a couple of months since I have been on here and I must say that Prisca caught my eye on another post when I first logged on. So while following the money (Prisca's Profile) I ended up here and I must say that she gets my vote.

23

JW: Lower requirements

by larc in

jw
friends

the lower requirements of the wt has been brought up from time to time.

i thought i would summarize the ones i know of.

1. conventions used to be one week and go from early morning til late at night.

Olympiad

Have you noticed how seldom JWs currently recite the mantra of 607 BCE + 2,520 years + no zero year = 1914? I understand the latest release of a manual to replace the Ogainzed book at the current series of assemblies deletes previous references to their chronology; clearly the latter has become an albatross for them.

Room 215 - What is the name of the publication to which you refer?

4

Do not be misled!

by Olympiad in

do not be misled!

the following is the most misapplied scripture by the watchtower society and it causes more damage and mind control than any other.

mathew 24:45-47 who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time?

Olympiad

Do not be misled!

The following is the most misapplied scripture by the Watchtower Society and it causes more damage and mind control than any other.

Mathew 24:45-47 Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time? Happy is that slave if his master on arriving finds him doing so. Truly I say to you, He will appoint him over all his belongings.

The very nature of the way that this verse is written in the Bible does not allow it to be applied to a group. A simple English lesson per any dictionary teaches us the following.

Am	1st person singular	I - Am	Present indicative of Be.	I - Am
Are	2 nd person singular.	You - Are	Present tense indicative plural of Be.	We/They - Are
Is	3 rd person *singular*	He/She - Is	Present tense of Be.	He/She - Is

As you can see (Is) can only be applied to a singular individual and not a group in this instance. If Christ really meant for us to interpret this scripture in our day, I am sure he would have used verbiage (Who really are) which would allow us to apply it to a Class and not an individual. It is not even to be applied to a Class of individuals. The Society has read way more into this scripture than what actually exists. Once again they miss the simple truth that Christ tries to impart to all of mankind which is to do things the same way that he did them and all will fall into place. Make the responsible decision based on Love.

What was the real intent of the scripture? Simply put, it was a lesson in responsibility. Yes responsibility to take care of business in the same manner as the master (Jesus). Jesus gives us three examples in Mathew the 24 th and 25 th chapters with contrasts between those that are responsible and those that are not responsible. In addition he outlines the reward or punishment based on the decision made in each case. Those that are responsible as described in the illustrations are said to be faithful, discreet and good. Those that were not responsible were said to be evil, foolish and sluggish. Hence their rewards were commensurate with their actions. We are given three illustrations which span Mathew 24: 45-51 (The Faithful and Discreet Slave), 25: 1-12 (Ten Virgins) and 25: 14-30 (The Talents) all of which basically teach us the same thing with regard to making responsible decisions. Jesus then gets to the point of what they all mean in Mathew 25: 31-33 where he states: When the son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. And all the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one from another, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. And he will put the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. While the three illustrations teach us the lesson of making responsible decisions, it is in verses 35 through 40 of Mathew chapter 25 that Jesus identifies for us what the real everyday responsibility of a disciple of Christ is. It is so simple and beautiful: For I became hungry and you gave me something to eat; I got thirsty and you gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and you received me hospitably; naked, and you clothed me. I fell sick and you looked after me. I was in prison and you came to me. Who made the responsible decision to do good just as the master (Christ) would? It is the sheep; yes the faithful, discreet and the good and their reward is life everlasting in the kingdom. Who made the irresponsible decision to do evil just as the master (Devil) would? It is the goats; yes the evil, foolish and sluggish and their reward is everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. In conclusion the ultimate reference with regard to those that would be responsible or not responsible was reserved NOT for a class of men but as Mathew 25:32 states: All the nations were brought before him. It is you and I the individual that will be judged according to our deeds. Make responsible decisions based on Love. I pray Jehovahs rich blessing.

Edited by - Olympiad on 1 July 2002 15:16:6

7

????? - "Established Kingdom"...

by Olympiad in

established kingdom

this verbiage has always been of interest to me, established kingdom, however we should remind our watchtower friends that it can not be found in the bible, any bible that i am aware of.

it is the basis however for the new message preached by jehovahs favored few.

Olympiad

Thanks, LDH

bjc,

This is without question. Their reference was to an earthy restoration of their nations former line of kings. They specifically looked for one that would allow them to be an independent and sovereign nation again; one who would sit on the throne of David. They did not have this under the Roman occupation. They heard, but failed to appreciate even up to Jesus ascension into heaven that he would not be a fleshly earthly king over . It was not until Pentecost however that the heavens were opened up to them through Holy Spirit that they all began to perceive the greater plan. They began to appreciate the value of Christs sacrifice as well as the fact that not just was to benefit from it. It eventually became clear to them that at some point in time a righteous administration would govern over earthy affairs which would also eventually result in a united human family. We in fact receive this great opportunity and blessing through the Jewish nation and nothing can or will change that, thus fulfilling the promise from Jehovah to Abraham. Daniel 2:44 gives us some insight, after listing parts of the image which correspond to EARTHLY kingdoms we are told in verse 44 that the God of heaven would set up another kingdom. This kingdom would eventually put an end to all other kingdoms and reign over Earths affairs. We are led to believe that this happened in 1914 and again I reiterate that this is in error. If you look close at Daniel 2:36-43 you will note that in reality there are only four earthlykingdoms explained prior to the setting up of the kingdom which would have authority over earths inhabitants. The Watchtower cleverly separates the feet and toes and applies them to our day and 1914. In fact the fourth kingdom was that of under whom our Lord was born, baptized, executed and resurrected. At his birth he was paid homage to by the Magi and offered gifts befitting a king. Peace on Earth and goodwill towards men was proclaimed. After his baptism Jehovah personally said this is my son the beloved whom I have approved. At his execution and death the price was paid and entrance into the Kingdom of the Heavens was granted to man. After his resurrection and prior to ascending into heaven he was granted all authority in heaven and on earth as he had conquered the final enemy death which ruled as king over the sons of men and held them captive as slaves because of sin. From that point forward, many were called to serve as part of the spiritual administration of Heavenly Jerusalem or the Bride of Christ. All things have an appointed time, likewise the completion of this administration. I feel confident that we have and will continue to see the power of that administration specifically in the changes in behavior of men towards each other. While things are not perfect man is making spiritual progress as a human family. While Jesus was alive and raising the dead, somewhere possibly in the same city someone was being beaten, robbed, defrauded and so on, hence proving that things were not perfect in his day. He did begin something that would forever change the world, yes something that would eventually do away with mans imperfect kingdoms over one another. True Christians will live to see a righteous earth with men being born into a world of love and limitless possibilities. It might happen while we are here in the flesh but if not we shall see it from heaven. Who knows we may at that time be granted opportunity to return and experience life over again here on earth under righteous conditions by choice. We live in exciting times. I pray you be blessed.

PS- What is the reason for 2012? Does it refer to the Galactic Cross?

7

????? - "Established Kingdom"...

by Olympiad in

established kingdom

this verbiage has always been of interest to me, established kingdom, however we should remind our watchtower friends that it can not be found in the bible, any bible that i am aware of.

it is the basis however for the new message preached by jehovahs favored few.

Olympiad

Lars,

Thanks for you comments. Interestingly your first comment puts you at odds with the Society. Please note however, that the post was not about the Good News specifically but about the use of the term and its relationship to what is being preached at this time by Jehovahs Witnesses. You yourself say that what Jehovahs Witnesses preach is basically about the millennial reign of Christ and the paradise earth that will be established. However I refer you back to the Societies thoughts with regard to the Good News, May 2002, Watchtower pg. 22 par. 12. They have since 1919 embarked on a campaign to preach that the Kingdom has been established in Heaven since 1914. They preach this over and above the simple original message which was and is: The Kingdom of the Heavens has drawn near and what we must do as individuals to enter into that Kingdom. If you would please type 1914 into the search field of your 1999 Watchtower CD if you have one and you will get an astounding 6000 + references. What would be the point and where is the logic in saying Christ was enthroned in 1914 only for him to wait until some unknown time, but according to the Society, the not to distant future to see that same Kingdom which you speak about, being re-established as the start of Christs Millennial reign? Come on now Lars is the Kingdom established or not? Lars you ask who else is preaching the message about eternal life and the end of death and sickness. I tell you first of all it is not their (JWs) message it is Jehovahs message provided for all of mankind through his word the Bible. If any man/woman picks up a copy of the Bible and reads for themselves about the things which you speak and actually do them; have they received the message of the Good News? Most certainly they have and the individual will be Happy according to Christ. As Peter, I also declare: For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him. You continue to give the Society credit for Bible promises which you refer to as JWs doctrine. If I read for myself Isaiah 11:1-9; has not Good News been related to me? Was it by JWs? In addition dates, times and seasons are not the message. Friend, do not go searching to get knowledge of something that was not granted to the Apostles. Dont get bogged down in 2300 evenings, 1150 years, 1260 years, 70 weeks, 1996, 1886 and 110 years because they will not bring you salvation or provide you a righteous standing. It is this eagerness of which you speak, to apply Bible chronology which gets so many into troubles and actually proves their works wicked. Jesus closest associates wanted to know: Lord are you restoring the Kingdom to at this time? What was his reply to them Lars? He said: It does not belong to you to get knowledge of the times or seasons which the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction. How much clearer can it be? If we pursue this with vigilance are we not trying to take away from Jehovah what is his alone? This is a test of Obedience, no different from what Adam and Eve were given. They did not need that which belonged to Jehovah alone to enjoy his blessing, likewise we dont need what belongs to Jehovah alone with regard to times or seasons to enjoy his blessings today. From the above I believe you should appreciate that I do consider the Bibles teachings Good News. My main point was and still is the Watchtower has muddied the water and their primary focus with regard to the Good News of the Kingdom is that it was established in 1914 and you are for us or against us and so on and so forth you know the story and NOT the simplicity of Christs message which includes the things of which you speak. May you have Jehovahs blessing.

PS. bjc, I am working on your question.

7

????? - "Established Kingdom"...

by Olympiad in

established kingdom

this verbiage has always been of interest to me, established kingdom, however we should remind our watchtower friends that it can not be found in the bible, any bible that i am aware of.

it is the basis however for the new message preached by jehovahs favored few.

Olympiad

????? Established Kingdom - ?????

This verbiage has always been of interest to me, Established Kingdom, however we should remind our Watchtower friends that it can not be found in the Bible, any Bible that I am aware of. It is the basis however for the new message preached by Jehovahs favored few. In the May 2002, Watchtower pg. 22 par. 12 the Society cleverly adds the word establishedwith reference to Mathew 24:14. Mathew in reality reads that the Good News of the Kingdom would be preached not the Good News of the would be preached. Is there a difference? Most certainly; the Good News which Christ referred to is outlined for us in Mathew chapters five through seven. The Good News of the EstablishedKingdom which is preached by Jehovahs Witnesses is entirely different, so much so that not one of the books that are currently used or have been used to bring people into the organization focus on the simplicity of Christs message as outlined in the Sermon on the Mount. When you studied with Jehovahs Witnesses or you yourself conducted a study did they or you ever once reiterate to your study the Happinesss recorded at Mathew 5:3-11, probably not? Christ preached a message that was applicable to any time. Theirs is a new message based on and around October of 1914. The new message does not focus on simplicity, it is shrouded in mystery. It does not concentrate on the more important things such as Love, Forgiveness, Mercy, Justice or having a Pure Heart and being Peaceable. The new message embodies mans futility to attain what does not belong to him. Jesus clearly told his closest associates the Apostles, yes those who were chosen to specifically bear witness to his deeds, death and resurrection that it did not belong to them to know when the end would come. Why? Jesus knew if we knew or even had a good idea then our motives for service would be impacted by knowing. We would become overly anxious or overly lax about things which normally would not concern us. What exactly do Christs Brothers mean when they state that the kingdom was establishedin 1914? Basically that Jesus did not receive authority to rule as King over the from Jehovah until the Gentile times were completed. This is counted from October of 607 BCE through to October of 1914 a total of seven times or 2520 years. Is this accurate? No it is not, for Christ told his eleven disciples after his resurrection at Mathew 28:18 All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. It was at that point also that he gave them a command to make other disciples of people from all the nations. No human was ever given authority to give such a command which ultimately would lead to forgiveness of sins and entry by men into the Kingdom of the Heavens. Prior to, we were stuck here on Earth under Satans control, hence the statement at John 3:13 No man has ascended into heaven but he who descended from heaven, the Son of man. The only thing that was new here was the adding of authority on Earth for Christ already exercised authority in Heaven by request of his father Jehovah. Mathew 26:53 tells us that Jesus by simple request could petition Jehovah for more than twelve legions of angles. Up to the point in time that Jesus stated All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth itis clear that Satan had control as the God of this world, ultimately blocking our entrance into the Kingdom of the Heavens through death. After Christ conquered the final enemy death through resurrection he could now retain all control. Christ indeed stated prior to his death and resurrection and prior to having authority here on the Earth at John 18:36 My kingdom is not part of this world if my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But, as it is my kingdom is not from this source, thus helping us to appreciate that he indeed already exercised authority in what he called my kingdom. Per the new message preached by Jehovahs Witnesses salvation is based on preaching and accepting an empty message, five weekly meetings, watchtower and awake magazines, organization, faithful and discreet slave, 1914, district conventions, circuit assemblies, year books, videos, brochures, field service reports and so on. Do you see the error here; they are all about the Organization and not about the true Good News which respectively allows each of us as individual human beings to here the message and determine for ourselves if we will live by it or not. It is not the right or responsibility of any Organization to determine for you what is right or wrong. In conclusion the established kingdom which the Watchtower references does not exist! Mathew and the other books refer appropriately to the Kingdom of the Heavens which has always been in existence and has always been established and has always had Jehovah and Jesus Christ as his first born through whom all other things came into existence exercising authority over it. What Christ did specifically for the children of men here on earth was not set in motion in 1914 it was at his baptism, death, resurrection and ascension to heaven. That was the appointed time.

10

Can anyone substantiate?

by Olympiad in

jw
friends

can anyone substantiate?

i heard from a very reliable source the following regarding the dateline episode that aired on nbc: j.r. brown was the guest speaker at the convention that i attended two weekends ago in albany, ga. and he stated to a close friend of mine who always has parts on the convention that dateline clipped and changed things around so much that a negative light was cast on jehovahs witnesses and that it was not reflective of what the society was led to believe would be presented.

he also said that at some point the society requested a live interview with dateline but they refused.

Olympiad

Can anyone substantiate?

I heard from a very reliable source the following regarding the Dateline episode that aired on NBC: J.R. Brown was the guest speaker at the convention that I attended two weekends ago in Albany, GA. and he stated to a close friend of mine who always has parts on the convention that Dateline clipped and changed things around so much that a negative light was cast on Jehovahs Witnesses and that it was not reflective of what the Society was led to believe would be presented. He also said that at some point the Society requested a live interview with Dateline but they refused. In discussing these issues with my wife she in fairness and correctness has stated that there are always two sides to every story. The only thing that I have right now is the letter from the Society to Mr. Greenberg which is dated and states that they appreciate his efforts to be fair and balanced.

Can anyone substantiate any of this? I would like to get a jump on the defense that my wife and Elders will put forth tonight when we meet.

Thanks!