Posts by Phizzy

21

cart witnesses

by stan livedeath in

i drove through a nearby seaside town today.

it was starting to rain.

it was cold.

They did used to make converts by knocking on doors and actually speaking to people, even if we personally did not achieve this, we felt we were part of a work that did actually get results. How any of them can even feel an inkling of that doing the cart work beats me, they must know it is a monumental waste of time.

The Cart I see most often is manned by people I know are over eighty, it seems the youngsters are too busy doing....what ? not Witnessing in any way I bet.

The Org must be content to be an On Line Church, but with their media skills, converts will be rare, donations more so.

How long before the average Congo. member gets pissed off with it all ? The Org is doomed to dwindle and die.

18

The Evolution Of The Watchtower Cult

by pale.emperor in

since waking up from the cult i've been curious about where the cult is going and how will it end up?

will it fizzle out or become a little fringe "religion" like plymouth bretheren or the shakers?.

we've already seen the cult evolve from:.

Phizzy

It already is a fringe religion. Just a minor Cult.

I can see their membership shrinking more over the next few years, the "increase" they are getting comes from the few places in the World where the Internet is not available to people, or as has been said, from their offspring.

The young ones in their late teens and early twenties in the West at least, are already not really committed, they view it as a huge Social Club. Sadly they often end up married within the Org, and perpetuate the cycle. But the real die hard 100% believer J.W is as rare as Rocking Horse poo today, meaning that donations are not likely to be anywhere near as high as decades ago.

The Business Model the org has is pretty lucrative, buy a plot somewhat out of town, when it goes up in value because the area has prospered, sell it. Rinse and Repeat. This is getting harder though as they do need to seat their members in a K.H somewhere, and excess travelling cuts attendance.

They are probably happy for it to shrink to about a 5 mill. membership, but who knows what effect the Abuse scandal etc may have on membership ? and as the Internet spreads retention will be much harder.

Maybe another big scandal will damage them even more in the future, a financial one for example.

I see them as hanging on for a few more decades, but becoming as irrelevant and almost unknown as the Plymouth Brethren etc.

30

Do You Think Jehovah’s Witnesses Are A Threat To Any Government?

by minimus in

jw
friends

russia believes they are a threat.

the usa has put witnesses in jail in the past.

other countries look at jws as a nuisance.. do you think the witnesses are a threat to governments?

Phizzy

If you look at the Russian Law that outlines what constitutes an extremist group, then JW's fit the bill perfectly. I can see why the Russian Authorities, not having our inside knowledge about the J.W's, have decided to treat them as they would any other Extremist Group.

Perhaps the J.W's should drop their extremist views and actions,and then be more acceptable, not just in Russia, but anywhere in the World.

But of course, we know the J.W's love to be different, and love to be persecuted, it proves to them that they have the "truth", but does not prove to them the reality, that they really are Extremist.

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

Oh come on everybody, just tell Scholar that he and the JW/WT are right, Jerusalem fell in 607BCE and Jesus sat on his Throne in 1914. Just agree with his nonsense, and maybe he will go elsewhere, instead of clogging up this place, where once upon a time we had sensible debates.

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

The Dead Sea Scrolls and other sources make it plain that Nabonidus could well be the king who Daniel was thinking of, he had a long spell away from the throne, in Tayma, possibly as long as ten years, though Daniels use of seven would suit his style.

Nabondus' son WAS called Belshazzar. Nubuchadnezzar's son was Evil Merodach. Nebuchadnezzar did not ascend the throne until 605BCE.

Many facts and much evidence pertains against the JW Org view of History.

4

AGM Notes

by Anna Marina in

notes on reddit about the agm.

agm notes.

Phizzy

From the Reddit report :

" Joel 2 now refers to the “Babylonians”, the coalition of nations that will try to destroy God’s people. The context of Joel chapter 2 points the time period of fulfillment to Jehovah’s Day in the Great Tribulation and how God will save his people."

I guess this will be expanded upon to explain why the "nations" are all taking action against the Org because of their inexcusable and terrible record on Abuse, and their total lack of care for the vulnerable, and care or love toward the victims. It will be spun as a plot to destroy the Org, and as a sign of the closeness of the " Great Tribulation".

It will be a Great Tribulation for the Org's Bank Account, and rightly so.

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

I did warn earlier in this Thread, do not feed the Troll !!

"Scholar" is not interested in what the Bible writers really said. His/Her ? only interest is to establish some kind of sense for the mess that is the JW interpretation of the Bible. Facts and Evidence, as usual, and even less the research of real Scholars, mean nothing to "Scholar".

Again, do not waste your time on trying to convince someone who has no interest in Truth.

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

Good points Shepherdless, just a note for JW's, there is no such thing as " Bible Chronology", in the sense of historically testable and verifiable stuff.

There is only accepted history and Chronology to work from, JW Org recognizes this of course, and works from the destruction of Babylon, 539 B.C.E, for a lot of its very doubtful calculations. Like a lot of Bible believers who like to take it as almost literal, and accurate, they then struggle to make the Bible's claims fit actual History.

And the Bible certainly does NOT say Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 B.C.E ( see above Posts).

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

Oh Jeez, "Scholar" is back, peddling the same old nonsense that has been debunked on here so often, don't engage with the Troll.

277

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

by Doug Mason in

i came across this article written in 2004 by an evangelical.. “when did jerusalem fall?”, rodger young, journal of the evangelical society [jets], 47/1 (march 2004), 21-38.. http://www.rcyoung.org/articles/jerusalem.pdf .

these are the conclusions of the 18-page analysis.

(1) jerusalem fell in the fourth month (tammuz) of 587 bc.

Phizzy

Thanks Doug,

That is a question that has long occurred to me, as I have seen both dates mentioned, usually together as in " 587 or 586 BCE " or sometimes as 587/586 BCE. I wondered where the doubt as to pinpointing the exact date came from, so thank you for your research and for Posting it here.

Of course this is of no huge importance to most people, even serious Scholars of the Bible perhaps, but if one gets in to a discussion with a believing J.W, to have a hint of doubt, even a month or two, is something they will latch on to to try to discredit the proof. Of course in doing so they would still be ignoring the circa 20 year error in their own organizations spurious and ridiculous claim about the date of Jerusalem's destruction.

If my memory serves, a Poster on here some years ago, Ann O'Mally (I think that name is a pun !) showed that the Babylonian Clay tablets we have about their Astronomical calculations prove the year was 587 BCE too.

Thank you again.