Posts by Phizzy

40

How Did You Discover This Site?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i’ve been here a long time.

i saw this site jwd/jwn.

i thought it was very lively and interesting.

Phizzy

My Epiphany , my real "Wake Up" moment was deciding to read the Book of Daniel without JW Specs on, to glean just what it really said. I soon realised that the 1914 doctrine was simply not in there, was in fact the ravings of a very strange mind or two. The whole JW Theology, and claims for the G.B as chosen by Jesus were simply lies.

I first of all found Greg Stafford's Site, he was still a JW then, and was amazed to find he did not believe the JW nonsense about 1914 either ! One person who had come to the same conclusion as me ! I thought there MUST be many more such people ! Good old Mr. Google led me here, that was about 13 of 14 years ago, so, nearly as long as you Min !

I found a wealth of information here from many an erudite Poster, Allen F, Leolaia, a guy called Nicos ? who had worked on the French translation of the NWT, and many more. Not one believed in 1914 anymore, or any JW Bullshit. Great ! So, my Wake Up, then Google. Thank you to all the myriad Posters who helped me on my Spiritual Journey to Freedom of Mind ! And thanks for the thorough Education !

That includes you Min, for your constantly fresh views on things, and for provoking the same from others by starting Threads that made them think in a different way, keep it up Buddy !

15

J.W's and " but that is Pagan !".

by Phizzy in

there have been a number of threads touching on this before, leolaia for one, back in the day when we had many an erudite poster, showed the pagan origins of many things, including the passover , and by extension, the jw " memorial".. what prompted my thought on this was a conversation i had the other day with a young lady, never a jw, who said the jw stance on birthday celebrations, was groundless and cruel.. i thought later that jw's do a " pick and mix " as usual, as they do with so many other things, on what they condemn as "pagan" and what they accept and practice.. the institution of marriage itself is pagan, marriages were performed long before the bible was written, and long before the nation of israel was formed.

yet jw's perform marriages, use the veil, and the ring, all pagan.

the names of the days of the week, the months of the year, all pagan.. i guess you guys can think of many more things ?

Phizzy

There have been a number of Threads touching on this before, Leolaia for one, back in the day when we had many an erudite Poster, showed the pagan origins of many things, including the Passover , and by extension, the JW " Memorial".

What prompted my thought on this was a conversation I had the other day with a young lady, never a JW, who said the JW stance on birthday celebrations, was groundless and cruel.

I thought later that JW's do a " Pick and Mix " as usual, as they do with so many other things, on what they condemn as "pagan" and what they accept and practice.

The institution of Marriage itself is pagan, marriages were performed long before the Bible was written, and long before the Nation of Israel was formed. Yet JW's perform marriages, use the veil, and the ring, all Pagan. The names of the days of the Week, the months of the year, all Pagan.

I guess you guys can think of many more things ? JW Hypocrisy at full bore again.

45

Rolf Furuli Disfellowshipped Last Week

by Sea Breeze in

well known norway elder and watchtower doctrine apologist, (rolf furuli) was disfellowshipped a few days ago for the crime of expressing opinions contrary to some watchtower dictates.. like wt leadership in the past, they have no problem eating their own..

Phizzy

"Another one freed from the clutches of the WatchTower.". If you read the Thread he is far from "freed", he still believes in over 90% of JW teaching.

As the saying goes, in his case, sadly," You can take the boy out of the Religion, but not the Religion out of the boy".

24

Hiram built Solomon's temple.

by peacefulpete in

other threads recently touched upon the temple description in the ot.

i've made comments to the effect that the temple designs mirrors that of other cults of the region.

additionally i wondered if the temple ever existed in the 8th-9th century at all, given the lack of archaeological evidence for it and the mythical characters and obvious embellishments in the story of it's construction.

Phizzy

Solomon's Temple as described in the Bible is thought to be mainly Myth, so maybe Hiram is too, great Pun by the way Slim !

Apparently the structure must have been smaller than the Bible describes, as was indeed the "Empire" of David and Solomon, not nearly as big as the Bible says !

It is interesting that the design of the Temple describes the design of a number of known "pagan " Temples of the time, so if Hiram was real, maybe he designed and built along those lines, again, the design not really coming from "god" as the Bible implies.

16

Some notes on early Christianity - its evolution and "sacred text"

by Half banana in

in the scope of this site, it’s not possible to go too deeply into historical research in a single post but we can give the flavour of things formerly hidden from us when we were jws.. like most things, christianity evolved.. it has unseen roots but many visible branches, 40,000 is the often quoted number!

there never was a moment when it arrived fully formed in the middle of the first century.

its roots in folk mysteries were deliberately concealed by fourth and fifth century christian leaders.

Phizzy

Thank you Half banana for your Post, most informative ! I have "The Shepherd of Hermas " in my Library, and read it many years ago, but never noticed the absence of Jesus and Christ in the Text ! of course, back in those days I was an active J.W, and we were mind controlled to "read things in to" whatever texts we were reading.

I fully endorse your comment on the very early period of Christianity : "There never was a moment when it arrived fully formed in the middle of the first century". And I would add , it was far from "fully formed" at the end of that Century, when the Apostles and nearly all eye-witnesses of Jesus were surely dead ! And as you say, controversy raged on, and continues ! Of course we see various theological ideas emerging in the New Testament Books, these being written against a background of the existence of a number of groups claiming to be followers of Jesus, all with varying theologies.

Our very own Poster, Doug Mason touches on this in a number of his Papers, and maybe more so in his latest Paper, still a work in progress.

Gnosticism of course is fairly well known, and probably affected the writer of the Gospel of John. The Nestorians I think were very early, and other nebulous groups who fizzled out, and we have scant knowledge of, unless they were condemned as Heretics by the Church that came to call itself Orthodox, itself several removes from proto Christian Theology.

All of this is a very different picture from the one drawn by the J.W Org ! The evolution of Christianity is quite as messy as the Evolution of Life on earth !

24

Hiram built Solomon's temple.

by peacefulpete in

other threads recently touched upon the temple description in the ot.

i've made comments to the effect that the temple designs mirrors that of other cults of the region.

additionally i wondered if the temple ever existed in the 8th-9th century at all, given the lack of archaeological evidence for it and the mythical characters and obvious embellishments in the story of it's construction.

Phizzy

I agree peacfulpete,I think it is impossible to unravel, to separate Legend and Myth from History, and to extract who may have ben a real figure in History.

Certainly the Hebrew Bible is a mish-mash of stories and myths that the Scribes of the 6th century B.C and later made in to a " History" for their own purposes. The main purpose being to have a "History" for Israel that gave them National Pride.

They followed in a tradition, started by those who wrote the Epic of Gilgamesh, ( which they plagiarise of course) and other similar works. But I have been surprised that the Myths and Legends of old more often than not have a foundation in real history, from that early stuff, through the Greek Myths and likely up to the persons of King Arthur, and later Robin hood, all those stories were more than likely based upon people who actually lived, embellished for entertainment value obviously, but some basis in fact.

40

Remember this

by James Jack in

this was my elder bag.

Phizzy

" That is one thing that is properly consigned to history.". The Bag is, the attitude is still around I bet. I remember years ago when one of our Elders was on the RBC, and a few of the guys on there had just started using Laptops, they were needed for their "Worldly" jobs, so they brought them along and knew how to use them.

Our guy rushed out, bought himself a top of the range Laptop and took it along to the next RBC Meeting, I am 95% sure he didn't know how to use it back then !

Big Bag Syndrome.

2

The UK House of Commons Defines Parental Alienation as a Form of Child Abuse

by jp1692 in

interestingly, just this week—on monday 29 june, 2020—the british house of commons amended their pending domestic abuse bill to include parental alienation as a form of child abuse, even calling it “psychological manipulation.”.

the bill is very much in the process and will no doubt go through more revisions before it reaches its final form.

you can read more about that process in relation to this bill here: .

Phizzy

This , if it comes in to Law, will make it legally wrong for J.W's to treat badly there minor children who are disfellowshipped.

Sadly, we already know of cases where minor children in this position have been allowed to live at home, and were "alienated" within the home, and then told to leave once they became adult.

J.W's find ways to ignore the law, and to ignore the "spirit" of such laws, thinking their way is above the Law of the Land.

But I hope this may help some poor kids who become DF'd, if their parents are the more reasonable, and more loving type of J.W.

40

Remember this

by James Jack in

this was my elder bag.

Phizzy

I was never an Elder, out of choice, but never had a big bag, sometimes I just had a rolled up WT mag. in my jacket, because I had scribbled notes in it on research I had done.

Wanna be Elders had those big bags, so obvious and pathetic !

21

Have You Lost Any “Friends” Because Of Your Political Views?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i have lost a couple of fb friends.

i have had conversations with many of my friends regarding politics and since we generally view politics in the same way, there is little dissension.

however i do have some friends that don’t see things properly, my way, and i still like them.🤗lol....i know of some families that have stopped talking to each other because of something as stupid as political differences..

Phizzy

I don't think I have, maybe the odd person on F.B or similar, but they are not real friends. I generally try to argue in such a way that I still show respect for the person, though I may quite strongly show where their opinion is wrong, and give them the facts.

I never insult the person, I think that helps.

If people have gone because of my Political, or in fact any other ,views, then good riddance ! they have done so, in a cowardly way, skulking off, not giving any good reason for their opinions, which shows they have no good argument.

A bit like when J.W's run off rather than defend their views and their faith, cowards, who know deep down they have no valid argument to offer.