Posts by Perry

25

First year with baby!

by Darkknight757 in

i wanted to share a few recent pics of izabella with everyone.

this week marks her one year since her coming home from nicu.

she has been growing and changing so much these last few months in particular.

God and the afterlife. Do you need to believe in both

by moley in

i consider myself an atheist, i completely reject the idea of a totalitarian desert god/any god and the bible is a book of fairytales and folk legends.. i do however sort of believe that this life is not all there is.

i’m not talking about heaven or hell but in a tangible state of being.. there are a few experiences i’ve had in my llife.

could be imagined could be real.

Perry

I reached my post limit one day last week and the post to FHN was denied. Then 3 days later it shows up after I reposted!

LV101,

Thanks. It's weird, we ran the skunk out but he never sprayed anyone. After he ran about 15 yards, he decided that he didn't like it outside and ran back all the way back into the wall....where we had to do it all over again. I guess he was pretty upset about being kicked out of his home.

Bees weren't too happy about it either. The hive was in the walls in between two different stud sections. We made some smoke using cow dung in a shovel and smoked them until they calmed down. Then, we ate the honey. Took about thee days for the hive to finally dissipate completely.

After I finish the project, I'll post a few pics on this forumn. The inside was a wreck. Had a 2 sf hole in the roof for about 5 years. Had to be gutted. Mold was everywhere. I bought the land and basically got the cabin for free. The foundation was good and about 90% of the studs were solid. Septic system still works.

37

God and the afterlife. Do you need to believe in both

by moley in

i consider myself an atheist, i completely reject the idea of a totalitarian desert god/any god and the bible is a book of fairytales and folk legends.. i do however sort of believe that this life is not all there is.

i’m not talking about heaven or hell but in a tangible state of being.. there are a few experiences i’ve had in my llife.

could be imagined could be real.

Perry

FHN,

My post didn't post before I left town. So sorry to hear about your sister passing. I know that must be tough. Please let me know if I can't help in some way. Yes, many people are leaving the Watchtower.

My long-time assistant / office manager passed away last year. Only 50....cancer. So,I moved office back to house to try and take this year a little easier. I'm a general contractor - been rehabbing a cabin in woods this year. Almost done.

Before

Still need to clean up and paint

A skunk was living in one wall and a bee hive was living in another. Took it down to the studs and started over.

37

God and the afterlife. Do you need to believe in both

by moley in

i consider myself an atheist, i completely reject the idea of a totalitarian desert god/any god and the bible is a book of fairytales and folk legends.. i do however sort of believe that this life is not all there is.

i’m not talking about heaven or hell but in a tangible state of being.. there are a few experiences i’ve had in my llife.

could be imagined could be real.

Perry

Oh, I'm so sorry to hear that about your sister. I know that hurts deep. Please let me know if there is anything I can do to help.

I have tried to not work so much this year. Closed my office down after my long-time assistant died from cancer. Have been working from home for nearly 12 months now. It's about time to start cranking back up. I'm a General Contractor in the restoration industry.

I spent most of the year re-habbiing a cabin in the woods. (my man-cave) Still needs paint on the outside...but I'm getting close to finishing. Inside is all done.

So far...

37

God and the afterlife. Do you need to believe in both

by moley in

i consider myself an atheist, i completely reject the idea of a totalitarian desert god/any god and the bible is a book of fairytales and folk legends.. i do however sort of believe that this life is not all there is.

i’m not talking about heaven or hell but in a tangible state of being.. there are a few experiences i’ve had in my llife.

could be imagined could be real.

Perry

Time fundamental and not emergent?

Well there are some physicists that are challenging the the assumption that space-time is fundamental. They propose it is fluid and is not fundamental. We will see where is goes. Some say it may one day unify physics.

All of these views, including my own, require assumptions. Just can't get much thinking done otherwise. It is just as easy to assume God as the ultimate fundamental principle as some assume time to be. Stephen Hawkin sees evidence for space, time and matter to have all come into existence at once, even though he admits he doesn't know what was "before" that. I have an answer for that... "In the beginning GOD."

Genesis 1, you cited as proof is wrong, There was matter before the Earth, and our planet was not created at the beginning, but 10 billion years later.

Unless of course space-time is fluid, emergent and can be manipulated. It is interesting that in the bible space is characterized as a fabric that can be stretched or manipilated:

Isaiah 42:5 “Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out;

Psalm 104:2 “Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain.”

Isaiah 48:13 “Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens:

Isaiah 51:13 “And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens,

Zechariah 12:1 “The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.”

The heavens are still expanding, or being stretched out to this very day.

37

God and the afterlife. Do you need to believe in both

by moley in

i consider myself an atheist, i completely reject the idea of a totalitarian desert god/any god and the bible is a book of fairytales and folk legends.. i do however sort of believe that this life is not all there is.

i’m not talking about heaven or hell but in a tangible state of being.. there are a few experiences i’ve had in my llife.

could be imagined could be real.

Perry

Time fundamental and not emergent?

Well there are some physicists that are challenging the assumption that space-time is fundamental. They propose it is fluid and is not fundamental. We will see where is goes. Some say it may one day unify physics.

All of these views, including my own, require assumptions. Just can't get much thinking done otherwise. It is just as easy to assume God as the ultimate fundamental principle as some assume time to be. Stephen Hawkin sees evidence for space, time and matter to have all come into existence at once, even though he admits he doesn't know what was "before" that. I have an answer for that... "In the beginning GOD."

Genesis 1, you cited as proof is wrong, There was matter before the Earth, and our planet was not created at the beginning, but 10 billion years later.

Unless of course space-time is fluid, emergent and can be manipulated. It is interesting that in the bible space is characterized as a fabric that can be stretched or manipilated:

Isaiah 42:5 “Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out;

Psalm 104:2 “Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain.” (or fabric)

Isaiah 48:13 “Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens:

Isaiah 51:13 “And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens,

Zechariah 12:1 “The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.”

The heavens are still expanding, or being stretched out to this very day.

20

Humans only survive for 3-5 days without water...

by purrpurr in

and yet today's watchtower and indeed the bible condemns the israelites for moaning about having no water!

it's never occurred to me how unjust this is!

and how could a so called loving god not provide a basic human need?!.

Perry

purrpurr,

Here's an interesting take related in the Jerusalem Post:

"Rashi notes that the process of increasing punishments was necessary to demonstrate God’s power – not only to the Egyptians, but to the Jews. He notes that during the first five plagues, Pharaoh himself was responsible for his hardening heart.

In addition, Pharaoh’s heart was “strengthened.” (Exodus 7:13) and then became “heavy.” (Exodus 7:14) Why does the Torah use three different words to describe what amounts to a single description of his stubborn obstinacy? We will answer this shortly.

Rambam, Rabbi Moshe ben Maimon, (Mishne Torah, Hilchot Teshuva) insists that everyone has free will; one can choose to do good, or evil. The ability to choose freely defines us as human beings; our choices define us as individuals. Freedom to choose is an essential and inherent right, but it is not absolute; there are consequences to actions.

This explains why three different words are used to describe Pharaoh’s heart. He changes his mind, perhaps from lack of awareness and fear of losing a valuable commodity. It’s understandable, given his position. That is what is meant by “hardening,” and “heavy.” He refuses to change, even though he recognizes God’s existence. But then he becomes recalcitrant and arrogant – which is described as “his heart was strengthened.”

The key to understanding this psychological debilitation – and what Torah teaches – is Pharaoh’s lack of self-criticism. The ability to choose, to exercise free will without honest self-evaluation and introspection, is self-destructive and destructive to others. In Pharaoh’s case, he led his army and his nation to disaster."

My thoughts: Perhaps after 5 times that Pharaoh changed his mind, God finally gave him the complete separation from common sense he sought so Pharoah could completely indulge his self-centeredness? If so, this allowed for greater displays of protection for the Israelites that should have formed a larger basis of trust for them.

The God of the ot is not morally acceptable by any standard

Well, I think that billions of people would disagree with that statement. It is the basis of our judicial courts and all of judeo-christian western culture.... the greatest and freest culture ever seen on earth.

20

Humans only survive for 3-5 days without water...

by purrpurr in

and yet today's watchtower and indeed the bible condemns the israelites for moaning about having no water!

it's never occurred to me how unjust this is!

and how could a so called loving god not provide a basic human need?!.

Perry

days of future,

That is very true. God could have frozen the Egyptians, allowed the Israelites to walk away, and then unfrozen the Egyptians afterward.

However, my impression of the history of God dealing with people is that he places a premium on two things -

1. Free Will

2. Trust

It seems like he does things in a way that attempts to respect free will and foster trust in him when possible. The 10 plagues seem to accomplish those two things. The plagues got progressively more intense and Pharaoh should have let them go after any one of them. But, he defied God in the face of overwhelming evidence of his power...even to the point that he and his army were required to drown in the Red Sea to stop their abuse.

The Israelites, on the other side of the coin, were just about as obstinate as Pharaoh. They should have been able to fully trust the Lord after all this. They didn't. It took a long time in the wilderness to get them to even trust God a little bit.

Both accounts aptly picture the depravity of man and his (near total?) inability to relate to God and to trust him. This is why he eventually became a man in the person of Jesus Christ so that we could relate to him better.

The Ipuwer Papyrus is an ancient Egyptian document that corroborates some of the plagues leading up to the Exodus.

kris malone,

You recite a number of common objections and raise good questions. All of these have been gone over in detail many times on this forum over the past 19 years I've been here.

The best sources I've found for getting an accurate ancient picture are:

1. christianthinktank.com

2. gotquestion.org

20

Humans only survive for 3-5 days without water...

by purrpurr in

and yet today's watchtower and indeed the bible condemns the israelites for moaning about having no water!

it's never occurred to me how unjust this is!

and how could a so called loving god not provide a basic human need?!.

Perry

Hi Anders,

The Israelites were in a national contractual relationship with the Almighty, and still are. They were allowed to violate the covenant over and over again. They usually ended up in slavery to some foreign worthless god and in slavery to some foreign power.

True, many people like their slavery.... being content with basic needs like food, water, shelter and "medical" marijuana to help mitigate their poverty.

The Israelites found themselves in slavery to the Egyptians through no fault of their own after Joseph died. There was no way they could have negotiated a release from such a strong world power. They were destined to disappear or be completely absorbed into that culture unless God himself intervened. They needed help in an impossible situation.... much like us.

It took a lot of work on God's part to secure their release. Even then, it was not enough....blood had to be spilled to experience freedom. Freedom isn't free.

I believe the evidence is overwhelming concerning the accuracy of the accounts about Israel.....and are still proving themselves true.

For instance:

In Zechariah 8:7-8, the prophet said God would bring the Jews back from the east and the west to their homeland (Israel) and that they would be able to live in the city of Jerusalem again. This prophecy has been fulfilled more than once. About 2600 years ago, Babylon destroyed Jerusalem and took many Jews as captives to Babylon.

But many Jews later returned from Babylon. The Jews rebuilt Jerusalem but the city was destroyed about 1900 years ago by the Romans. The Romans killed more than 1 million Jews and forced many more into exile. The Jews did not have control of Jerusalem again until 1967 when the Jews recaptured the city during the Six Day War.

Here is Zechariah 8:7-8

This is what the Lord Almighty says: "I will save my people from the countries of the east and the west. I will bring them back to live in Jerusalem; they will be my people, and I will be faithful and righteous to them as their God."

Never in the history of the word has a people been driven from their homeland later to be restored in tact complete with their language except for Israel.

Israel's deserts will become like the Garden of Eden

Bible passage: Isaiah 51:3

Written: perhaps between 701-681 BC

Fulfilled: Being fulfilled now

In Isaiah 51:3, the prophet said that God will restore Israel and make it a paradise, like the garden of Eden. This foreshadows what is currently happening in Israel. The Jews have been irrigating, cultivating and reconditioning the land during much of the 1900s. Many of the country's swamps, which had been infested with malaria, have been converted into farmland. And water from the Sea of Galilee has been channeled through portions of the deserts, allowing some of the deserts to bloom. Much work remains, but parts of Israel are blooming again.

Although it was described as a wasteland as recently as the late 1800s, Israel is now a food source for many countries. And at least 200 million of trees have been planted there during the past century.

The fruit exports of Israel are impressive....19% increase just last year.

There are dozens of fulfilled prophecies about Israel re-appearing in the last days. All powerful testimony to the faithfulness to the national contract mediated my Moses long ago. Completely unique in the annals of human history.

By contrast, Jesus mediated a far superior contract toward those that would put faith in him. It is a personal contract as opposed to a national one. It is described as an adoption with all the rights, privileges and irrovocability that goes along with that. In Roman times, once a slave was adopted, they could NEVER have the adoption cancelled but were permanant heirs to the wealth of the Father.

All of human history can be traced back to the Flood.

Here's a fascinating look at world history. There is no such thing as pre-history or "prehistoric" in my opinion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcFwM4c_avM

20

Humans only survive for 3-5 days without water...

by purrpurr in

and yet today's watchtower and indeed the bible condemns the israelites for moaning about having no water!

it's never occurred to me how unjust this is!

and how could a so called loving god not provide a basic human need?!.

Perry

Hi purrpurr,

You post triggered a lot of thoughts for me.

It does seem like something unusual was going on concerning the water. Why didn't God supply a steady water source so that they (the Israelites) wouldn't fret? After all, their clothes had some sort of ongoing blessing where they didn't wear out. Why a different treatment with the need for water?

First of all, I think it is important to remember that the Israelites were in the wilderness because of their own choosing. They were in the situation that they were in because they were focusing on their seeming impossible obstacles, instead of God. They had the opportunity to enter the promised land, but ten of the 12 spies came back afraid, and without faith. They chose to not enter the promised Land. This is after the 10 plagues of Egypt, the parting of the Red Sea & the miraculous defeat of Pharoah. And especially important, it was after a covenanat relationship was mediated by Moses between the nation of Israel & God.

The problem was that the Israelites were still thinking like a defeated, enslaved people. The people had been taken out of slavery, but the slavery had not yet been taken out of the people.

The 40 years in the Wilderness was a training ground. Little by little they gained faith in God to the point when they came to the foot of the promised land a second time; They decided that they would take the land offered.

The "problems" that were preventing them 40 years earlier, were not problems after all. The walls of Jericho?; they came tumbling down. The giants? - they are not even mentioned in the description of the takeover.

Why the harsh treatment of Moses not being allowed to enter the Promised Land? Perhaps it is because when he took credit for giving the people water, it went against the very lesson that was having to be learned the hard way, over and over... every day for 40 years. If the people elevated Moses to the position of a life-giver, it would only prolong and already drawn-out ordeal concerning faith in God.

It was for everyone's benefit that Moses be left behind. So that, now when they faced the enemy (without Moses) they could be sure that it was the faithfulness of God toward his people and not some sort of favor to Moses himself that ensured their success.

What is particularly troubling about the Watchtower pointing to such examples of faith in the bible is the fact that the Watchtower has fooled people into rejecting the very covenant that God offers people as a basis for their personal success. Then, while the people are in a position OUTSIDE of a covenant relationship with God, they try to get people to waste their time (1.) waiting of Jehovah, (2) having faith in God's potential to act, (3.) serving a publishing corporation as a way of making peace with God.

It is the height of all ignorance to put faith in God while at the same time actively and knowingly rejecting his agreement that he offers for membership into his family household. It is incredibly insulting.

Warning from Hebrews:

But Christ, when He came as a High Priest of the good things to come...by His own blood, He entered the Most Holy Place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption....

But you have come to...the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,...24 and to Jesus, the Mediator of a new covenant; ...

25 See that you do not refuse Him who is speaking. For if they did not escape when they refused Him who spoke on earth, much less shall we escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from heaven....

How much more severe a punishment do you suppose he deserves, who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded the blood of the covenant that sanctified him to be a common thing, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?

The Watchtower treats the New Covenant as a "has been", unimportant to the lives of Jehovah's Witnesses.... done away with in 1914 etc. It is absolutely ridiculous to expect any grace of God under these conditions. Yet, many JW's spend their entire lives in slavery to an organization, choosing the wilderness instead of the promised land of freedom and sonship with God.

John 1: 12 -

Yet to all who received Him, He gave the power to become sons of God

Ephesians 2 -

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not of yourselves. It is the gift of God, 9 not of works, so that no one should boast.