@joeyjojo -
Then obvious those you call "fundamental Christians" do not understand the Bible.
FreeTheMasons
JoinedPosts by FreeTheMasons
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
The Bible is well written.
Only those who don't understand love cannot understand the Bible.
"God is love."
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how do you feel about the use of the name Jehovah now?
by enoughisenough infor those who still believe in god and the bible, how do you feel/think about the name jehovah now?
i am one who never wanted to bring reproach on god's name.
i will admit using the word jehovah now makes me feel rather icky...like i am promoting a lie of sorts.
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FreeTheMasons
God's name existed before human languages existed.
"If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels but do not have love, I have become a clanging gong or a clashing cymbal. And if I have the gift of prophecy and understand all the sacred secrets and all knowledge, and if I have all the faith so as to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing." (1 Corinthians 13:1,2)
The Bible speaks of "the tongues of angels," meaning heavenly communication.
No human can pronounce God's name here on earth the same way it is pronounced in heaven, but God is reasonable. He doesn't expect humans to pronounce things the way angels would.
God doesn't expect Greeks to pronounce His name the same way Hebrews would, just like God doesn't expect English speakers to pronounce His name the same way Greeks would.
Jehovah is the One who divided up the languages in the first place after the Babel incident. He knows what His name is, and He knows when someone is calling on Him. He's not partial.
The meaning of His name is what is more important: "He Causes To Become."
But as regards the name Jehovah in English, some people complain about "some monk named Martini made up the name in the 1270s so it's not valid..." and yet those same people fail to acknowledge that English in its present form was not even a thing until between the early 14th to the 17th centuries.
https://www.quora.com/Who-is-credited-with-first-using-the-name-Jehovah-as-a-proper-name-for-God/answer/EasyAddendum?ch=10&oid=1477743814152363&share=9e7d5b97&srid=hy1dvD&target_type=answer
Mythbusters Regarding God's Name Jehovah
The word Jehovah, used mostly in association with JWs has become besmeared, leaving a bad taste in my mouth so to speak, what with their CSA and stealing KHs and shady business practices. I have also seen videos about esoteric cults using the name in reference to the devil rather than almighty God.
That was the goal of the Devil, to blaspheme Jehovah's name so that people wouldn't use it.
Genesis 4:26 records that people have been calling on Jehovah's name in a blasphemous way for a long time: "At that time people began calling on the name of Jehovah." When those esoteric groups mix Jehovah's name in with their false worship it is for the purpose of poisoning their relationships with Jehovah. The individuals mixed up in those esoteric practices are abusing themselves or abusing others or subjecting themselves to abuse while at the same time using God's name, so they eventually grow to associate Jehovah's name with bad things even though He is not the source of any of the bad things they are doing.
It's the same idea with the Watchtower. The Watchtower teaches lies about Jehovah. The disfellowshipping doctrine is a lie. The 1914 things is a lie. There are a lot of things that Watchtower teaches that are lies all the while they claim to represent Jehovah.
Here's the thing: they don't represent Jehovah. They are liars. Liars gonna lie. Their lies don't negate that God's name in English is Jehovah.
You can call him Yahweh if you want; you can call Him Jehovah if you want. He knows you're talking about Him. What matters is calling on Him in faith - in other words, recognizing the meaning of His name, and that He will respond.
I was chatting with someone the other day on another forum about a similar topic. That person was trying to say that Jesus didn't use God's name Jehovah or that it shouldn't be in the New Testament because it wasn't pronounced in Greek, but it was pronounced in Greek.
The Catholic Church has hidden their copies of many manuscripts that have God's name in Greek. (I'm not talking about just the Hebrew letters of the Tetragrammaton. I'm talking about His name translated into Greek.)
The texts typically used for many English translations today are either the Codex Vaticanus or the Codex Sinaiticus, or the Textus Receptus. The same types of apostates who wove in the hellfire doctrine or the Trinity doctrine are the ones controlling access to those older manuscripts. Those apostates are not to be trusted.
The modern orthodox Judaism tradition also is not to be trusted with giving an accurate account of the history of the use of God's name. The Kabbalistic teachings have been the very doctrines that blaspheme Jehovah's name the most.
There are fragments of transcripts in Greek dating to just prior to the time Jesus was born that have the name Jehovah in Greek. It's not the Hebrew Tetragrammaton; it's a Greek version of God's name. Jesus would have had access to Greek manuscripts with God's name in them. When Jesus taught, he would have used God's name in both Hebrew and in Greek. Thus he showed us by his example that it's okay to use God's name in another language.
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Where is Tony?
by Athanasius inon february 22, 2023, anthony morris iii was officially removed from the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.
a few months later it was revealed that the watchtower bought him a house in lumberton, north carolina.. however, and correct me if i am wrong, since leaving the gb nobody has reported seeing tony attending jw meetings or participating in field service.
in fact nobody has reported seeing him anywhere, not even at a local liquor store.
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FreeTheMasons
Whether he is there or not, someone is paying the tax bill on the house...
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
@JoeyJoJo said: FreetheMasons, I'm not sure if you are new here, or posting with a new account. With respect, you are simply paraphrasing selected bible passages that you believe to have some kind of meaning in 2024.
This board is full of people that lived a majority of their lives as JW's and have heard all of this before. Since leaving the org, a lot of those same people have studied the Bible in great detail - including the inconvenient parts of the bible they don't talk about much at the meetings.
All you seem to be saying is, ' the bible said it- that settles it'. That's not good enough if you want to be taken seriously.
FreeTheMasons
@joeyjojo -
If I cared more about what people think than about what Jehovah thinks, I'd still be in the JWborg now.
You seem to care more about impressing people than truth, which is why you value "being taken seriously" more than I do.
Are you a former JW elder?@JoeyJoJo said: No. In my 30 - ish years as a born in jw I never 'reached out'. Never an elder or m.s. - I didnt even auxilliary pioneer once.
Then why are you trying to imitate their tactics?
@JoeyJoJo said: Im not a fan of Garth Brooks or country music, so I dont know the song you are referring to, but thanks for dedicating it to me.
(First Verse)
Blame is all on my roots
I showed up in boots
And ruined your black tie affair, yeah
The last one to know
The last one to show
I was the last one you thought you'd see there
And I saw the surprise
And the fear in his eyes
When I took his glass of champagne
And I toasted you
Said, "Honey, we may be through
But you'll never hear me complain"
(Chorus)
'Cause I've got friends in low places
Where the whiskey drowns
And the beer chases my blues away
And I'll be okay
I'm not big on social graces
Think I'll slip on down to the oasis
Oh, I've got friends
In low places
(Second Verse)
Well I guess I was wrong
I just don't belong
But then, I've been there before
Everything's alright
I'll just say goodnight
And I'll show myself to the door
Hey I didn't mean
To cause a big scene
Just give me an hour and then
Well, I'll be as high as that ivory tower
That you're livin' in
[Chorus]
(Third Verse - not part of the original song but morphed into it over time...)
Hey, I didn't mean
To cause a big scene
Just wait 'til I finish this glass
And sweet little lady
I'll head to the bar
And you can kiss my ass!
[Chorus]
(Outro)
Yeah!
Oh, I've got friends in low places
Where the whiskey drowns and the beer chases
My blues away
And I'll be okay
I'm not big on social graces
Think I'll slip on down to the oasis
Oh, I've got friends in low places
'Cause, Honey, I've got friends
In low places
@JoeyJoJo said: Enjoy your beer- I wish i was drinking one right now.
Thank you. I did enjoy it.🙂 Maybe sometime we'll all have one together - while hanging out with Jesus too.😉
FreeTheMasons: For the same reason Herod saw him in a negative light - they didn't want to lose their power and control over people.
@TonusOH said: Even though they knew he was divine?
I asked the question to point out a flaw in the argument that the apostles would not have died for a fraud. We can point out this flaw in other ways, such as the claim that the Jewish priests --who were waiting on the Messiah-- would reject a man who performed miracles and spoke in a way that left people amazed. If people can act in an irrational manner, why not the apostles who supposedly preferred martyrdom? If their actions only make sense in the context of an actual god in their midst, how does that explain his rejection by the priests? Because they wanted something that they knew they would lose anyway? That doesn't make sense.
That's why the Bible calls it "stupid" or "foolish" in the Proverbs.It's also why it's referred to as "mentally diseased" or "corrupted thinking" in the New Testament.
To reject God's Son is stupid. It is foolish. The thinking of God's chief enemy is mentally diseased and corrupted. Just as a rusty car or a corroded wire stop functioning properly at a certain point, it's the same with Satan's brain. His thinking is so messed up from being disconnected from God. Satan knows God exists, but in his twisted mind he actually thinks he'll succeed in living even after disconnecting from Him. It's ridiculous.
The wicked priests in the first century knew God existed. They knew it. And they knew who Jesus was. But their thinking ability was so out of whack that they really thought they'd succeed and get away with it.
Jesus gave that illustration about the man with a vineyard who sent his heir to collect the harvest and the workers killed the heir. When we hear that illustration, we're like "what were they thinking?" And that is the point. Their thinking is so messed up - it's not logical at all.
The same thing happens to people today who are following in the ways of the Pharisees.
@TonusOH said: This sort of selective interpretation might be excused if it happens once, or if it can be explained away in a coherent manner. But this is typical of the Bible-- it is interpreted many different ways and inconsistencies and problems like the one described above are ignored or handwaved. After a while, it's not hard to understand what is happening-- we interpret it to suit our beliefs. This, in itself, is a flaw.
It is a flaw. It is a flaw in their thinking. You see it again and again and again in those who are following in the footsteps of the Pharisees.
They reject truth. They refuse to change. They deny God's Son. They are retarded. Seriously - they are mentally retarded - and I don't mean that in an insulting way - "retarded" as in slow.
If they choose to wake up and turn around, that would be nice.
It's too late for the Devil and the demons to turn around, but it's not too late for some of these pharisaical-types. When the Bible says there is no sacrifice left for those who blaspheme, what it means is that there's not going to be another ransom sent. The only ransom is the one Jesus paid with his blood already. So those retards have to look to that ransom. They must bend the knee to God's Son, Jesus, if they want to live forever.
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What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
That's not good enough if you want to be taken seriously.
How's the third line of this song go, @joey jojo, do ya know?😜
its 😎🍺
Allll good. Its just people thats all
Amen, @BethSarim! Jesus hung out with people - he didn't care what the freakin Pharisees thought...cheers to you, @BethSarim - having a cold one right now - may you have an awesome evening, my friend🫶😁
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
@joeyjojo -
If I cared more about what people think than about what Jehovah thinks, I'd still be in the JWborg now.
You seem to care more about impressing people than truth, which is why you value "being taken seriously" more than I do.
Are you a former JW elder?
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What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
It madness to refuse to acknowledge the clear evidence .
The reason Jesus said "a wicked generation keeps seeking a sign but no sign will be given them but the sign of Jonah" isn't because of a lack of evidence. There was plenty of evidence in that day that Jehovah's Word had come true and was coming true and would come true again in the future.
Jesus' point was that those wicked ones were not really seeking a sign. They didn't want God's words to come true. They were so corrupted in their thinking ability that no matter what evidence was in their face, they still refused to believe.
Fire came out of heaven in Elijah's day, and yet some people still clung to Baal. The waters of the Red Sea washed away Pharaoh, the ten plagues shamed the idols of Egypt, but later some ones still worshipped the Queen of the Heavens, the stars, and practiced the mystery cults of Egypt. Jerusalem was destroyed twice because of the wickedness of the religious hypocrites there who falsely claimed to represent the Most High God, and yet religious hypocrites today still refuse to believe Jehovah is yet again going to make an accounting.
The storm is here, and it is sweeping away the false refuge of lies that have been built by both religious hypocritical institutions and non-religious haters and abusers of humankind.
For those who refused to believe that Jesus was God's son back in first century Jerusalem, they got a figurative smack in the face when Jesus was resurrected a few days after they put him to death. They were brought face-to-face with "the sign of Jonah."
Those who wickedly test Jesus today, attempting to stumble people away from faith in God's anointed king, will likewise find themselves face-to-face with "the sign of Jonah" not very long from now.
The storm is here. You would be wise to repent.
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What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
"Here the Pharisees and Sadducees approached him, and to test him, they asked him to display to them a sign from heaven."
"In reply he said to them: “When evening falls, you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is fire-red,’ and in the morning, ‘It will be wintry, rainy weather today, for the sky is fire-red but gloomy.’ You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but the signs of the times you cannot interpret."
"A wicked and adulterous generation keeps seeking a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Joʹnah.” With that he went away, leaving them behind."
What "evidence" is there that the weather is changing?
If you've been alive long enough, you recognize certain patterns. The wind picks up. The humidity changes. The clouds are moving. The sky darkens or changes color. You can smell the rain on the gusts.
God's Word has always provided direction prior to a storm. There have been many "days of Jehovah" where He made an accounting or a reckoning with a person or a nation or a group. His Word has always come true.
Jesus is illustratively called "The Word" because he has always been part of relaying Jehovah's messages to humankind. The fact that Jehovah's Word has always come true is evidence that the Jesus of the Bible not only exists but has existed since the beginning of creation.
For someone to doubt his existence is madness.
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What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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FreeTheMasons
That definition of 'faith' is entirely useless. It asserts that 'faith' is itself 'evidence'.
Perhaps you should read it again.
It doesn't say faith is evidence.
It says faith is assured expectation of what is hoped for.
Why is it "assured"?
Because of convincing evidence.
In other words, first you have evidence, then you have faith that is built on that evidence.
It's not possible to build real faith without having the evidence first.