there are quite a few here who have been disfellowshipped for apostasy.. then there are those that have successfully faded.. why the different outcome?
are the ones that got df more out spoken?
or does the discrepancy lie with the elders?.
So technically I was never disfellowshipped publicly although I'm sure I have a thick, red filing folder somewhere (in many congregations, red filing folders were used to mark very problematic cases).
Is that "red filing folders" a permanent thing, or it has been reset after some time? It seems that no one in my current cong knows my 15y old case.
so, i was speaking with a relative recently, who is "in" the borg, but is completely aware of the terrible hypocrisy from the gb down.
he is not in the box, and its great to be able to have a realistic, and logical discussion about the current state of the org.. we started discussing, specifically, about that bunker video that was released in december.
how it is being played at all the conventions.
I remember when a movie "The Day After" (in the mid of 1980') came to cinema, our whole congregation went to see it - that was a real Armageddon paranoia...
can anybody point me to actual written society instruction pre 1981, regarding not shunning da ones?.
i know they included shunning as of the wt sept 15 1981, but was before that time purely an unwritten practice or what?.
oz.
I see that original question was never answered, so there is some articles, I took some lines out:
The Watchtower, August 1, 1972, pg 467 "disfellowshiped ... to be treated as an outsider"
The Watchtower, August 1, 1974, pg 464 "this does not require our treating such a one as an enemy or refusing to show common courtesy and consideration."
notice the 144000 can be counted and they all come from israel.. 9 after this i saw, and look!
a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues,*+ standing before the throne and before the lamb, dressed in white robes;+ and there were palm branches in their hands.+ .
this great crowd, no man was able to number, and they come from every nation!
Well, sooner or later, they would make a move in that direction - if you count all "true" christians in 1st century, some in the meantime, then 1870' onward, you get close to 144k. In 1935. (when was a change in doctrine about that) there was 52 465 partakers, add those who was anointed and died till 1935, add those who was anointed and died after 1935, and we still have 15 177 partakers last year and number is still growing and growing...
notice the 144000 can be counted and they all come from israel.. 9 after this i saw, and look!
a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues,*+ standing before the throne and before the lamb, dressed in white robes;+ and there were palm branches in their hands.+ .
this great crowd, no man was able to number, and they come from every nation!
Btlc the one Jehovah let see this prophecy couldn't number them. No one knows exactly how many will be there that day. Even Jehovah doesn't look into the future, everyone has free will.
No, it doesn't say that, it say: which no man was able to number, - please read better
notice the 144000 can be counted and they all come from israel.. 9 after this i saw, and look!
a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues,*+ standing before the throne and before the lamb, dressed in white robes;+ and there were palm branches in their hands.+ .
this great crowd, no man was able to number, and they come from every nation!
Even Jehovah doesn't look into the future
So what is The Book of Revelation? Just a bad trip of St. John?
any elder has never asked me that question so far but i want to be prepared to answer that question if any of them ask me that question in the future.
i hope that they will never ask me that question.
any suggestions on how to answer that question would be very much appreciated.
My answer would be: God works in mysterious ways...
notice the 144000 can be counted and they all come from israel.. 9 after this i saw, and look!
a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues,*+ standing before the throne and before the lamb, dressed in white robes;+ and there were palm branches in their hands.+ .
this great crowd, no man was able to number, and they come from every nation!
amazing grace have been around since 1779, how great thou art 1885,holy holy holy 1826, be thou my vision (ireland) 6th century, all creatures of god and king (italy)1225. so you think one day we will hear a kingdumb song playing over the radio.
you would think surely jehovah want the world to be familiar with his hymns.... maybe they have instructed the rf to only sing their songs in the kh, only for special folks..
@sparky1 ty! This was a rarely used, spare set in our cong in the mid of 1980', I was in charge for gramophone, and elder told me: "Take care of this vinyl, bro" so I took care :)
aren't there christian denominations who do not make false end of the world predictions but who nevertheless believe that the world will eventually end and paradise (whether in heaven or on earth) will come?.
it seems the watchtower was just jumping the gun when they made false end of the world predictions but they are nevertheless the right: the world will eventually end and paradise will come..
Even idea of paradise by JW is ridiculous - first kill 99.9% of humanity, then "resurrect" 99.9% people from the past times. Btw, there is nothing to resurrect - by JW teaching, soul = flesh body + impersonal spirit (energy), when someone dies, his soul dies, flesh body decomposes, spirit went back to God. Nothing unique left, just a "memory". So, in "resurrection" God will make a brand new body, put some energy to start life, and download informations from his "memory" to his brain - that is not resurrection, that is a cloning. That is just a replica of people lived once. So whats the point of "paradise" with 99.9% replicas of deceised people?
