Blondie is right...bethelites (and those in Gilead classes) are assigned to a local congregation and turn their time in just like everyone else. I never heard that they got to count any of the time spent in bethel work.(though maybe some did) However, they all were told that bether service and the work they did there superseded any requirements by the congregation. Of course, this was unwritten. But everyone, especially the elders know it. So, if your in bethel you "automatically" have a "get of of jail card" and don't need to comply with the 10 hour avg "guideline" to maintain your "good standing". Also, talk about pioneering or aux pio all you want...you never have the "time" (incl vacation) to do it...great racket...even the newbies in bethel caught on real quick...I was an elder in a congo near the Farm in upstate NY...bethelites get a "bye"...proandcon
proandcon
JoinedPosts by proandcon
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How do Bethelites show up in the monthly service report?
by truthseeker injust read a post on special pioneers, and it made me think of how bethelites report their time.. if you look at the monthly service report in the km, you don't see stats for bethelites.. they are full time workers for jehovah, but do they count themselves as pioneers or publishers?.
they sure can't be special pioneers (yet!
) as there are over 2,000 of them in the usa alone and the number of special pioneers is just over 200..
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Comments You Will Not Hear at the 6-4-06 WT Study (SHEPHERDS)
by blondie in(b) how does jehovah feel about appointed shepherds?.
(luke 22:55-60; 24:34; john 18:25-27; 21:114) did jesus reprimand the repentant peter for his lack of faith?
" (john 21:15-17) as the bible account of the history of the first-century christian congregation shows, jesus' confidence in peter was not misplaced.
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proandcon
Blondie...just a great summary and comments...as a former elder I know there was a sizable gap betweeen what was suppossed to be done by elders and what actually was done...I knew elders who would avoid people because they know they had problems that they (the elder) had been requested to assit; knew elders who for years were asked to work in the ministry with the R&F...never did...and balked if assigned...every congregation had a very weak sheparding program...from time to time it owuld get jump started...then within 4 months begin to languish again for several more years...in a cong I attend now infrequently as an x elder, there are twice as many exelders as current elders...none of the exes would ever return to that position again...many see that and wonder really about the elder position...for every man reaching out there are at least two just sitting back...most of the ones reaching out are on ego trips and aspire to "greatness" in the org...they're not spiritual men or ones who have particularly caring and loving attitudes which would lend themselves to being kind shepards...search out "sheep" who are lost...for get it...don't ask don't tell is the policy...a fader's paradise here....
JW's like to consider themselves as one big flock bonded together with love...in actuality it's every man for himself. The WTS does not know or even care about its flock...the aggogance and lack of humility they have transends to the elders in the congregations...the elders have no original thoughts...they are directed soley by the WTS...jealousy and backbiting on elders bodies in pretty notorious...I've been in business in large companies for over 35 years...dealing with these "loving shepards selected by holy spirit" has been far more trying than dealing with executives in worldly corporations.
THe BS in this article is simply unbelievable...I'm not going today but will wonder how many elders actually answer the questions inthe article...not many I bet...
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June 2006 Kingdom Ministry
by Elsewhere in.
for those who can stomach it... http://www.reexamine.info/okm/june2006us.pdf.
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proandcon
The last talk for the week beginning 6/12 is a real hoot...15 min..."Trusting the Faithful & Discreet Slave"...what a joke...trust these people to control your life; tell you to do things they they themselves don't do; wreck your family...sick...
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Dist Conv in Portland Maine
by proandcon ini attended on sat afternoon.
points of note mentioed several times in talks:.
pornography...still a big issue in dubdum...must be an epidemic the way they harp on it...especially porno on the web...so dubs are on the web in spite of the wt...no doubt on xjw sites also.. divorce...continues unabated by jw's all over.
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proandcon
Under believer...re big changes...not that I saw / heard...no "buzz" in Portland Maine...same old same old...no special speakers, parts, hoopla...if by chance you fell asleeep, you wouldn't miss anything...surprise, surprise...
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Convention release...192 page book..."Live with Jehovah's day in mind"
by proandcon in.
can anyone guess what this is a"thrilling" book is about.....the end is "here" (tm)...so be good so you can make it to the other side of armageddon per the wt, maybe...all the bs that fits in 192 pages...a copy and paste job for sure.... proandcon
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proandcon
"Jehovah's Day"...is a theme that resopunds in the last 12 books of the Hebrew scriptures...pg 40 says that by reflecting on the works and writings of these 12 prophets you can develop a "waiting attitude"..."not concerned about when the day will come or how long you have waited for it"...
be like these 12 minor prophets...wait on Jehovah...(guess this doesn't apply to the F&D slave class (tm))...
all the rest is cut and paste...keep your life simple...how to deal with others...beware the snares of the deveil (internet, porno, apostacy divorce, etc,etc)
be zealous despite opposition...rely on Jah (not the WT which will drop you like a hot potato in a NY minute whenever it pleases)
sounds like damage control...people leaving in droves... new recruits limited in the parts of the world which have financial resources...
Questions in each paragraph...so I guess it will be used in some future book study...
amazing how everything that needs to be said is either stretched or condensed into 192 pages...
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Convention release...192 page book..."Live with Jehovah's day in mind"
by proandcon in.
can anyone guess what this is a"thrilling" book is about.....the end is "here" (tm)...so be good so you can make it to the other side of armageddon per the wt, maybe...all the bs that fits in 192 pages...a copy and paste job for sure.... proandcon
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proandcon
Can anyone guess what this is a"thrilling" book is about.....the end is "here" (tm)...so be good so you can make it to the other side of Armageddon per the WT, maybe...all the bs that fits in 192 pages...a copy and paste job for sure...
Proandcon
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Dist Conv in Portland Maine
by proandcon ini attended on sat afternoon.
points of note mentioed several times in talks:.
pornography...still a big issue in dubdum...must be an epidemic the way they harp on it...especially porno on the web...so dubs are on the web in spite of the wt...no doubt on xjw sites also.. divorce...continues unabated by jw's all over.
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proandcon
Thank God...I only went to Sat afternoon..."thrilling" new release...Live with Jehovahs Day in Mind"...sneak preview...the end is real close (tm)...so be good...all the bs that fits in 192 pages...softcover thought to save $$$$...JW's there seemed very apathetic...saw many asleep...when I wasnn't sleeping...noise in the halls during the convention was pretty loud...these conventions are turning into just big social gatherings..."spiritual" value is very limited...same old stuff regurgitated constantly...agenda the same always...
proandcon
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Dist Conv in Portland Maine
by proandcon ini attended on sat afternoon.
points of note mentioed several times in talks:.
pornography...still a big issue in dubdum...must be an epidemic the way they harp on it...especially porno on the web...so dubs are on the web in spite of the wt...no doubt on xjw sites also.. divorce...continues unabated by jw's all over.
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proandcon
I attended on Sat afternoon. Points of note mentioed several times in talks:
Pornography...still a big issue in dubdum...must be an epidemic the way they harp on it...especially porno on the web...so dubs are on the web in spite of the WT...no doubt on xJW sites also.
Divorce...continues unabated by JW's all over. Huge problem ...almost every area cong has some issue with it. Couples are not committed to each other...not allowing Jah in the marriage...getting married to young...big problem, for sure. Destroying familes in God's spirit directed organization (tm)
"Higher education"...a "waste of time"...too many pursue "excess education" ...Jah's education is perfect and complete...higher education is "empty and self gratifying (yeah, especailly if you like to eat and stay dry)...
real sad "experience"...20 yr old MS and pioneer worked 3 days a week testing robots for an engineering company near Boston...company wanted him to work full time plus they would then send him to MIT (top school in the US) to pursue an engineering degree.. He is held in very high regard...the company was founded by MIT grads and professors...he prayed about it and decided he only wanted to work 3 days a week and forego the "higher education" (which he felt was "useless" in this system soon to end (tm)...so they moved him from the engineering dept to shipping / receiving...but becasue he was to "touch" some material going to the military...he QUIT the job...now he's unemployed...but "happily" pioneering" my guess is when he ultimately wakes up re the WT and begins to post here eventually, he is going to be one Pissed off cowboy...what a horrific decision...his parents (one a JW) are incredulous...I'm going to get them some info re the WT (UN and sending some to college when they need to)...maybe it own't be too late for him to rectify the situation at the job.
Unbelievable...and 5000 people at the convention here this stuff and applaud? WTF...
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Lots of Bethelites Not Happy With Downsizing
by Seeker4 ini had a long conversation last night with an old jw friend whose sister and brother-in-law are bethelites since the 1970s.
she is an artist, and he runs a small but important department there.. we were talking about the bethel downsizing (my friend was well aware of it), and i told him i figured his sister and b-i-l would be safe due to the fact that they are now in their 60s and have something close to 4 decades seniority.
but he said no, that they were worried that they would be asked to leave as well, sent into the circuit work or as special pioneers sent where the "need is great.".
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proandcon
For about 10 years, I lived near WT Farms in upstate NY. I attended a local congregation and got to know many bethelites. My observations:
- the older ones had gotten used to the bethel operation and despite the drudgery felt comfortable there...why not...three square meals, decent living conditions, nice scenery. Bethel fosters an "elitist: attitude also. Bethelites are told they have a special privelege. Many bethelites do "lord it over" those in the local congreagtion.They definitely gravitate to those with position and money. Typically, they love the finer things (clothes, cars, food, wine, etc) and will associate with those who can provide or have these things.
Most bethelites were former pioneers. Once you get used to the bethel grind, it's pretty easy...especially if you have some seniority and/or a "responsible" position. Going back "on the street" is a real downer. hard work, in comparison. Little gratification. No praise from the friends for their sacrifice. Now, they usually have to scrip by to survive. Living sconditions would not be as good. Need to find healthcare and pay for it. "Worldly" services cost real money...not bethel money.
The culture shock to any who are at bethel for some time would be enrmous in any number of ways (economic, social, psycological, and probably spiritual. They go from the elite to just Joe and Jane publisher.
Most congregations I have been associated with, really don't get real excited when someone new shows up from bethel to join the congregation. Their elitist attitude shows...their disappointment also shows. They usually seek out the elders and those with money / things. Widows and orphans...fogetaboutit !
They could easily be ripe to turn on the WTS because of what they've known about bethel (but turned a deaf ear to) and how they have now been "screwed over" by Momma (WTS). Jealously would definitely rear its head...why did we get picked while bro and sis asskisser still get to live the "good life".
The ramifications of this move should prove interesting. I think a good number wil fall away. The positive effect on the field and increasing numbers baptized will remain negligible.
My two cents
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What Are Words Or Expressions Peculiar To JWs???
by minimus injws have their own terminology.
it's a characteristic of a cult.
here's a few: "new system", the friends" and the "body".......can you think of more?
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proandcon
field service
quick build
privelege of service
ministerial servant
the friends
agape love
theocratic warfare
Jehovah God
Service meeting
theocratic school
bethel
4 door car (LOL)
circuit overseer
voluntary donation arrangement