Posts by shepherdless

19

12 june 2018 what to say

by LostAdam in

hi eveyone, my sis told me something like where will i be after that day.

i couldnt realize at first what she meant, but i found this on net donald-trump-kim-jong-un-meeting-singapore-june-12/.

i found her reaction so pathetic, but i think she is really sorry for me leaving.. so how to do you reply to jw family or generally when news about world peace comes out?.

shepherdless

You could have a lot of fun with someone with gentle jibes to anyone who sent you a message about 12 June. Just to throw around a few ideas for responses:

“oh I see, it is the Kim of the North.”

”That explains why there are so many references to the Korean Peninsula in the bible.[Sarcasm alert]”

“Perhaps North Korea is the “little horn” of Daniel 8:9 and its missile program is the little horn growing big and knocking stars out of the sky in Daniel 8:10” but then follow up shortly after saying, “no I got that all wrong. I checked Watchtower Online, and Daniel 8:10 is all about Watchtower filing a corporate amendment in the 1940s”

”Haven’t each of the last 6 US presidents all said “peace and security” at some stage?”

Send a few days before 12 June: “Organised a nice meal and glass of wine for the big day (12 June). What are you going to be doing?”

Send a couple of days after 12 June: “Still nothing. What do you reckon happened.” And diarise to send a further message every couple of months for the rest of the year, asking again about 12 June 2018.

80

Rumor: New light comes from outside marketing consultants

by Londo111 in

this is a rumor i heard back in november, it comes to me third or fourth-hand.

feel free to poke holes.

i have many doubts about this myself.

shepherdless

SDA in particular seems to be a far better managed religion, at least in my region. I personally would prefer sbf not to list things the Mormons and SDA’s do better, as I don’t want to see Watchtower get any good ideas.

8

Highlights from Leaked Bethel Videos - part 7, statistics charts

by neat blue dog in

here's some stat charts featured in the bethel talks:.

.

shepherdless

The first chart has to be global figures (not just USA). It would indicate that there are around 62,000 Kingdom Halls globally. It does refer to 995 built in 2017. I presume that very few of those were in the wealthier countries.

The second chart and the fourth (last) chart seems to be USA specific. 6221 Kingdom Halls seems to be consistent with the number of congregations in USA (about 14,000). So that would indicate that in USA, they built 20 KH's and renovated 72 in 2017. Given such buildings probably have a lifespan of about 50 years, that is nothing special. In fact, the chart indicates they hope to significantly increase building maintenance in the future.

I wonder which category Warwick fits into, on the green part of the fourth chart.

The third chart is a continuation of the first chart. If you add up all the numbers on top of the bars on both charts, you get the number 4340, which is exactly the number at the bottom of the fourth chart.

The word "closed" on the third chart probably means "completed". So "perfomed" in the first chart should also read "completed", to make sense.

The last line of the fourth chart just indicates to me that there are a lot of hidden costs in operating and maintaining a religious real estate empire.

13

What's it like these days for teenagers?

by JeffT in

jw
friends

i converted at age 22, and left 15 years later (1988) so i don't really know what its like to be in high school as a jw.

for those of you who do know: do teenage jw's hang out with each other?

worldly kids?

shepherdless

My kids all have “worldly” friends. I am pretty sure they don’t tell anyone at school that they are JWs. My eldest kid (who is completely out) said he never told anyone in school as it would have been “social suicide”.

I think it is easier for them, because JW kids are so rare, at least in our area. I am pretty certain that so far, through the primary school years, there has never been another JW kid in the whole school (youngest is nearly through primary school). I think in high school there have been one or two.

10

Cardinal George Pell Senior Member of the Vatican on Sex Charges in Australia to stand Trial.

by smiddy3 in

cardinal george pell will return to court in a fortnight ,he has been committed to stand trial relating to multiple complainants .. magistrate belinda wallington struck out about half the charges including the most serious of them .. cardinall george pell denies all charges against him.. the world media is watching the outcome of this trial he is the most senior member of the vatican to be charged with such an offence and by, all people , australians who have conducted their own arc into institutionalized child sexual abuse of children .. we wait with baited breath ( for a just outcome ) in all of these investigations ..

shepherdless

I don't know anything about the case, apart from what I have read in the media, and there has been very little description in the media (at least in what I have read) about the details of the charges.

At this stage, unless something new comes to light, my prediction would be that Pell is found not guilty of all remaining charges.

Just another point. I might well be wrong, but isn't it the case that Pell is facing "sexual abuse" claims, but nothing concerning an underage person?

39

Kingdom Halls sold.

by zeb in

jw
friends

please list kh that you know of that have been sold..

shepherdless

Stan: Wow..that's still a high dub to population ratio..about 1 to 260. What made the watchtower so popular over there ? Instant new world ?

Ratio for NZ is 1 to 330. Higher than most of Western European but lower than, for example, some Eastern European countries.

Compare that to the ratio in Australia, of 1 to 380. I am not sure of the reason for the difference, but it may be because Aust has had a higher immigration intake in recent decades. Another NZ stat is that there are only 75 publishers per congregation (compared to 84 in Aust, 83 in "Britain", 81 in Canada, etc).

226

Wealth, Poverty, and Morality

by SecondRateMind in

jw
friends

i am interested in the approach this forum takes to money.

apart from sex, (which i am quite relaxed about) it seems to me that wealth is the surest divider between those who are moral, and those who are not.. it seems jesus thought so, also.

luke 16:19-31 kjv describes well enough his dusty attitude to the rich who do not succour the poor.. and this world has many poor: so many, it might seem that we can do nothing about it, and twist his words; 'the poor ye shall have always with you, but me, ye shall not have always.

shepherdless

Hi 2RM, no it is essentially the same thing, except the communists had a practical approach to achieve the same ideal.

Firstly, the communists may have focused on the means of production, whereas you seem to focus on money. The communists correctly understood that money of itself has no intrinsic value, is both created and destroyed in various activities. Your ideal suggests that you are one of those who think all the money on the planet is a finite set amount (as if it was found under a bush somewhere by cavemen, and in circulation ever since). It is the means of production that represents real wealth. And some people are far better at using it to generate wealth than others. For example, farmland can produce great wealth, if managed well, and none, if managed poorly.

Secondly, the communists had the commune (or State, in the case of Russia, China, etc) own the assets rather than split them up evenly, amongst the people, on the theoretical understanding that the state or commune held it all on behalf of the people. This is a practical approach, given the above.

The problem is that the great equalisation (whether money or means of production) leads to a massive loss of production, where it is put into hands of people who either don’t know how to use it, or don’t care, or both. To take the farmland example, I remember a statistic from the late 1980s that USSR had 150 million farmers, yet was the world’s biggest importer of agricultural produce, yet the USA (with 50 million farmers) was the world’s biggest exporter of agricultural produce.

Likewise if you take all the money from the wealthy people in the world, you will deprive them of the ability to generate things that people need. If you give it to the poorest, they will not use it, or even know how to use it, to generate things that people need. Mass starvation is the likely result. You may consider communism to be different from the approach that you describe, but communism is just a practical approach to carry out your idea.

I think you mean well, and your heart is in the right place, by the way.

226

Wealth, Poverty, and Morality

by SecondRateMind in

jw
friends

i am interested in the approach this forum takes to money.

apart from sex, (which i am quite relaxed about) it seems to me that wealth is the surest divider between those who are moral, and those who are not.. it seems jesus thought so, also.

luke 16:19-31 kjv describes well enough his dusty attitude to the rich who do not succour the poor.. and this world has many poor: so many, it might seem that we can do nothing about it, and twist his words; 'the poor ye shall have always with you, but me, ye shall not have always.

shepherdless

This experiment has all be tried, many times, on a small scale and on a large scale, in the past. For example, they tried it in Russia after WW1, resulting in 20 million people starved to death in the 1920s. They tried it in China in the 1950s, and 50 million people starved to death.

13

2017 WTBTS Financial Statement Ireland

by Atlantis in

2017 wtbts financial statement irelandhttps://we.tl/f55k8sawsmatlantis!.

shepherdless

There’s no way JWs contribute £50 a month on average.

I am glad to hear that. You are probably right. I better explain.

I made that calculation using the financial figures for Britain about 18 months ago, and I mentioned it on a thread here, at the time. (Nobody challenged it.) I had a suspicion at the time that it wasn’t reflective of the rate at which individuals publishers were donating. It was an artificial rate; the total amount the Britan branch was extracting from the congregations or receiving directly, divided by the number of publishers, at the time. The great cash grab was probably still in its last stages, and the sale of Kingdom Halls would have lifted that figure, as well.

Maybe the same thing applies to the Ireland accounts. That €300 p.a. per publisher could be just reflective of the rate at which congregations are handing over money, not what individual publishers are donating.

Of course, you would expect the 2 rates to be the same or even out, over time. Except, of course, if the Borg is scrambling for cash.

13

2017 WTBTS Financial Statement Ireland

by Atlantis in

2017 wtbts financial statement irelandhttps://we.tl/f55k8sawsmatlantis!.

shepherdless

Hi sbf, almost all of the assets are tied up in freehold land. I know nothing about the situation in Ireland, but I wonder whether that branch building in Ireland is worth around €3 million, representing all of the freehold land in he accounts, and all Kingdom Halls are held in separate trusts or legal entities.

€300 per publisher per annum might seem a lot but I remember calculating the similar rate for publishers in the geographical area that Watchtower terms “Britain”, and it was much higher; of the order of £50 per publisher per month.