Posts by redline

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

1. Most of you were raised Witness and left for different reasons. Assuming that circumstances, or people involved either didn't meet to the expectations that you had ingrained.

Board users fitting this statement:
Almost everyone here (e.g. waiting, RedhorseWoman etc.)

2. Your dissecting the religion looking for imperfections and using this minutia as justification for your actions.

Board users fitting this statement:
Again almost everyone here.
Amazing - Waiting - Patio34 - Had Enough - COMF.

3. Some have lifestyles that were more openly accepted in other religious organizations, so it was beneficial to the conscience to move away from the strict guidelines of the Society.

Board users fitting this statement:
This was in reference to the sexual orientation of some, listed in other posts.

"You have actually ascertained that this is what really happened, right? You're not just tossing this out here as something your conditioning whipped out to explain away our words?"

Most of what I stated in the last post was not in reference to anyone particularly, but was summarizing over what I was hearing back from many people. Since there are lots of replies, and only me on this side, it makes it difficult to pick out certain people in particular, although I have tried in certain instances.

I have the same thought regarding your beliefs, seems we both feel the same way, and since we both can't be right..

I am intrigued by most comments here, and do feel concern and warmth for some here. This is now merely a conversation, not an attack, I do understand that many people have gone through difficult times. I do not wish to upset anyone, my stance had changed some from prior replies, but in the case or Religious Beliefs you cannot sugar coat it to protect the feelings of others. So I am trying my best to keep this from being conversational, to argumentative.

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

I should have left awhile ago, especially since Amazing aptly replied about the Nov99 KM and the danger of these sites. Just because of the association, for obvious reasons. So I may be pushing the gray area a bit too far, but I will recluse back into my world soon.

Copernicus: I knew when you mentioned forbidden fruit, you were doing so sarcastically, but it still applied well. The idea that if you start playing around with incorrect doctrine, eventually it can turn you, or myself. This is apparent from the mass of religions in the world today, no one can honestly say they are all correct. So with this in mind, are all false religions based purely on deliberate actions to deceive the people. Probably not, some I'm sure some are completely devout in their beliefs, and try to help others with pure intentions. This doesn't make it right, we are all held up to the same set of standards in the end, its not our choice. So this forbidden fruit was in lieu of the idea that it will still be destructive in the end for those who buy into it.

Most of you were raised Witness and left for different reasons. Assuming that circumstances, or people involved either didn't meet to the expectations that you had ingrained. So you atr dissecting the religion looking for imperfections and using this minutia as justification for your actions. Some have lifestyles that were more openly accepted in other religious organizations, so it was beneficial to the conscience to move away from the strict guidelines of the Society.

The theme I keep hearing is that the Society cautions about the use of the internet, or consorting with (for lack of a better word) apostates because of the dangers of enlightenment. You would all do the same if you felt that a dangerous group was talking to members of your family, because of the effects this may have. Now I am not saying dangerous in the physical sense, but in the overall-outcome it could have. Many people are credulous, easily intimidated, so its the position of others to help these people along. You can easily turn this point into some sort of Tyrannically control the Society has over the flock, but that would be missing the point. Like both you or I, we look out for our families and friends, and give points of council were mistakes can be easily made. Society does the same regarding the sheep, this is not a cunning deception, but a loving kindness. To turn this around and use it to imply the gullible nature of the people involved in the Organization would not apply well because of my stance with majority of you. Not in a bad way, but i'm saying that I have put myself into a position where I am alone, and without the insight of others with similar beliefs.

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

Several of you have brought up the point of my inexperience in the Truth comparatively to most of you. I cant deny that point, but when I had said "but still strong in my resolution", I was using it as a qualifier, so you would know my stand. Since I had figured that many of you would be inundating me with information regarding the Society, so I felt you needed to know where I stood. Not so much that I was vulnerable in my beliefs, but was simply here via many misguided links.

Copernicus:
Facilis descensus averno. Forbidden fruit, this was the same temptations that lead adam and eve off to destruction. Your mentioning that originally you had sought it out innocently at first, (no comments on the fact I am here as well) but then rejected your prior beliefs because of what you had stumbled across. That the society had deceptively left out information or changed it to fit the context. I believe that there are many sides to all arguments, that we could easily bring out versus that when used in one conversation would have a completely altered meaning. Of course your going to find instances where someone can manipulate an idea into an almost believable form. That without adequate study, and meditation on your end you could give into their "" argument. Ignorance is not a justifiable excuse, but is used with most religions today, I skeptically looked into the Jehovah's Witness Organization when it was first proposed to me. Not giving in on what I had already felt was factual, but then found that with their answers, and my study, that this was indeed the correct religion. But if I pause and look around, there are hordes of people trying to disway anyone associates with it away, and this is to be expected of anything that may hold value.

So rather then saturate myself with other peoples opinions, I usually stick with my own, and the Organization. This is not completely mistake free (on my opinion), but over time the answers usually come.

More then likely I couldn't stand up to a Theological Conversation with most of you, due to my lack of knowledge and experience. I however am strong on what I have established, and feel that my foundation is strong, and based on truths. I am sure most of you felt the same way before turning, but the love of the greater number was prophesied to start to cool as the end drew near.

Most of the comments used to point out the improbity of the Society, I've already heard and researched.

Had Enough brought out many, but its just the stand that people within the organization have to make regarding political gestures. Time frames of the end were often constructed within the flock, not given directly from the society. This is human error, and will happen, and has happened through-out history. Why would the Jehovah's Witness be completely exempt from it?

Again there are personalities with the congregations, some Elders are kind and humble, while other may be pretentious and unjust in their dealings. We are plagued with imperfections, and to continue to fault the whole because of the few is ignorant and unfair. Even in my few years I have seen that, but cannot deny that my own actions have been similar, so cannot point fingers when I made my own bad steps.

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

Witness religion started out with some awkward beliefs, but over time refined them as more information became available, so you will find discrepancies within the literature. This does not however mean that the society is hypocritical, only that the society admits when its wrong, and updates the information as a growing process.

So NBC is doing an expose on pedophiles within the JW organization, and how the society covers it up. I dont know about that, sure there are probably examples of molestation with the flock, but that doesnt mean the mass is bad, just the individual. Everyone is responsible for themselves, so who has the Truth molests a child, they will be accountable only, for thier actions. You can not use this as a whole representation of the Organization, unless you are so complety trying to justify your point, that reason no longer become valid.

I have no doubts that most of you are great people, so I am sorry if I lashed out a some in the beginning. My idea that your lives were worthless was improperly protrayed. Not in the idea that life is worthless, just how you use it. That point stll sticks, sorry if it stings. More then likely you will misconstrue the idea into some post Germanic mass genecide ideals lingering within the generations today, and how these people flock to the Jehovah's Witness Organization because of the similarities. I choose not to respond to this earlier because of how inept the point was.

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

Just to clear things up, yes I am a Jehovah's Witness. I do refer to the truth, not as a social community, but in reference to the religion that I practice. New compared to most, baptized 4 years, but still strong in my resolution.

My question is if this forum is for former witness, or those that just disagree with the religion as a whole. Then why use the description "Online Meeting area for brothers & sisters" other then to bait witness to this place? Your all right, the organization does caution about the Internet, and this would be the reason why. Not that you have all the right answers, and they are trying to protect their interests. More accurately that most of you are trying to drag people from the religion, so dont associate with those that want to destroy you. So my visit is short, and beyond my better judgment.

Outkast, I dont spend large quantities of time reading forums, yea I stumbled on this place a couple days ago, but just today started to check some of the topics.

61

Is this Completely Apostate

by redline in

jw
friends

i just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought i would stop in to see what it was all about.

it claims to be a jehovah's witness forum, which it is not.. dont want to come here and point fingers, as i am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good.

i guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the truth.

redline

I just happened on this place a few days ago, and thought I would stop in to see what it was all about. It claims to be a Jehovah's Witness forum, which it is not.

Dont want to come here and point fingers, as I am sure there are some good people in here, just seems the bad have followed the good. I guess in reality thats always the case, but hey, what else would these people do if they couldn't wage their little war on the Truth. I guess thats enough said, problem is apostates talk so much, but only the rotten listen. I guess misery does love company, one worthless life enjoys another.

Bye..