ronwashington

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Posts by ronwashington

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  23

  In a judicial hearing does the accused have the right to face his accusers?

  by solomon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if someone says they saw me smoking a cigarette do i have the right to challenge them face to face in the hearing room?.

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  ronwashington

  That's a good point Anon. I wonder how many JW know the rules for a hearing. Odds are they don't since the rules are laid out in the Flock book.

  It's funny. People would tell me there's nothing secret in the book, which is true to an extent. However after having read it, there's a LOT of stuff that's only found in the book and letters to the BOE which serve as additions to the book. I feel like an idiot for not having snagged a copy of it when I was at Bethel. Anyone happen to have a link to a PDF version of it or something?
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  15

  Secret Watchtower Letter: PARENTS HAVE MAIN RESPONSIBILITY FOR CHILD'S SAFETY

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in a separate thread, cedar's response to the watchtower's hot-off-the-secret-press-to-elders letter on child abuse is featured.

  cedar's article is a powerful, well-composed overview of that letter.. tellingly, in the watchtower letter you will not find any direct exhortation requiring parents to first go to the elders when their child discloses sex abuse.

  no, the watchtower is much too clever to directly state what parents should or should not do.

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  ronwashington

  Geez. This letter is insane.

  15. Who is considered a known child molester? The January 1, 1997, Watchtower article “Let Us Abhor What Is Wicked” mentions on page 29 that a man “known to have been a child molester” does not qualify for privileges in the congregation. The expression “known to have been a child molester” has reference to how such a man is considered in the community and in the Christian congregation. In the eyes of the congregation, an adult “known” to be a former child molester is not “free from accusation” or “irreprehensible,” nor does he have “a fine testimony from people on the outside.” (1 Tim. 3:1-7, 10; 5:22; Titus 1:7) In view of his past, those in the community would not respect him and congregation members might be stumbled over his appointment. Keep in mind that the branch office, not the local body of elders, determines whether one who has sexually abused a child is considered a known child molester.

  Ok so this paragraph restates the 1/1/97 W which says that a molestor DOES NOT qualify for privileges. It doesn't say 'for a long time' which is the case in some offenses. For example, marrying a non-JW would prevent someone from having privileges for a few years.

  Then check out paragraph 22

  22. It cannot be said in every case that one who has sexually abused a child could never qualify for privileges of service in the congregation. However, the elders will certainly want to be very cautious, especially when dealing with one who had repeatedly engaged in this kind of wrongdoing or who had been disfellowshipped for such an offense.

  WHAT??? WHAT??? So IT IS POSSIBLE FOR A CHILD MOLESTOR TO HAVE PRIVILEGES (after they call the branch and they OK it). That is absolutely insane. The secret nature of this letter means no one will EVER KNOW THIS. The public and the rank and file will only know of what is said in that WT.

  I really want to print this letter off and post it on the information board at the local hall after I highlight, bold, and italicize that paragraph.

  Also, and this is really the big sticking point for me in this whole letter, is WHAT ARE THE BRANCH POLICIES ON HANDLING SEXUAL ABUSE OF MINORS. Literally every paragraph says "CALL LEGAL" but nowhere does it say, nor have I seen anything, regarding just what their policies are.
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  25

  Blood Cards :Now they ask for photocopy of the signed document

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we have been asked for a photocopy for each of our family's blood signed cards for the congragation's secretary records .we 've never been asked before ,is this a new thing ?

  does anyone know more about it ?.

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  ronwashington

  Yup, here we go:

  *** km 12/04 p. 7 New Provision to Assist Us to Abstain From Blood ***

  Before folding the DPA card, make good-quality photocopies for your health-care agent, alternate health-care agent, and doctor as well as for your own records. You may also want to provide copies for other family members and the congregation secretary. Copies should be single-sided on standard-size (8 1/2″ x 11″) paper, with the DPA card centered on the page. The original DPA card, not a photocopy, should be kept on your person.
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  25

  Blood Cards :Now they ask for photocopy of the signed document

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we have been asked for a photocopy for each of our family's blood signed cards for the congragation's secretary records .we 've never been asked before ,is this a new thing ?

  does anyone know more about it ?.

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  ronwashington

  that's not really new. It's always been suggested to give a copy to the secretary or PO, along with the people listed as proxies, your family, and your primary doctor.

  it's possible they received orders from the branch to collect copies from anyone who hasn't done so.
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  9

  The deaf video made an apperance on the ANDY COHEN show

  by loosie in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my husband watches the andy cohen show where he interviews the real housewives.

  anyway i don't much attention to it, but my hubby called me in when they showed the snippet of the wt masturbation video and how enthusiastic it was.

  they showed the part where he spanish man was really getting into it.

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  ronwashington

  This is great. It's been a long time since goons did anything that really caught anyone's attention. Here's the origin of this for those interested:

  http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3504602
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  60

  Meeting attendance

  by DATA-DOG in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible
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  ronwashington

  Meeting attendance numbers seem to be unchanged by all the reports I've heard. Most congregations average 100% or better. The Wednesday meeting is 75%-85%, usually on the low side. Of course, those numbers are based on the number of publishers in a congregation. Children always artificially inflate this number since they are counted but are not publishers, so 100% is not reallllly 100%
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  5

  When Are Rude Gestures And Warrior Wizards Acceptable For Jehovah's Witnesses?

  by DT in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the watchtower society has been doing a lot of touching of the "unclean thing" lately.

  for example, in an effort to warn their members about warriors, wizards and warrior wizards (just in case someone decided to mix the two types of abomination), they made a video about a child playing with a warrior wizard to show why it is wrong to play with warrior wizards or watch videos that contain them.. now they have made videos for the deaf that warn of the dangers of masturbation (and even oral and anal sex) by graphically and enthusiastically stimulating (i guess that should be simulating) the very acts that they are condemning.. is it any wonder that the watchtower society is being accused of sending mixed signals?.

  normally, graphically simulating sexual acts would get a witness in trouble.

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  ronwashington

  Here's where all these video mashups started, btw: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3504602
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  70

  Watchtower honors Jehovah's Witness Elders responsible for Candice Conti and Menlo Park Fiascos

  by Balaamsass in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  this weekend was the convention for the southern san francisco bay area.

  it was held at the santa clara convention center in the silicon valley http://www.santaclara.org/conventioncenter/ which is an improvement over the old s.f.

  cow palace which is still used..just not as much.

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  ronwashington

  How were these elders honored? What was the quote? Anyone have an audio/video recording?
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  61

  The Decline of Elders and Ministerial Servants

  by Londo111 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i seem to remember somebody saying that since the 90's the number of elders has declined from 90000 to 60000. does anybody have any hard figures regarding this?.

  the organization is desperate for "qualified" men.

  but their standards are much too high, especially the monthly field service hour requirements tagged on to endless meetings and congregational busywork.

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  ronwashington

  It comes as no surprise that there's a lack of brothers. The existing bodies are getting older and when you have over 75% of all young adults and early 20-somethings leaving the organization, of course there's going to be a shortage. With the economy in the shitter people have to work more and miss meetings and service, which will dq someone for those privileges. For those that manage to qualify they are just in for more thankless work anyway.

  I was the super MS in the congregation. Need a last minute part on the service meeting? They'd ask me. Need a last minute public talk in a congregation 2 hours away? They'd call me Saturday night. I did stuff before, during, and after the meetings. The other MS in my congregation were a joke. Terrible speakers and they hated taking on more responsibilities. I understand why they didn't like it, but then again, why sign up for the job. Anyway, it's funny that after years of that, all it takes is a few months of depression, missing meetings and service until they deleted me. Of course they re-assured me of their love and how they want to help me.

  What's even funnier is that a day after the elders told me, the secretary called to see if I could do a last minute public talk. He had balls, I'll give him that. It's been about a year now, and I've had exactly one 45 minute shepherding call. It took the elder about 2 minutes to get to the point: why aren't you at the meetings. I gave it to him straight. It's boring, I don't care about anyone there. He said that the congregation misses us blah blah blah. So I asked him why I've only heard from like 2 people in the hall in the past year. He didn't have much to say to that.

  I know profanity is not allowed here, but I'll take my lumps. Fuck em. Fuck the elder bodies. Most are there just to climb that ladder and hopefully be a CO or whatever some day. The rest are there because they want to exert their will and opinions on the cong. I've only come across a handfull of elders and like one circuit overseer who I would say actually cared about the congregation and weren't interested in promoting their own agenda or bringing down a hammer of any sort.
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  11

  Would I be in trouble?

  by Pallbearer in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  would i be in trouble?let's suppose that i had never stopped going to the meetings at the kingdom hall, and that i was still actively engaged in the field service.

  if you were to be invited into my home you couldn't help but notice that the entire top (probably 6 foot across) of my entertainment center (a piece of furniture that holds the tv and that has glassed-in shelves on each side) is crowded with religious figurines, most of which came from the local catholic store.. .

  next to that is the nativity scene that has several pieces: the wise men, the "star", the babe jesus, and joseph and mary etc.

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  ronwashington

  well, aside from the fact that being obsessed with figurines is kinda weird, you're not going to get in trouble. The only one that could would be the star of david in the nativity since that's supposed to be satanic in origin.

  you'd probably get a little bit of counsel for everything else, but that's about it. Don't expect any privilieges.