I personally feel the most brilliant thing you did was how you responded to the question, "are you an apostate?". Your response, " what's that?" Seemingly disarmed the jw and may enable them to justify research. Well done!!
jeremiah18:5-10
JoinedPosts by jeremiah18:5-10
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37
"It's the intent that counts and not the result."
by donny in"it's the intent that counts not the result.".
i have been out of the jw organization for some 22 years now and i sometimes get a reminding jolt out the hoops that some will jump through to make their religion make sense to them.
the first line in this post is what a jw on the street here in salinas told me on saturday when trying to justify the society's history of false prophecies.
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Why don't parents of an abused child go straight to police, why go to an elder first??
by FeelingFree ini hope i don't come across as judgemental but having read a lot on the current child abuse cases and the different threads on here, i am left wondering why on earth a parent of an abuse victim would go to an elder with the problem first and not straight to police?.
as a parent myself i know that if anything like that happend to my child (this applies to when i was still an active jw as well as now) i would not hesitate in going to the authorities as soon as i found out, it wouldn't of crossed mine or my husbands mind to go to an elder.
maybe after we had reported it but definitely never as the first port of call.
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jeremiah18:5-10
As a former JW and an elder that once was on a judicial case investigating alleged child abuse, I can speak confidently about the internal struggle I went through. It is my opinion that most JW's, elders included, do not have proper self-esteem. They base their self worth on the way they are viewed by the elders and the "friends". They have no idea how to assess their value for themselves or to take pride in personal decision-making because they have willingly surrendered this ability to the organization. I was worried about how I would be viewed if I suggested that they go to the authorities with their concerns and suspicions. I feelt incapable and unqualified to be involved in this case, especially since the victim was not old enough to even speak yet.
The parents were in anguish and were close friends with the alleged perpetrators parents, and this internal struggle coupled with their desire to be viewed approvingly by the elders and the congregation, caused them to just follow protocol. The only thing that could be done was to take the word of the alleged perpetrator, a 16 yo boy, and try our best to detrmine if he was honest or not, mind you none of us had any training to do this, just rely on the Holy Spirit to reveal it.
We made the "call" to Legal and were told since there's no witnesses , this is all you can do. Use your best judgement and encourage unity.
Makes me sick that I wasn't strong enough to go with my instinct.
Makes me sicker to now realize that both myself and the people involved were more concerned about their own reputation than the well-being of the little infant girl.
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BTTT / Marked topics
by Simon ini've noticed a lot of topics being bumped recently with "bttt" (back to the top) comments or "marked" as the reply.. i'd appreciate if people think twice before doing this.
simply forcing topics back to the top even though there is nothing to say on them is not helpful and negates the usefulness of having an active topics view.
if everyone did this with every topic they want to push then things would quickly deteriorate so i don't believe some should be allowed to do it for whatever reason.. by all means post new and relevent comments to a topic but short esp single-word non-comments that are simply used to push certain topics back to the top are likely to be interpreted as spam and removed or blocked if necessary.. .
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jeremiah18:5-10
Just a suggestion, why not literally mark a thread you want to follow by saving in your "favorites" in your browser.
If you get too many "favorites" to reasonably manage, create folders in your "favorites" and then you will be able to quickly return to the thread.
Wouldn't this accomplish the same thing?
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Would JWs Really Drink The Kool Aid?
by minimus inif push came to shove and it was a showdown for loyalty to the organization or not following whatever decrees coming heir way, what percentage would remain loyal to the organization?
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jeremiah18:5-10
What if drinking the koolaid actually was a directive that involved, rather than taking their life, starting to cleanse the earth of evil, starting with their unbelieving family, especially those that left? I was pondering this the other day and whether my parents, still very active, would do so. I don't think they could. But Hebrew scriptural examples are abundant of isrealites killing their family members to demonstrate loyalty. I could see it being a directive given.
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is there any biblical event that has a universally accepted date on which it occurred?
by jeremiah18:5-10 ini'm intrigued by the whole "bible chronology" topic, but have never really dug into it because to put any of it together you need a historically reliable starting point.
this wasn't a problem as a practicing jw because you just assumed their dates were right.
i would like for someone to give me one event described in the bible that is universally established and accepted historically that i can use as a reliable starting point.
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jeremiah18:5-10
Ok thank you for some starting points. Btw when I refer to "bible chronology" I do so tongue-in-cheek, much like many of us refer to "the truth", its just the residue of the "pure language" remaining, lol.
Anyway,I just want to better comprehend the dating mistakes made by wt and to further increase my knowledge of the topic, so thanks again.
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is there any biblical event that has a universally accepted date on which it occurred?
by jeremiah18:5-10 ini'm intrigued by the whole "bible chronology" topic, but have never really dug into it because to put any of it together you need a historically reliable starting point.
this wasn't a problem as a practicing jw because you just assumed their dates were right.
i would like for someone to give me one event described in the bible that is universally established and accepted historically that i can use as a reliable starting point.
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jeremiah18:5-10
I'm intrigued by the whole "bible chronology" topic, but have never really dug into it because to put any of it together you need a historically reliable starting point. This wasn't a problem as a practicing jw because you just assumed their dates were right. I would like for someone to give me one event described in the bible that is universally established and accepted historically that I can use as a reliable starting point. Can someone please either provide that or point me in the right direction? Thank you.
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Most Ridiculous Thing You've Ever Been Counseled On
by MrFreeze ini'm sure topics like this have already come up but they tend to get hilarious with the absolute absurdity that goes on in the kh.
i was once counseled for not shaving after two days.
i was also counseled by a sister for eating lucky charms cereal.
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jeremiah18:5-10
No, we were married to fleshly sisters
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Most Ridiculous Thing You've Ever Been Counseled On
by MrFreeze ini'm sure topics like this have already come up but they tend to get hilarious with the absolute absurdity that goes on in the kh.
i was once counseled for not shaving after two days.
i was also counseled by a sister for eating lucky charms cereal.
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jeremiah18:5-10
This might trump most, it was akward then and still akward to relate now. When I was a ms, my brother in law, a fellow ms and always a perv, approached me and said an elder asked him to talk to me about my wife's somewhat tight clothes. She was an incredibly built woman at the time, well endowed and perfectly built, imho. Anyway it seems her clothes were "too revealing" and drew attention to her "assets", both her top and bottom. He drew particular attention to her having visible underwear lines and that it was inappropriate and could be unduly arousing to the brothers. I was caught off guard and didn't really know what to say. I thought plenty but was a good company man and didn't say anything but sure ok. I talked to my wife, she was appalled then laughed about it. She didn't change a thing, especially since apparently as she pointed out, many sisters are much worse than her and wear even tighter clothes and reveal the same if not more. This was early nineties and her attitude was beginning at that time to rebel against all already anyways. Although I laugh about it now, its still creepy and awkward to say the least. Sorry if tmi, but that's kinda the point of this thread I guess. I really can't stand that guy now, thank god he's no longer my bil.
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Did your congregation have a "Pioneer Appreciation Day"?
by Coffee House Girl inmy mom (who is now a regular pioneer) has been laid up after having major surgery, and i assert my "biblical" rights as a daughter to do what i can to take care of her, so i have been trying to go to her house on my day off to vaccum and run errands for her since she is not supposed to drive.. she called me last saturday to tell me that i couldn't come by because she was driving to her pioneer appreciation day get-together, wtf .
i'm just curious if this only happens in my area (michigan, us)????.
chg. .
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jeremiah18:5-10
In the early to mid 90's I was a part of a congregation as a ms and pioneer where we did this. The body enjoyed a very rare unity and chemistry. They were, we were all very tight knit and it felt like real teamwork. Those days were very enjoyable for my wife and I. Later when I became an elder I always strived to recreate that chemistry but it never happened. These guys all genuinely liked each other. Slowly the body changed as different ones moved away. Sadly it degenerated into disunity and discord. Those pioneer appreciation days were great though. One of the few good memories I take away from my time in the religion.
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The Christian Hope--Is it in Heaven or on Earth?
by DS211 inso is the christian hope in heaven or on earth?.
in acts chapter 1the question was raised: 6 so when they had assembled, they asked him: lord, are you restoring the kingdom to israel at this time?
7 he said to them: it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.. notice jesus never said thered be a change in venue, just that it wasnt up to them to know when..... so what is there from both sides?
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jeremiah18:5-10
IMHO, there is no answer to this question. If asking what is taught in the Christian Greek scriptures, I feel unreservedly only "heaven" is offered as a final destination or hope. But what I always come back to is, what is heaven? We know what earth is, we can totally imagine a better life on earth. Heaven though is entirely in the imagination of the beholder. Nobody can testify to going to heaven, nobody can describe it, nobody can tell you what the bible writer meant when referring to heaven. Most commonly heaven is referred to as a concept of perfection, a world without problems as we know them. This is the only thing attractive about such an idea, along with getting to receive answers or understanding of matters commonly postulated on like who is god, how did we get here, what is the purpose of life. I find no satisfying answer to what destination if any awaits Christians or non Christians. It takes an incredible leap of unfounded faith to believe in going to heaven because it can't be based on any known, established facts or testimony.