Posts by cog_survivor

23

Does the WTBS emphasize these two verses for control?

by cog_survivor in

something i came to understand that the worldwide church of god did effectively was to cut people off from from their feelings and intellect in favor of the "appropriate" thoughts and feelings.. how they did this was by frequently emphasizing these two verses:.

proverbs 3:5 - trust in the lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.. jeremiah 17:9 - the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?.

by means of these two verses i was taught not to trust myself with regards to either my ability to reason or if my gut was telling me something was wrong.. i was wondering if these two verses were emphasized for jws as well..

cog_survivor

That's a good question Apognophos.

I don't know how it is with the Catholics, but I don't find it to be the case with what I've experienced in visiting my Southern Baptist family's churches or with the Episcopalians.

That's not to say they don't have some beliefs that some may find off putting. But with my Baptist family members, I find they tend towards the belief that Jesus lives in the heart of believer. Therefore to not listen to your heart or be tender in your conscience is like not paying attention to Jesus. The believing individual is fully capable of being led by Christ. There's a bit more to it than that of course because the believer is expected to be discerning but there is a lot less interference in this matter than there is in a cult.

The Episcopalians are seen as somewhat soft on sin by the more fundamentalist groups, but they respect the fact that everyone has a unique journey with God and are careful not to overly tamper with that.

That's as far as my personal experience goes with religion outside the cult. But even so, I think it is safe to say that a wide variance can be found. Even to some extent within the groups I mention.

23

Does the WTBS emphasize these two verses for control?

by cog_survivor in

something i came to understand that the worldwide church of god did effectively was to cut people off from from their feelings and intellect in favor of the "appropriate" thoughts and feelings.. how they did this was by frequently emphasizing these two verses:.

proverbs 3:5 - trust in the lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.. jeremiah 17:9 - the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?.

by means of these two verses i was taught not to trust myself with regards to either my ability to reason or if my gut was telling me something was wrong.. i was wondering if these two verses were emphasized for jws as well..

cog_survivor

It looks like there was a fair amount of overlap in abusive twisting of the scriptures. It is so strange (but again perhaps not) when my developing critical thinking skills unearth some new way in my life was controlled. Despite the fact I've been out of the group for close to 10 years now.

Blondie: Those quotes could have come straight from sermons I heard when I was a child. I love how you are able to go back and cite source material. I threw out all of my old literature to try and purge it from my life. Problem is that it is harder to purge from the head It isn't so much that I believe that way anymore but some of my knee jerk reactions tend to surface now and again. Much to my chagrin. Anyway there are plenty of Herbert Armstrong worshippers who have archived his materials on the internet so if I need to verify that 'yes' something did happen, there's evidence.

Pterist: What you say about the reaction by the wcg elders in Florida was pretty typical. I was raised in a fairly conservative area (Indiana, not England. I just watch too much bbc and pbs. I also joined the Episcopal church a couple of years ago so some of the anglican phrases have probably rubbed off on me) The area I was in while in WCG had a pastor who couldn't go along with all the changes from on high and so there was a huge amount of confusion happening. Things got really messy.

NeverKnew: There is a group out of Korea that has some really uncanny resemblances to the Worldwide Church of God based out of California. I didn't hear about them until about a year ago. When I looked them up I found too many things in common to be coincidental. I suspect that their leader had some association with Herbert Armstrong (the leader of WCG). But what I have no idea. I'm so sorry your niece got sucked into their cult.

Lost Generation, Ignat, Fed-up, and KurtBethel; Those verses are familar as well. Conform or die was the message we got continually.

Thinkaboutit,00Dad, and Clarity: I totally get that. Been there and even had a lousy youth camp teeshirt for doing it.

23

Does the WTBS emphasize these two verses for control?

by cog_survivor in

something i came to understand that the worldwide church of god did effectively was to cut people off from from their feelings and intellect in favor of the "appropriate" thoughts and feelings.. how they did this was by frequently emphasizing these two verses:.

proverbs 3:5 - trust in the lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.. jeremiah 17:9 - the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?.

by means of these two verses i was taught not to trust myself with regards to either my ability to reason or if my gut was telling me something was wrong.. i was wondering if these two verses were emphasized for jws as well..

cog_survivor

Thanks for the reply Ding:)

I was curious as to whether this was a common use of these verses in bible based cults.

The leaders wiggled around it was by saying that they were given an extra helping of God's Holy Spirit beyond the average layperson (WCG saw the HS as God's power). Herbert Armstrong claimed to receive relevation from God that no one else received by the power of the Holy Spirit. He covered his behind by saying it was from the scripture and that the Holy Spirit opened his eyes to see the truths he found.

Of course he was a liar as he cobbled most of his teachings from multiple sources.

23

Does the WTBS emphasize these two verses for control?

by cog_survivor in

something i came to understand that the worldwide church of god did effectively was to cut people off from from their feelings and intellect in favor of the "appropriate" thoughts and feelings.. how they did this was by frequently emphasizing these two verses:.

proverbs 3:5 - trust in the lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.. jeremiah 17:9 - the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?.

by means of these two verses i was taught not to trust myself with regards to either my ability to reason or if my gut was telling me something was wrong.. i was wondering if these two verses were emphasized for jws as well..

cog_survivor

Something I came to understand that the Worldwide Church of God did effectively was to cut people off from from their feelings and intellect in favor of the "appropriate" thoughts and feelings.

How they did this was by frequently emphasizing these two verses:

Proverbs 3:5 - Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

Jeremiah 17:9 - The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

By means of these two verses I was taught not to trust myself with regards to either my ability to reason or if my gut was telling me something was wrong.

I was wondering if these two verses were emphasized for JWs as well.

51

Hot of the Press!!! YEARBOOK 2013 :Letter from the Governing Body

by raymond frantz in

yearbook 2013 :letter from the governing body.

dear brothers and sisters :our heavenly father,jehovah, is the personification of love.hence the bible states :"god is love".

(1 john 4:8) even though jehovah is almighty ,his word never says ,"god is power" or , "god is might".he bases his rule primarily on love.how this attracts us to him!.

cog_survivor

Yikes! I read this letter as incredibly manipulative. Its bad enough that the GB controls by fear but now they add the requirement that you love them for it. So anytime some poor follower feels less than loving towards God as portrayed by them, he's going to get a nice extra of mental torment of thinking he isn't motivated by love to serve the GBs dictates.

It makes me think of the abuser who says, "If you love me, you would want to.... (you can pick what ever abuse you like. I'm thinking, "work yourself into the ground", "be grateful for the pain I'm inflicting because I'm saving you from some future horror....)"

174

Good Reasons To Hate Every Weak And Ex-Jehovah Witness.

by AuntConnie in

1. my husband's time is finite, it's wasted on spouses arguing over money, sex or family mattters with stupid home visits.. .

i hate people's constant open hand for money, it's the weak individuals asking others to pull their weight.

my family worked extra hours instead of begging the strong members for district assembly money, cat food for seven cats or tiny little rag-a-muffins weiner dogs.. .

cog_survivor

Hi AuntConnie,

I'm not a JW nor an X-JW. You've got yourself in a bit of a headlock with this stuff haven't you?

Since you can't take the bigger steps maybe a baby step is in order. Get the book "Boundaries" by Townsend. Then start applying the principles involved. It won't fix everything but it will help you to feel more in control.

43

i called a therpist today any advice

by unstopableravens in

this is new to me,im a little nervous, its for me and than later for family, wifey does not like the idea because its not the elders,and she doesnt want the org to look bad.

she more worried about them than our marriage ,im only doing this for us and my sanity,whats you guys thoughts?.

cog_survivor

That's great! Therapy has helped and is still helping with issues from my cult past. Just don't be surprised that other baggage may show up as well. In my case I'm still working through some family issues that contributed to my parent getting involved with cult.

Be patient with yourself. It takes a while to unlearn and relearn but this is a postive step towards healing.

So glad the person you are seeing is familiar with JWs that will help a huge amount. Can't tell you how much time I had to spend trying to make the ones I've seen understand.

Don't be surprised if the wife is closed off and rejecting during the session. I dragged my Mom with me to one of mine and even though I tried to make it as non-threatening as possible (no accusations, trying to explain how I feel and what I want from life) it was like having teeth pulled without anesthetic. I second what "Left in the Cold" says. Keep any sessions with the wife low level about the JWs.

25

Why does my mom shun my Son?

by trujw in

i have never understood one thing about jws.

ok i am not a witness but what has my son done?

he is an innocent child.

cog_survivor

IMHO it is part and partial to every cult to close one's eyes to the difficult reality of a christian life.

The person you don't have a relationship with is a heck of alot easier to try to "save" and rack up points for having done so than to have a genuine heart to heart relationship with some one who doesn't agree with you.

Generally people opt out of the difficult for the easy. To genuinely love is very hard. It means you have to have humility and admit that you and your ideas don't always take precedence. It means loving someone patiently without cutting them off just because they are imperfect. (Hello, we're all imperfect). All those things in I Corinthians 13 mean something to the christian ethos yet we as humans want to waffle and pretend it depends on the situation.

It takes courage to do this. The WTBS feeds on fear so it cultivates fear. I'm sorry for your mother. She has bought into the fear and deprived herself of joy.

Pity her for the cramped life she lives and know that she has bound herself to fear and not to love.

37

Does This Happen to You? I Need Help :/

by DarioKehl in

hey guys.... i have a few important questions for everyone.

this applies to doubters, faders, inactive, dfed or seasoned apostates.

first, let me set it up:.

cog_survivor

Having been in a similar leaky boat and currently in counseling for similar issues, I really feel for you.

I personally believe that by ensuring a high level of peer pressure, a group keeps you more worried about what others think even to the extent of trying to predict their reactions to attempt to prevent any discomfort. This ensures that your thoughts and energies are taken up with this activity so that you aren't spending that time reflecting on what it is that you think and believe.

I too would recommend getting the support of a counselor. Additionally, try to gently set some boundaries. Listening to their horror stories about those who left isn't doing you any good. You may want to consider gently redirecting the conversation. Bonus points if you can do it in a spiritual manner Example: Sister Yapsalot says, "Such a shame about brother evil doer. I hear he has totally gone over the deep end with wine women and song". You could respond, "If that's the case it is a shame. But I don't feel comfortable discussing it. I think Jehovah would rather we dwell on the things above"

Also, make it a priority to tell yourself that all you have control over are your own thoughts and actions, not those of others. Try to spend some time determining your own thoughts and beliefs.

This won't do away with what you may have to face in the future when you leave, but it may help you feel a little more in control of the situation.

Anybody seen "Blue Like Jazz"

by cog_survivor in

i saw it on cable ondemand last night.

i had heard about the controversy it stirred up amongst evanglelical groups.

so i decided to give it a watch.. basically boy leaves fundamentalist upbringing for liberal college.

cog_survivor

I saw it on cable OnDemand last night. I had heard about the controversy it stirred up amongst evanglelical groups. So I decided to give it a watch.

Basically boy leaves fundamentalist upbringing for liberal college. Turns back on faith. Later boy regains faith.

The sad thing is that the fundies saw it as an insult but what they didn't see was the valid criticism.