Splash

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Posts by Splash

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  26

  WT opinion about anointed Christians

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  jesus said "look to the fruits" of real christians.. it is unbelievable that the wt says that new anointed christians are merely false.

  how can humans decide who is anointed and who's not?.

  how can the watchtower society say these unchristian statements?

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  Splash

  I can't wait until there are over 144,000 current partakers.
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  29

  Which current GB members are part of the "overlapping generation"?

  by Splash in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughts triggered from a comment cappytan made on a different thread:.

  cappytan the newest guy in the gang, mark sanderson, is no exception [to being a gb helper at some point].

  - w2013 7/15 p.26 a new member of the governing body"in september 2010, [mark sanderson] was invited to return to the united states, where he served as a helper to the service committee of the governing body.".

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  Splash

  Tim3l0rd Therefore it has been decided to invite several helpers, mainly from among the great crowd, to share in the meetings of each of the Governing Body committees
  

  Does this mean "mainly", or is it WT speak for "only"? I don't know.

  That same article also says
  

  *** w92 4/15 p. 31 Announcement ***
  At the Brooklyn headquarters of Jehovah’s Witnesses, some “given ones” have served for a great many years. These include mature overseers from the great crowd who have gained a wealth of ability and experience. Thus, the Governing Body has selected a few of such overseers to assist in the meetings of the Governing Body’s committees.

  To me it's unclear and in contradiction to their very precise and clear later statement from w2015 10/15 p. 3
  "SINCE 1992, the Governing Body has appointed experienced, mature Christian elders to help its committees carry out their work. These helpers, from among the “other sheep,” provide valuable support to the Governing Body."
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  29

  Which current GB members are part of the "overlapping generation"?

  by Splash in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughts triggered from a comment cappytan made on a different thread:.

  cappytan the newest guy in the gang, mark sanderson, is no exception [to being a gb helper at some point].

  - w2013 7/15 p.26 a new member of the governing body"in september 2010, [mark sanderson] was invited to return to the united states, where he served as a helper to the service committee of the governing body.".

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  Splash

  Thoughts triggered from a comment Cappytan made on a different thread:

  Cappytan The newest guy in the gang, Mark Sanderson, is no exception [to being a GB helper at some point]

  - w2013 7/15 p.26 A New Member Of The Governing Body
  "In September 2010, [Mark Sanderson] was invited to return to the United States, where he served as a helper to the Service Committee of the Governing Body."

  
  So in 2010 Mark Sanderson was one of the "other sheep" and not anointed at that time.This excludes him from being one of "this generation" since he was not a partaker when F.Franz was alive, so could not be an overlapper.
  If on the other hand Mark Sanderson DID partake prior to being a "helper", then by definition he should already (and automatically) have been classed as one of the F&DS by virtue of helping them reach decisions.
  It seems more likely that he became anointed between 2010 and 2013 in order to qualify for his promotion.

  But hold on, does this apply to more on the GB than just Mark Sanderson?

  As of 2015, EVERY member of the GB once served as "helpers" to the GB:

  - w2014 7/15 p.17-22 Losing A Father - Finding A Father
  In 1992, I [Gerrit Loesch] was appointed as a helper to the Service Committee of the Governing Body, and since July 1994, I have had the privilege of serving on the Governing Body.

  - w2006 3/15 p. 26 New Members Of The Governing Body
  Brother [Geoffrey] Jackson was made a helper to the Teaching Committee of the Governing Body.
  Brother [Antony] Morris worked in the Service Department at Patterson and later as a helper to the Service Committee of the Governing Body.

  - w2000 1/1 p. 29 New Members Of The Governing Body
  Brother [Samuel] Herd has been working in the Service Department. He was also serving as a helper to the Service Committee.
  [Stephen Lett] worked in the Service Department and was a helper to the Teaching Committee.
  Brother [Guy] Pierce had been serving as a helper to the Personnel Committee. (Now deceased)
  Since 1998, [David Splane] had been a helper to the Writing Committee.

  - w2013 7/15 p.26 A New Member Of The Governing Body
  In September 2010, [Mark Sanderson] was invited to return to the United States, where he served as a helper to the Service Committee of the Governing Body.

  
  So all of the GB were baptised but non-anointed at some point, none were anointed at their point of baptism or even before it. Why can we say this? Because the WT say all helpers are non-anointed:

  - w2015 10/15 p.3 Keep Holding Men Of That Sort Dear
  These helpers, from among the "other sheep," provide valuable support to the Governing Body.

  - w10 6/15 p. 3 United in Love—Annual Meeting Report
  Later, members of the other sheep class were appointed as helpers.

  - w06 2/15 p. 28 par. 11 Walking in the Path of Increasing Light
  ...in 1992 some of the "other sheep" received added service responsibilities. They were appointed as helpers to the Governing Body committees.

  - w95 7/1 p. 22 par. 9 Dwellers Together in a Restored "Land"
  Now, oversight of most congregations, as well as circuits, districts, and branches, has of necessity been entrusted to the other sheep. In 1992 a few of these were given the privilege of attending meetings of committees of the Governing Body and serving as nonvoting helpers.

  
  So which of these are excluded from being part of the overlapping generation?

  Freddy Franz died in 1992 which is the same year that the "helpers" arrangement came into being. My guess is that Freddy objected to it and they waited for him to die instead of try to overrule him.

  Since EVERY member of the current GB were "helpers" at some point after 1992, and since "helpers" are from the Other Sheep, this means that NONE of the GB are overlappers, so none of them are part of "this generation"
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  26

  WT opinion about anointed Christians

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  jesus said "look to the fruits" of real christians.. it is unbelievable that the wt says that new anointed christians are merely false.

  how can humans decide who is anointed and who's not?.

  how can the watchtower society say these unchristian statements?

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  Splash

  Cappytan The newest guy in the gang, Mark Sanderson, is no exception.

  - w2013 7/15 p.26 A New Member Of The Governing Body
  "In September 2010, [Mark Sanderson] was invited to return to the United States, where he served as a helper to the Service Committee of the Governing Body."

  
  

  So in 2010 Mark Sanderson was one of the "other sheep" and not anointed at that time.

  This excludes him from being one of "this generation" since he was not a partaker when F.Franz was alive, so could not be an overlapper.

  
  

  If on the other hand Mark Sanderson DID partake prior to being a "helper", then by definition he should already (and automatically) have been classed as one of the F&DS by virtue of helping them reach decisions.

  
  

  It seems more likely that he became anointed between 2010 and 2013 in order to qualify for his promotion.

  
  

  Hang on, this needs a new thread....
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  57

  Despite a 'number' of similar projects being pulled, the Chelmsford Project will continue...

  by NeverKnew in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this article suggests that there are projects being halted, but chelmsford isn't one of them.

  can someone from the uk tell me if this article was written by a reputable and known publisher?

  plans for huge jehovah's witnesses hq continues.

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  Splash

  Da.Furious Not to mention our Special pioneers got their P45 letters this week from the branch!

  Are you certain?

  Do you know if this is all SP's?
• 
  94

  What other Shenanigans can we expect to see in the next 2 years?

  by John Aquila in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  its been a little over 2 years since i left the watchtower.

  in that time the magazines have been cut, the birth of jwtv, jw-org.

  carts for preaching, removed district overseers, cut assemblies, demand all the money from the congregations, stop construction and layoff bethelites, change the format of the tmschool .

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  Splash

  I'm sure there's a long list of coming changes.

  All I can say is “What you are doing, do it more quickly.” (John 13:27)

  
  
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  7

  How intelligent people get recruited and psychologically trapped in manipulative groups like Jehovah's Witnesses.

  by Island Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iauhr-trkhy

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  Splash

  So the more you read JWN, the more you associate with and agree with the group.
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  52

  Deaf Aotearoa flooded with complaints about Jehovah's Witness church

  by OrphanCrow in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  deaf aotearoa flooded with complaints about jehovah's witness churchkashka tunstalllast updated 15:22, october 6 2015deaf aotearoa has asked the jehovah's witness church to respond to claims of a deaf information database.new zealand's deaf community is fed up with unsolicited house calls, claiming the jehovah's witness church is targeting deaf households.deaf aotearoa has received multiple complaints from around the country and says church members visited certain homes because they were aware a deaf person lived there.

  the organisation released a statement on monday, saying it was looking into the possibility the church holds a database listing the details of members of the deaf community.jehovah witness spokesman rod spinks said there was no such database and deaf people were not being targeted.the deaf aotearoa statement was posted on the group's facebook page, and received a flood of comments from frustrated people.one woman said a group of jehovah's witnesses had come to her house and asked "for the deaf person who lives here.

  " she said they refused to explain how they had her details and didn't visit her neighbours.another said church members had turned up at her work and asked for her by name.hamilton man royce flynn said he had been visited six times over the last nine months, despite repeatedly saying he was uninterested in the house calls.he said the church members were always able to sign and also brought deaf people along, which lead him to believe he was being singled out.flynn said contacted local police, who told him it was a privacy issue and referred him on to the office of the privacy commissioner.he said he had been been in contact with local labour member of parliament sue moroney.deaf aotearoa acting chief executive jill dean said complaints about the church were a recurring issue.

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  Splash

  If the latest Watchtower or Awake are suitable, there are local campaigns to visit old peoples homes too.

  I wonder if the WT will ever catch on that this information is valuable, and start to sell mailing lists.
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  8

  Need list of scriptures that Jesus is only means of salvation

  by Bonnie_Clyde in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i remember a thread not long ago with all the scriptures.

  also one that we have to be witnesses to jesus.

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  Splash

  OK, I'm really stepping into Searcher's territory here and he would do a much better job, but here's a starter for you using information he has posted previously.

  WHO SHOULD BE THE FOCUS OF OUR MINISTRY?

  For whose name would Christians be hated? (Matt. 10:22)
  By whose name were people healed? (Acts 3:6; Acts 4:10)
  By whose name were demons expelled? (Luke 10:17; Acts 16:18)
  By whose name would people receive Holy Spirit? (John 14:26)
  In whose name would people pray to God? (John 15:16)
  By whose name would people be named? (Isa. 62:2; Acts 11:26)
  By whose name would people be reconciled to God? (Rom. 5:10; 2 Cor. 5:18)
  By whose name would people be forgiven their sins? (Matt. 26:28; Acts 2:38; Eph. 1:7)
  In whose name would people be judged? (John 5:27)
  By whose name would people be resurrected (John 5:28)
  In whose name would people be baptized? (Acts 2:38, 8:16, 10:48, 19:5, 22:16)
  In whose name were people to put faith? (John 2:23)
  In whose name was Saul/Paul commissioned to preach? (Acts 9:14-16)
  For whose name would Christians be reproached? (1 Peter 4:14)
  In whose name were Christians to gather together? (Matt. 18:20)
  For whose name would Christians make sacrifices? (Matt. 19:29)
  For whose name would Christians be persecuted and killed? (Luke 21:12,16,17)
  In whose name will every knee in heaven and on earth bend? (Philippians 2:10)
  In whose name would people be declared righteous? (1 Cor. 6:11)

  
  

  WHO'S WITNESSES SHOULD WE BE (ISA 43:10)?

  Acts 11:26 - "the disciples were by divine providence called Christians."
  Matthew 10:18 - "...for my sake, for a witness to them and the nations." [JESUS]
  Mark 13:9 - "...before governors and kings for my sake, for a witness to them." [JESUS]
  Luke 24:47, 48 "and on the basis of [JESUS] name, repentance for forgiveness of sins would be preached in all the nations... You are to be witnesses of these things"
  Acts 1:8 - "You will be witnesses of me..." [JESUS]
  John 1:15 - "John bore witness about him..." [JESUS]
  John 5:37 - "the Father who sent me has himself borne witness about me." [JESUS]
  John 8:18 - "the Father who sent me bears witness about me." [JESUS]
  John 15:26,27 - "...will bear witness about me; and YOU in turn, are to bear witness." [JESUS]
  Acts 4:17,18 - ...upon the basis of this (Jesus) .... upon the basis of the name of Jesus.
  Acts 10:39 - "And we are witnesses of all the things he [Jesus] did..."
  Acts 10:43 - "To him [Jesus] all the prophets bear witness..."
  Acts 13:31 - "who are now his (Jesus') witnesses to the people.
  Acts 22:15 - "because you are to be a witness for him [Jesus] to all men..."
  Acts 22:20 - "......the blood of Stephen your [Jesus'] witness was being spilled..."
  Acts 23:11 - "..... a thorough witness on the things about me in Jerusalem..." [JESUS]
  Acts 26:16 -"I [Jesus]..choose you as an attendant and a witness...respecting me" [JESUS]
  1 Corinthians 1:6 - "even as the witness about the Christ..."
  1 Tim. 2:6 - "..what is to be witnessed to at its own particular times."
  2 Timothy 1:8 - "...of the witness about our Lord.. [Christ]"
  1 John 5:9 - "the witness God gives...the fact that he has borne witness concerning his Son."
  Revelation 1:9 - "....for speaking about God and bearing witness to Jesus."
  Revelation 3:8 - ...."and you kept my word and did not prove false to my name." [JESUS]
  Revelation 12:17 - "...and have the work of bearing witness to Jesus."
  Revelation 17:6 - "...and with the blood of the witnesses of Jesus."
  Revelation 19:10 -"...the work of witnessing to Jesus.... bearing witness to Jesus."
  Revelation 20:4 - "... for the witness they bore to Jesus."
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  36

  Child Discipline, new article to address Jackson's Royal Commission testimony

  by jwfacts in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i have published a new article at watchtower corporal punishment, as a response to the testimony that geoff jackson gave at the royal commission.

  it includes the relevant part of the transcript, along with a string of watchtower quotes to show that what he presented was not accurate, and that watchtower translates rod as a literal implement to hit children with.

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  Splash

  @jwfacts

  There's a misworded sentence in the article you might want to correct, near the top.

  It is clear from these passages that corporal punishment is specifically described, such as the from the statement that if strike with the rod, “he will not die.”
  

  You get a 'G' for this and we'll move you onto the next point in the book for next time.